Could we be the most intelligent life in the entire universe?

a reply to: ssenerawa

Like it would take soooo long to learn to build the first computer that race would have to not go extinct for probably millions of years

Wow - you like to throw "big numbers" out there. What have you based these assumptions on. Human thinking?

I can equally say something non-sensical like :

"Its taken us 10,000 years to cultivate maize and turn it into a preserved tin of food that I buy at a supermarket"

Whilst we were developing modern canning techniques and preservation, we had already succeeded in working out the steam engine - hows that for non-linear "technological evolution"


en.wikipedia.org...

French Origins[edit] During the first years of the Napoleonic Wars, the French government offered a hefty cash award of 12,000 francs to any inventor who could devise a cheap and effective method of preserving large amounts of food. The larger armies of the period required increased and regular supplies of quality food. Limited food availability was among the factors limiting military campaigns to the summer and autumn months. In 1809,

en.wikipedia.org...

The Spanish inventor Jerónimo de Ayanz y Beaumont obtained the first patent for a steam engine in 1606.[2] I

a reply to: Bedlam

Only if I had an older brother named Mandela

Brother?

Aside from lion king verse memory issues - the picture you've shown is of a girl - Unless she/he was transgendered? Or her name was Mandelena?

Now I'm really confused.

a reply to: StratosFear

IMHO we should stop and fix the problems on the planet first so we can ALL go out there and see whats to be seen.

What problems? Now you're being as vague as the OP. Does a household family of 4 make all their beds and ensure there are no leaking taps to fix before setting out to work everyday. Some will make the bed others will go straight to work.

We cannot stop exploration. The reason the New World was discovered in the age of ships was for resources and to alleviate problems back home in Europe. There will always be processes we can improve on. Its all a matter of allocation of resources; and more importantly thinking long term as to implications and potential dangers of new technologies. Ethics seems to have taken a back seat.

What does concern me more is that everyone "argues over global warming" and yet there seems to be a conspiracy of silence as to the effects and implications of Fukushima. No-one reallty wants to deal with the ecological and human destruction potential of it. Why is that?

originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: ssenerawa

I doubt it.

Also, I find it impossible that our galaxy is inside of a quark, a neutron or an atom. Nor the pieces that make up quarks. It makes no logical sense.

Actually that sounds spot on, regardless if the OP meant it as hypothetical.

Listen, electrons move around its nucleus. Just like our planets revolve around the "nuclear" sun. And just like the atom their is more empty space than physical. There is an electromagnetic charge originating from source.

Further, ...eh, never mind. That should be enough to make you wanna go hmm. As above so below and all that #. Now....if only I can see if there is a valence electron I can play with.....

a reply to: Bedlam

It's not the telepathy per se, the question is would you recognize an intelligent creature

Sort of a bee colony where no one bee is intelligent, but the hive is. A flock of birds, all individually bird brained, but together, a genius. We don't do that here on Earth, but nothing says it can't happen.

And you read hard SF (Brin)
So your "woo" holds more weight than someone else's woo...I see...

The lady doth protest too much, methinks

Because earlier you said...

Since the woo version doesn't actually exist, then no

"low vibrations", someone is said to have "good" or "bad" vibes etc. This is pseudo-scientific claptrap invented by theosophy. In the late 1800s a religion was formed by some occultists that arrogated physics terms to itself to give it a bit more credibility with the yokels. And so theosophy was born. When you hear 'energy' or 'vibration' or the like used by new agers, the godchildren of the theosophic movement, it's not a valid use of the term. It's the woo version of theosophy

originally posted by: lSkrewloosel
a reply to: ssenerawa
until we use clean energy and end world poverty then no i doubt it. only a an intelligent race would not have these factors

i think we have potentiall being the high up there. But until goverments stop supressing what we can and cant actually do then we in Limbo.

I agree with this. It's hard to claim we're "intelligent" life when we (as a species) willingly pollute our own waters, air, and soil. And we intentionally suppress food supplies to drive up their demand, regardless of the additional people who'll face food shortages because of this willful manipulation of food supplies. And we intentionally withhold medical services to people who haven't collected enough paper and other forms of "wealth". And with patents and copyrights, we intentionally withhold information & techniques that could change the lives of people around the globe.

And worse of all, we're so stupid that we hate each other over skin pigmentation, accents, body types ,and which piece of land we live on. I mean seriously, how stupid is that? An entire "nation" of people can hate and fight an entire "nation" of other people that they've never even met, just because those people live in a different imaginary boundary. Nationalism is one of the stupidest ideas I've ever heard of; as if people are superior or inferior because they were born on a specific plot of land. That's just stupid.

As for the actual forms of intelligence, who knows. There are plenty of other animals that have incredibly high levels of intelligence, like octopus. Humans are just reaching a point where we're able to recognize different forms of intelligence and self awareness in nature. So there's a good chance that centuries from now, we'll realize that other lifeforms right here are actually smarter than us in many ways.

a reply to: BrianFlanders

I am here to argue that humans are not the most intelligent life on earth and that every other species is, in fact, more intelligent than humans.

Hardly an argument, more of a broad stroke brush...

I don't see any other species that sabotages it's own existence and believes it's saving it's species by doing so.

Didn't look very hard...

ipm.ncsu.edu...

Life History -- The black widow spider overwinters as a young adult in buildings or in sheltered places outdoors. In late spring, after a prolonged courtship, mating occurs. Soon afterward the female kills her mate and begins laying eggs

Most species? If they're about to be eaten by a lion or something, that's just what happens. They're not intelligent enough to save themselves

So you have never seen them in nature shows where they try to outrun the Lion - ok

And it's actually dumb to fight nature

So you sleep outdoors naked...are you a Luddite?.....hahaha

Real intelligence would be contemplation of your environment with change and innovation that does not harm the planet, or the rights of any of it's species that live and rely on it as well. I do not see that, do you? So... no.. we are not the most intelligent species in the universe, far from it.

How depressing for the universe if we are the most intelligent given our appalling behaviour towards each other and our utter lack of concern for our planet.

a reply to: yorkshirelad

How depressing for the universe if we are the most intelligent given our appalling behaviour towards each other and our utter lack of concern for our planet.

You can wallow in depression or see the bigger picture that we've often had long periods of Peace - where co-operation and dialogue have averted violence.

Not directed at you...but there seems to be a "consensus" or meme that we are all doomed. You must ask yourself what school of thought (and who benefits) has produced this meme. It seems that the media and certain interests benefit from keeping fear at the forefront of our thoughts. Terror, calamities, war, violence.

When society fears it abrogates responsibility and allows the State to impose more draconian laws. Everyone cocooned in their "compound" or secured/patrolled estates.

The State finds it easier to manage and corral human movement, activity. thought patterns etc. You become more predictable and manipulable.

a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

Hate break it to you, but due to the nature of bedlams work, yes, he holds more weight on this topic than you. Especially if you're talking about frequencies and vibrations.

a reply to: ssenerawa

Could we be the most intelligent life in the entire universe?

As stupid as humans are? Absolutely not!

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Bedlam

Things don't become invisible because they emit some non-visible color, either. You yourself are right now emitting microwaves and IR. Doesn't make you a ghost.

I presume you haven't seen one, so how would you even know?

I'm emitting IR right now. Can't see it. Haven't become invisible, either.

a reply to: BASSPLYR

cough - WTF just WTF ???

no insult to ATS member " bedlam " - but all he has brought to this thread is basic scientific literacy

originally posted by: TheConstruKctionofLight
a reply to: Bedlam

Only if I had an older brother named Mandela

Brother?

Aside from lion king verse memory issues - the picture you've shown is of a girl - Unless she/he was transgendered? Or her name was Mandelena?

Now I'm really confused.

It's the only photo that I could find that expressed the feeling. My older bro taught me that there were more verses to "The Lion Sleeps Tonight/Weem-a-way/Mbube" than there actually were.

And it's not from the lion king, btw.

a reply to: ssenerawa

when i look at what humanity has achieved - i am awed , when i look at what " humanity " has done i am depressed

if we are " as good as it gets " - the universe is poorly populated

but - does it matter ?

IMHO - no

we have made our bed - and now lie in it - we really should try harder in certain areas

but pontificating about wether " they " are doing " better " or " worse " than us - is assanine

originally posted by: TheConstruKctionofLight
a reply to: Bedlam

It's not the telepathy per se, the question is would you recognize an intelligent creature

Sort of a bee colony where no one bee is intelligent, but the hive is. A flock of birds, all individually bird brained, but together, a genius. We don't do that here on Earth, but nothing says it can't happen.

And you read hard SF (Brin)
So your "woo" holds more weight than someone else's woo...I see...

Wow. In one place, we're talking about possibilities of life off Earth that involve forms of life we might not even recognize as intelligent, and in another, someone's invoking 'vibrations' that can't be measured and can, in fact, be tracked back to Blavatsky making # up.

It's two different things. Don't be obtuse.

I invite you to show me "vibrations" of the New Age sort. Please. I'll wait. And perhaps a nice demo of when someone is 'evil' the vibrations are "lower". And when they're all pure and good, they become 'higher'. Some way to objectively show they exist. Otherwise, all the "higher" and "lower" and "you have them" are "woo".

a reply to: ssenerawa

"Could we be the most intelligent life in the entire universe?"

For our next national leader, we'll get to choose between two of the most hated candidates of all time. I really, really, really hope that more intelligent life exists somewhere.

a reply to: ssenerawa

Humanity? REALLY? Capitol "N" Capitol "O"

originally posted by: StratosFear
a reply to: ssenerawa

Ive never considered the human being as being at the top of any food chain. There are plenty of organisms that feed off us. But in this context there isnt any other creature on this planet flying jet fighters either.

Like you say in your very next post,

originally posted by: ssenerawa
I don't think it matters technology changes the ballgame

Lol true. Nice one