Lets reverse the roles.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Right. But I KNOW, because I had a personal miraculous experience, and they are all benighted and not as special. God doesn't bother with lost causes (St Jude, though, might be able to help - he's the patron saint of lost causes).

Ok so we have admitted that your "evidence" was a logical fallacy. Now as far as personal experience, that may of course be a reason that you believe in God, but in no way does that do anything to convince someone. For example I could say I have a good personal relationship with a leprechaun. That may or may not be true. If it were true I would have good reason for believing in leprechauns but it wouldn't convince anyone else that leprechauns existed. Its simply not something that can be used as evidence for the existence of something.

As for the Bible quotes. I'll give you they show that the Bible claims there is a place called hell, but I think your on a slippery slope if your going to pretend those describe a literal lake of fire. For example hell is also called utter darkness Jude 1:13. If hell is fire how can it be utter darkness as fire emits light. Seems contradictory to me.

a reply to: beezzer

If any argument I could produce could convince me don't you think I would be an atheist?

But maybe someone will force me to come up with a new and convincing one who knows.

a reply to: ServantOfTheLamb

That's what has been bugging me about this thread. Interesting as it is.

It al comes down to faith. And faith in internal.

a reply to: ServantOfTheLamb

You win! I'm now an atheist/agnostic.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Not a very hard opponent lol

a reply to: beezzer

How do you define faith?

If we are to have the idea of the existence of gods then it has to be quantum-gods both existing and not existing at the same time. Everybody wins their argument in the final outcome. As of now. And as of then. As will be. (meaning Space-Time divided into three segments.)

a reply to: ServantOfTheLamb

Not a very hard opponent lol

Well, I never did have much to go on, really. Just blind faith, ya know.


Plus, not only am I terrified of going to hell, but YOU should be, too! Don't say you weren't warned when you actually get there.

originally posted by: ServantOfTheLamb
a reply to: beezzer

How do you define faith?

Oh man.

You don't ask easy questions.

I'll have to come back with a cogent answer to that one.

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: ServantOfTheLamb

That's what has been bugging me about this thread. Interesting as it is.

It al comes down to faith. And faith in internal.

When I was a kid I believed in Santa, now that I am a grown up I believe in God, that's just the logical evolution, everything is as it should be. Belief is part of us, denying this fact is denying the light of God that is everywhere always. I so wish you could see what I see and feel as I do, you must feel so empty inside.. I feel sorry for you, but one day I am sure you will feel this unconditional love in which I bathe every day of my life. Even when I was killing poor brown people at the other end of the world I felt loved and protected, because I knew God was with me.

I wish you all the best

The earth is old and there are some scientific facts surrounding the 3% of the Universe we understand, therefore God cannot possibly exist.

There. What do I win?

a reply to: DeadSeraph

The earth is old and there are some scientific facts surrounding the 3% of the Universe we understand, therefore God cannot possibly exist.

There. What do I win?

Back of the line, bub. The Earth is OBVIOUSLY only 6,000 years old (tops!).

I'm neither atheist or agnostic, nor am I your typical theist either so I'll play both sides.

Arguments for a God:

- Creation: The universe has to exist somehow and must have had a beginning either conceptually or literally. What is it that brought it into existence? God of course.

- Consciousness: What is this mysterious thing we call consciousness? It cannot be held or observed yet it is experienced at all times. What is it that allows consciousness to be and to persist? God of course.

Arguments against God:

- Evil: God is said to be good and merciful yet he allows all these bad things to happen here on Earth. If he is all powerful then why does he allows these things to happen. The only answer is that an all powerful entity that is good would stop these things from happening, and since those things happen that supposed entity cannot exist.

- Evidence: There is no evidence of some all powerful God who watches everything we do and deals out judgement when we die. If Good wants us to believe in him then he would show himself and since he does not he cannot exist. Books written thousands of years ago do not count as evidence or proof.

I personally believe in a personal God but do not believe he is explained in any book, at least not fully or without bias thrown in the mix. Books are agenda driven but life itself is not, it just is. God's will is free will, and since we have free will what we do is God's will, whether good or bad, black or white.

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Whoa there, bro. Pick a side. No one appointed you as the moderator.

LOL!!

a reply to: Tindalos2013

If we are to have the idea of the existence of gods then it has to be quantum-gods both existing and not existing at the same time. Everybody wins their argument in the final outcome. As of now. And as of then. As will be. (meaning Space-Time divided into three segments.)

I don't think thats quite how the quantum world works. The research suggest that on a quantum level things exist as a wave of potentialities of were your most likely to find something. The moment something is measured by an observer it gains locality from out perspective it pops into existence from nothing. This is not the only explanation though. A virtual world is also an explanation for this phenomena

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

And how are you defining God?

a reply to: beezzer

Ill be waiting.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Except that means your missing the point of the thread. The thread is not to troll the people who just brush of questions and say I have faith. The point is to sincerely try and show the other side to be correct.

a reply to: gosseyn

Troll.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Both sides have their points, I haven't appointed myself moderator or anything I'm just saying I can agree with either side on some points.