Presbyterian Church (USA) Amends Constitution to Allow Gay Marriage

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic
This is great news. I imagine, in time, other churches will follow suit. This is about love and acceptance. But it's their choice. The government cannot force them, not would any lawsuit against them be successful. That's why it's imperative to keep the separation between church and state.

originally posted by: DeathSlayer
Did you know that now it is legal for incest sex?

Where? Can you site the law? I mean, can you back up this statement?

So now gays can marry, gay partners can now have children and raise them in a gay environment meanwhile teaching the children their prejudices and hates against straight people

After reading your post, I don't think it's the gay people who are prejudiced and full of hatred... Hang onto that. It will get you right into heaven...

What's a "gay environment"?

Where? Can you site the law? I mean, can you back up this statement?

According to section 173 of the German criminal code, sexual relations between siblings or between parents and their children is forbidden. The Ethic Council voted on the matter due to a case of two siblings from the eastern German city of Leipzig. The brother and sister in question, Patrick and Susan, (pictured above), were not brought up together and first met at the age of 24 and 16, respectively. After becoming a couple, they went on to have four children.

As a result, the majority of 25 Ethics Council members, including Chairman Christiane Woopen, have called for the repeal of section 173. These 14 members voting in favor of the change believe the Leipzig case was an unjustified interference in the sexual self-determination between two adult siblings in a consensual relationship. "Of all the views that the German Ethics Council has presented, this is the first to directly touch upon a deeply-rooted taboo in society," said Woopen.

Nine members of the Ethics Council voted for continued adherence to the ban, highlighting the importance of roles within a family, which they say incest threatens to destabilize. Two members of the Ethics Council abstained from the vote.

originally posted by: NthOther

originally posted by: AinElohim

You need to edit your title...

amends (lower case) their constitution (lower case)

Thanks...

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Alternatively you can just add Their with a capital T.

*Presbyterian Church (USA) Amends Their Constitution to Allow Gay Marriage

If you clicked on this thread thinking it was about a government's constitution... well, I said I'd try to keep it civil.

Suffice it to simply ask: Did you really think that's what you were clicking into?

No not necessarily... I just think that a lot of issues with humanity could be solved with clear communication between entities.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: chadderson

I needed a laugh this morning - thanks for that post.

Homosexuality has been around in the animal kingdom AND in the human population at about the same percentages since recorded history. So no, it's not hormones and GMOs that are causing it.

Exactly... it's a learned anomaly.

Ones genes have to be susceptible to it, "weak genetics"

But I have every faith in science finding a cure.

a reply to: AinElohim

Well, let me know when they find the cure for the "weak genetics" of bigotry. That's one we really need.

a reply to: kaylaluv

Well see that's all subjective.

Maybe early scientist were called bigots too or eugenicist?

See when we observe those monkeys or very few animals in the animal kingdom that exhibit this behavior, it is not the norm across the entire population of said animals.

Now I believe in psychology and behavioral science when applied to the animal kingdom, there is alot we can learn using this method.

From observation we can gather that the homosexuality in the animal kingdom is in a minority of animals with a behavioral disorder, something which applies along the lines of the pleasure centers of the brain.

I am not too awful sure... you'll have to talk to an actual scientist about it, but that is where I learned of it from "science"

Gotta love Darwin?

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Now Playing: *with battle armaments ready

a reply to: chadderson

Homosexuality is no more or less a developmental defect than being left handed is. It is simply an anomaly that we see in a certain percentage of the population - always has been and always will be. There's nothing wrong with it. Society used to get all wigged out over left-handedness, claiming it was "of the devil". We now know that's silly. This whole aversion to marriage equality is silly as well. And it will pass.

originally posted by: AinElohim
a reply to: kaylaluv



See when we observe those monkeys or very few animals in the animal kingdom that exhibit this behavior, it is not the norm across the entire population of said animals.

A few?

en.m.wikipedia.org...

Animal sexual behavior takes many different forms, even within the same species and the motivations for and implications of their behaviors have yet to be fully understood. Bagemihl's research shows that homosexual behavior, not necessarily sex, has been documented in about 500 species as of 1999, ranging from primates to gut worms

a reply to: kaylaluv

Kaylaluv, please understand being left handed is NOT a developmental defect, I sincerely hope you are spouting that nonsense out of the role devils advocate. Developmental defects can be as serious as sterility, which permits a living organism from reproducing. Their lineage ENDS there, at the hand of god. Being left handed has NO IMPACT on reproduction. Homosexuality is on the same level as a sterile male with non-functioning testicles. A mal-functioning brain puts up the same wall as a dysfunctional organ.

a reply to: cuckooold

1999 is that some kind of ancient religious text or something?

wow sh*t behavioral science moves slow in the animal psychologists world eh?

yes lets study a worm which has no eyes and doesn't die when we cut the in two...

worms are more like humans than little monkeys anyway.

We all know how it works, it comes down to gene expression...

If a human male isn't getting the attention needed form a female by like middle school age then they're doomed.

I can put a little monkey in a cage with a vibrator and if I give him a treat every time it jonks its jonk with it, the monkey is going to get the idea soon enough.

It is against nature because sexual acts themselves are derived from the desire to procreate.

Stop reading those article that makes homosexuality appear normal damit! because it doesn't justify it in a human, specially full time (as in marriage)

a reply to: cuckooold

There is something seriously wrong with the individual if they are homosexual, this can not be denied.

Although I claim not affiliation with Christianity I view this as a ploy to garner Church attendance.

The Church knows damn well in their good old book that the institution of marriage is based on a man and a woman procreating life together.

Their whole ideology revolves around it.

originally posted by: Metallicus
While I am no longer a member of the Christian religion...I grew up Presbyterian. They are actually fairly open-minded people and I don't remember them as being judgemental in the least. Overall these are very pleasant folks and it doesn't surprise me one bit that they would make this change.

open-minded... oh you can bet your bottom dollar that they are.

I too was raised Presby until maybe 12yrs old when we changed States.

*well the school I attended anyway.

a reply to: agenda51

Hmmm... I wonder what would happen if one of your children turned out to be gay.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: agenda51

Hmmm... I wonder what would happen if one of your children turned out to be gay.

See this would never happen...

Because a proper upbringing and care given to your children prevents this abnormality.

You teach your children that drugs are ok and that we should all be sensible to the plight of the drug addict, ones children might just grow up to be a drug addict.

originally posted by: chadderson
a reply to: kaylaluv

kayaluv, if you read more critically of my post you would see that I explained homosexuality is a developmental defect. Developmental defects are caused by a multitude of things, one of them being GMO/pesticide/hormones that we are ingesting nationwide.

Science disagrees with you.

Half of everything in creation can be quantified right and wrong. Homosexual marriage is wrong, Heterosexual marriage is right. True heterosexual marriages are halfway disposed to failure, therefore half are truly successful unions and half are not. The thing is, it is a TRUE union from the get go. Homosexual unions can work, but they are not a true union to begin with, it is just a friendship. Half of all homosexual unions are bound to fail just as half are bound to "succeed".

This is pure nonsense. Right and wrong are entirely subjective things and cannot be quantified.

All paths are taking us to the same place, therefore love everyone. Truth is truth, there is no hate.

Says the guy preaching hate.

originally posted by: AinElohim

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: agenda51

Hmmm... I wonder what would happen if one of your children turned out to be gay.

See this would never happen...

Because a proper upbringing and care given to your children prevents this abnormality.

I'm sorry, but this is just too funny of a statement. You don't actually believe these words do you? I mean its been pretty much definitively proven that homosexuality isn't a choice. Oh wait, I forgot who I was talking to. I'm not surprised you'd believe something silly like this considering our past conversations.

You teach your children that drugs are ok and that we should all be sensible to the plight of the drug addict, ones children might just grow up to be a drug addict.

Drugs ARE ok. Drug addicts DO need help and shouldn't be treated like common criminals. Did you just step out of a time warp from the 1980's or something? All of your reasoning seems to be textbook rhetoric from that decade.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

There is nothing natural about human civilization...

We should all be living off the land like "quest for fire" if one wanted to use this nature thing in defense of homosexuality.

You are just totally and undeniably wrong and are being illogical!

You teach your children that "it's ok" they're normal people... next thing you know we will be teaching our children that NAMBLA members are "normal"

It's not normal... plain and simple.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

You are confusing hate with truth. It is sensed as hate because truth is difficult to digest, let alone for those who do not get their daily nutritional dosage. Show me the credible evidence where "science disagrees with" homosexuality being a completely natural defect.

Right and wrong are subjective things and cannot be quantified, this is true, yet we debate. We have made the movement to play judge and it is god's place to teach us otherwise. I give you my truths in hopes of hearing something even more positive to refine my path all the more. So from a subjective perspective, you cannot deny what I say without becoming a part of 'subjective quantitivity'. Thus, be positive and give me your input or do not partake. You are either going to be shot down, as you are now, or your perspective will enlighten me. I am seeking the latter.

originally posted by: AinElohim
a reply to: Krazysh0t

There is nothing natural about human civilization...

I never said it was... Human civilization is just a construct that we created to increase our survivability. Eventually it turned into a mechanism to boost our egos.

We should all be living off the land like "quest for fire" if one wanted to use this nature thing in defense of homosexuality.

You are just totally and undeniably wrong and are being illogical!

Wow. What a surprise you telling me I'm being wrong and illogical without any supporting evidence and reasoning.

You teach your children that "it's ok" they're normal people... next thing you know we will be teaching our children that NAMBLA members are "normal"

Slippery slope fallacy

In logic and critical thinking, a slippery slope is a logical device, but it is usually known under its fallacious form, in which a person asserts that some event must inevitably follow from another without any rational argument or demonstrable mechanism for the inevitability of the event in question. A slippery slope argument states that a relatively small first step leads to a chain of related events culminating in some significant effect, much like an object given a small push over the edge of a slope sliding all the way to the bottom.[1]

This type of argument is sometimes used as a form of fear mongering, in which the probable consequences of a given action are exaggerated in an attempt to scare the reader.

It's not normal... plain and simple.

Define normal.

a reply to: AinElohim

Acutally, everything about humanity is 'natural'. Everything we witness in creation is natural.