Gun flight: Smith & Wesson, Ruger quit California over stamping requirement

this story is interesting and thought it would be good to post

Gun fight

I know that putting a micro mark on the firing pin to mark the Bullet casings (not the bullet itself) might work for a little while. But firing pins do wear down and eventually the mark would be unreadable. And what if they pick up their cartridges and drop some that were used by someone else at the scene?

A better solution, if people want such a Draconian law, would be to place a micro chip in the base of the slug itself and when the box is scanned at the check out the computerized cash register inputs the purchasers name on the chips in the box of shells.

But as the article states these laws are not about deterring gun crime or solving them but more on outlawing handguns all together.

reply to post by ChesterJohn


No way a chip would survive the impact.

These companies need to stop supplying guns to LEO's in these crazy ban heavy states too.

If half of Americans are gun owners then the consumer market out number the police market 500 to 1. Even with gouging municipalities there is still more money to be made in non-LEO sales.

reply to post by ChesterJohn


All the reason why to collect one's brass and purchase before it is too late reloading supplies and of course a bullet mold so that one can build their own bullets.... But as much ammo now whilst you still can.... The only way to ensure but remember have two sets one for them to confiscate and one hidden in a plastic pipe with end caps buried where you can reclaim it later with addition ammo and guns....

SnF thanks for reinforcing what needs to be done to ensure future weapon power....

They've been chasing the pure fantasyland nonsense of microstamping for quite some time now... I'm glad to see some companies hitting the people behind this where it hurts. California can ill afford to lose the revenue of a lemonade stand right now, let alone a major employer and taxpaying entity. Ouch... I hope that B.S. to slam the firearms industry with more costs and more hassle was worth the direct loss to state economic health.

Talk about cause and effect ..and I hope we see much more of it. One day, they will learn to respect the 2nd Amendment, as it's not going anywhere ..and this effort to effectively backdoor the thing by making ammo too scarce to buy or guns too expensive to purchase is clever..but petty and childish.

As a reloader? I laugh at this...I really really laugh. No offense to the OP, but the same with stamping slugs. First of all, I can pop the bullet off, remove that stamp and re-seat the bullet into the casing without any issues of it being a problem to fire. It's just reworking a step of the reloading process I do with my own ammo anyway, and factory is no different but for the power used and methods for precision in measurements. (all easily duplicated to the mm with the standard reloaders set up)

...oh but chasing the fantasy of serial numbered bullets is sure enough to run firearms companies right out of business for costs. Especially when the first DUMB ideas are shown to be utter failures and so, demands to do OTHER new and expensive things will come immediately on that initial set of failures.

..and the band plays on.

I stand behind S&W, Ruger, and any other company that doesn't take this lying down. Also I hear there is a lawsuit or 2 being filed over this. However it's funny how none of them is based off how this is a circumvention of the 2nd amendment and is an obvious infringement or encroachment on said right.

Source

Two organizations representing gun makers, the National Shooting Sports Foundation and the Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers Institute, filed a lawsuit in January in Fresno County seeking to invalidate the law. The suit argues that studies have revealed too many questions about the technology and cost to require its use on new guns.

IceHappy
reply to post by ChesterJohn

 

All the reason why to collect one's brass and purchase before it is too late reloading supplies and of course a bullet mold so that one can build their own bullets.... But as much ammo now whilst you still can.... The only way to ensure but remember have two sets one for them to confiscate and one hidden in a plastic pipe with end caps buried where you can reclaim it later with addition ammo and guns....

SnF thanks for reinforcing what needs to be done to ensure future weapon power....

Yeah, you can save your brass and cast your own bullets. Heck, if hard-pressed you can even make your own gunpowder from basic minerals/materials.

The question I have is, does anyone here know how to make a primer for the bullet?

This is why in a SHTF situation, after several years even re-loaders will be out of luck.

Having worked as a Ballistic Technician in 'Quality Assessment' I will make my own bullets, and load my own ammunition.

Enough said.

Miss Nugget

reply to post by MystikMushroom


Err.. Umm... Yeah... You hit on the magic issue and I'm sure it's not lost on TPTB, either. When they finally turn to putting reloaders out of business in a serious and meaningful way, that'll be the spot to go after. No question.

You're right...It's the only part of a modern cartridge which a home reloader cannot easily create on the home tabletop, if at all.

It's also very much an explosive...in quantity. Officially I mean, for anyone not aware of that. So all they really need to do is change reportable quantity for shipping, purchase and storage of that 'explosive device' and we're screwed.

(I'm glad so many spent years going out of gun shows with dollys loaded down by cases of them. I think the supply will outlast the efforts to remove them, despite the generation it may take to settle this issue.)

I am super pro-2nd amendment,

and I am also for reasonable gun control, designed to keep them out of the hands of people who no longer, or never had the right to own a gun.

Meaning people who are legally not allowed , Criminals who have had their 2nd revoked for felony convictions, Mentally unstable, minors.

The problem is, NONE of the proposed regulations from the "anti-gun" crowd do any of that, Its almost as if the Goal is Total removal of the right to bare arms, and not Sensible gun control.

I maybe wrong, but it seems the polarization of our society, Right Vs Left, etc, Has left those in charge unable to talk about any issue in a manner worth while.

Being born and raised in Cali until a year or so ago, I have to say they are on the FAR far left of this Polarization, with laws and attitude that continue to reflect that extreme nature.

One of the many reasons I moved was their totalitarian nanny state attitude to Civil liberties and personal freedoms, This just being another example of a long line of laws that make it difficult for both the individual and corporate to function there. I was most surprised coming to Oregon because of the sheer number of small business here, where as in Cali restrictive and stupid laws make it impossible for start ups to strive.

Stupid laws like this that go above and beyond the norm in Ca are common place, they cause more problems than they solve. In emissions ca is far above even Oregon, and the nations high standard. Trying to important a car from out of state could be a night mare.

Many of the firearms FEDERALLY legal are illegal in CA, I could go on and on with stupid Ca laws that restrict rights based solely on the extreme far left that runs Ca.

reply to post by benrl


Does anybody ever get the feeling that California is a 'test state' for new laws and regulations by TPTB?

Whether it is or not, California stands out from all other states in their 'extremism'.

Texas is another state that stands out, for opposite reasons.

Hmm....wonder who's collecting and analyzing the data....?
And for what purpose

nugget1
reply to post by benrl

 

Does anybody ever get the feeling that California is a 'test state' for new laws and regulations by TPTB?

Whether it is or not, California stands out from all other states in their 'extremism'.

Texas is another state that stands out, for opposite reasons.

Hmm....wonder who's collecting and analyzing the data....?
And for what purpose

edit on 5u1111America/Chicago311 by nugget1 because: Correct spelling

Absolutely correct, From municipalities going bankrupt and looking to use eminent domain to seize land to make up for it, to their restrictive gun laws , and social welfare programs, it is a test bed for far left ideals. (as I am sure some states are for far Right)

I personally am not one that views the Constitution immutable and unchangeable with times, things like the amendment process exist for a reason (although when used its always tend to extend rights rather than take away) It needs to change for changing times, but only to incorporate those ideals forward to the now, not to remove them.

So that being said, I think our definition of “arms” is far to narrow, it needs to be broadened to any tool that can be used in “defense”. I say this because in the increasing electronic world with the potential for Mass disarmament we could face a day where the Gun is not a viable option for the purpose the constitution intended.

By limiting “Arm” to a hand gun, we neglect a real possibilities where the threat the 2nd was designed to protect against is regulated into uselessness and made less vital due to advances in technology.

The ability to jam mass communications, and use devices to inflict mass pain on protesters via infra-sound or microwave, Kinda renders a hand gun rather useless in the face of it.

Yet no one notices the fevered way they go after “electronic” Crime... Things that in the above scenario could be useful. The knowledge to manipulate IT security is under attack constantly, things like Net neutrality, Spectrum, NSA, the avenues of our future defenses and personal security are being cut off from us before we notice.

The 2nd is Under attack, and it is the shiny example that people focus on, But our 4th is all but gone, and with it the threat of being under constant watch makes the 1st tenuous at best.

They are working to take away our right to defend and have our lives be private, we are living in tumultuous times.

We have to ask ourselves why is it when ever we face Tyranny and Genocide abroad, we send the populous of those nations arms, From Nazi occupied France and the liberty gun air drops, to syria, We as a nation believe a Gun can free you from Tyranny and save you.

So why are they trying to take ours?

MystikMushroom

Yeah, you can save your brass and cast your own bullets. Heck, if hard-pressed you can even make your own gunpowder from basic minerals/materials.

The question I have is, does anyone here know how to make a primer for the bullet?

This is why in a SHTF situation, after several years even re-loaders will be out of luck.

When I was in Junior high, I was a bit of a pyro, I experimented with model rockets, frequently taking apart engines to make improvised... fire works.

I made a potato gun that had a priming system, using model rocket parts, I made a six chamber potato revolver, it exploded after 2nd firing. But the proof of concept is sound.

That was in junior high, I wonder what I could accomplish with a Garage workshop, 3d printer, and the internet now days, which is a reason for my point a few post back about information being under threat.




ETA: To this day I am still surprised you can walk into a toy store and buy a model rocket kit, all the parts right there to cause some mischief, just the launching mechanisms alone are pre made detonators.

reply to post by MystikMushroom

The question I have is, does anyone here know how to make a primer for the bullet?

You can refill primers and re-prime rimfire cartridges using a commonly available material. The instructions are available on the internet.

nugget1
reply to post by benrl

 

Does anybody ever get the feeling that California is a 'test state' for new laws and regulations by TPTB?

Whether it is or not, California stands out from all other states in their 'extremism'.

Texas is another state that stands out, for opposite reasons.

Hmm....wonder who's collecting and analyzing the data....?
And for what purpose

edit on 5u1111America/Chicago311 by nugget1 because: Correct spelling

OH... That's just the metadata... It's worthless...

geez...I'm left of center and live in California, and even I know this isn't going to work...just the fact that gun crimes are committed with stolen guns, defies the very logic of the law....I'm with the NRA on this one...this isn't even counting the other problems of enforcement of this law...it doesn't make sense.

thisguyrighthere
reply to post by ChesterJohn

 

These companies need to stop supplying guns to LEO's in these crazy ban heavy states too.

Thats what Barret did when CA outlawed the .50 BMG for civilian ownership.

jimmyx
geez...I'm left of center and live in California, and even I know this isn't going to work...just the fact that gun crimes are committed with stolen guns, defies the very logic of the law....I'm with the NRA on this one...this isn't even counting the other problems of enforcement of this law...it doesn't make sense.

edit on 24-1-2014 by jimmyx because: (no reason given)

OMG You and I agree on something!!!! Lets have a for this is a life changing moment!

Critics say tracing a bullet to a registered gun owner does little to fight crime, since criminals often kill with stolen handguns. Many believe tracing bullets was never the real intent of the law in the first place.

True!
Link
All I have to say to the Politicians in California.

reply to post by ChesterJohn


Just another reason for anyone that values their rights, to leave that crap hole of a state.

Let the Progressives have it. When it fails, maybe they will learn their lesson.

My company will not sell our products to anyone in CA, not even LE.

jimmyx
geez...I'm left of center and live in California, and even I know this isn't going to work...just the fact that gun crimes are committed with stolen guns, defies the very logic of the law....I'm with the NRA on this one...this isn't even counting the other problems of enforcement of this law...it doesn't make sense.

edit on 24-1-2014 by jimmyx because: (no reason given)

I like when I get to give you a star!

Stamping a firing pin might have sounded good at first but I think its a bad idea. Framing people would be far easier then it is now. Guns already leave special markings on casings. Not to mention anyone killing someone would just file it off.