ATS: World Reacts To Mosque Shooting; Muslim Rage

Originally posted by Thinker
I don't support killing unarmed men. But this is far less serious, then a arab pullings people off the the streets and cutting their head's off. They also killed female care worker.

Does it matter?

I mean they are both human.

Surf

FWIW

It's a documented fact that these insurgents have been using mosques for cover and to store weapons.

Apparently, when soldiers fired upon a mosque last week, this same NBC reporter (Sites) make an on-camera remark condemning the troops for shooting at the mosque. Something to the effect of "Why must they fire upon a mosque?"

Who cares, another dead terrorist as far as im concerned, as for angry muslims: nothing new there.

Would they or indeed have shown mercy in return: no, so why should we.

Originally posted by AceOfBase
......
According to the MSNBC report, Marines engaged in battle with persons at the Mosque on Friday. They killed ten insurgents and wounded five.
They then removed the weapons, treated the wounded, and left them there.

It was one of those five wounded that was killed by the Marine the next day.

Do you know why they were left there?... these insurgents were supposed to be picked up, but noone showed, probably because it was too hot to get anyone else in there to get these wounded insurgents...many of our soldiers have died because of this too in many wars, because it was too hot to get the help they needed in time...

The day before this shooting, a Marine from that same unit had died from a booby-trapped body of an insurgent....that same day another Marine was also killed by another booby-trapped body. Even injured insurgents would try to kill as many coalition forces as they can even when our soldiers have just tried to help them.

This correspondent, Kevin Site, perhaps should be left on his own without the security of our soldiers and see how long he lasts in Fallujah....

This is just more proof how liberal the media has become and what they would go through just to make "a story..." That's all this is for this kind of correspondent...a story and big break for his career...even if he has to leave out some facts pertaining the story...


[edit on 17-11-2004 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by Muaddib
This is just more proof how liberal the media has become and what they would go through just to make "a story..." That's all this is for this kind of correspondent...a story and big break for his career...even if he has to leave out some facts pertaining the story...

PLease Muaddib, explain how this is the fault of the liberal media, and why or how you think they would have 'made' this story.

Are you saying this was a fabrication?

That somehow this story was created for the anti-war bunch?

Please if you don't mind explain what you mean.

I think that it is safe to assert and possibly conclude that the media, be it on a national level or worldwide level, is definitely against the war in Iraq.
Presenting such stories as has been done by the mainstream ABC, NBC, CBS, etc., etc. media are in the same manner in which they ran like-type stories during the Vietnam War, and they were against that 'war' also.



seekerof

[edit on 17-11-2004 by Seekerof]

Originally posted by veloracer
I just wish there would be some footage of what the Insurgants have done.

That would be excellent! I wonder if the world would be 'outraged'
if it saw what the insurgants were doing -

- Mosques, hospitals and schools used as military HQ and
as ammo storeage facilities.

- Beheadings of care and relief workers.

- Execution of OUR troops who are taken prisioner!
Remember the film footage taken and shown on Iraqi
TV with OUR troops with gunshot holes in the heads?
There were a dozen of them ... lying on tables and
what have you ... it was the same time that female
soldier (can't remember her name) was taken
prisoner. Jessica Lynch I think.

- heck ... the rapes of both our female and male
soldiers when they were taken prisioner. Ask
Jessica Lynch!!!

- Insurgants faking being dead, wounded, and faking
surrender just to draw our guys out in the open and
then they kill our soldier who have stopped fighting
to take care of the wounded/dead/surrendering
enemy.

- boobytrap dead bodies to blow up.

Betchya the world wouldn't be outraged. I bet they
wouldn't care. They only get upset if they think America
has done something wrong. Heck ... they get upset
at America even when we don't do anything wrong.
I no longer listen to complaints from overseas. I just don't
give a hoot anymore. I fully support our Marines and
Soldiers who are fighting in Iraq. If they think they need
to shoot an enemy insurgant who looks dead ... just to
make sure that person is dead ... I say to them HAVE AT IT!

Originally posted by netbound
Regarding the broadcast of war, I�m leaning toward the side of letting it all hang out. Show everything; hide nothing.

Excellent idea. Why not start with Al-Jazeera and the European
TV stations and get them to broadcast the attrocities that the
Insurgants are doing? That would be a refreshing change from
the anti-American propaganda that they are pushing as 'news'.

You know what I find amusing, yes, I find this thread amusing too. Not once, has there been any condemenation for US's slaughter at the mosque of unarmed people, instead by some twist of reason, the victims have again been blamed, and some even gone as far as to justify the slaughter. Interesting, no? When an American dies, it's sick, evil. When scores of muslims dies? It's justice?

Interesting system you have here people, when the victim is attacked, it's the victims fault, and when the victim attacks, it's still the victims fault. In the other thread I also exposed, or rather re-exposed the US terrorism against the Iraqi people, everyone turned a blind eye?

Why is that? Because the hate for the enemy is stronger than your need to know the truth? I am so worried for the fate of muslims the world over. You people are exhibiting the symptoms of the German sheeps of nazi-germany, swallowing every bit of propaganda, because really, you want too. What are you going to do tomorrow? Go from house to house, and murder every muslim, or rather just wach as someone else does it? Yeah, people go ahead and let your government continue with it's neo-nazi campaign against Muslims, but remember this --- the Nazi's also killed germans too, in fact they killed more germans. You sit here poisoning your own, and others minds, against the muslims, and then moan and cry when you reap what you sow. I feel sorry for a lot of you.

[edit on 17-11-2004 by Indigo_Child]

Originally posted by BlackJackal
NBC is in bed with anything anti-american and loved showing the tape.

Ah are you saying they shouldn't have showed it?
Another coverup when America screws up?
NBC is not "in bed with anything anti-america" allthough that wouldn't be such a bad thing, looking at all the other "patriotic" news networks you have over there.

Originally posted by Seekerof
I think that it is safe to assert and possibly conclude that the media, be it on a national level or worldwide level, is definitely against the war in Iraq.

Thats a pretty enormous, and massively flawed conclusion.

Look around for yourself, there are plenty of examples online of what they are not showing, theres a hell of a lot of footage of dead Iraqis, including a whole ton of dead women and children, none of that is ever shown. This is shown because it is a very important event. Possibly a war crime being committed on camera. Its not 'just' collateral damage.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
Excellent idea. Why not start with Al-Jazeera and the European
TV stations and get them to broadcast the attrocities that the
Insurgants are doing?

Al-Jazeera does, they are usually the first place the videos of these atrocities surface, due to their proximity and connections on that side of the world.

Really, why is it that everyone insists that the media pretend that everything is fine with the War? Is 'defend the president above all else' syndrome got so bad over there that you would shun any footage at all of bad things happening in Iraq?

Its not even about pictures of dead babies, aren't pictures of US caskets also still banned? Its like people would rather see the war like a big video game, lots of footage of things blowing up and tanks driving around real fast.

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
Not once, has there been any condemenation for US's slaughter at the mosque of unarmed people, instead by some twist of reason, the victims have again been blamed ..

There has been no condemnation of the 'slaughter' because there
was no slaughter and those two men who were shot in the mosque
definately were not 'victims'.

Our marines have been subjected to fake deaths, fake injuries,
fake surrenders ... all from 'unarmed' (at the time) insurgants, only
to be shot and killed by those insurgants faking death/injury/surrender.
Our marines have been blown up by dead insurgants who were
booby trapped.

Those men in the mosque were not harmless victims. They
deserved to be shot. It was absolutely the right thing for our
marines to do. If insurgants don't want 'injured/dead' men to
be shot ... then they had better stop faking being injured and
dead just to turn around and attack our marines who stop
fighting to help them.

It's their own fault they were shot .. they weren't victims ...
and there was no 'slaughter' (except of OUR marines who
stop fighting to help those who fake injury or death).

Remember this incident. Look at these pitures.............

www.homestead.com...

Originally posted by Kano
Interesting, I could have sworn I heard a report that the killing was to 'put him out of his misery' or something. I wonder how much of the extenuating circumstances that are being thrown around now are pure spin, and how much are true.

Well it is true that the insurgents have used deceit in many forms to inflict casualties upon both soldiers and civilians. Documented cases of such deceit have been provided.

How much more real does it have to get before some believe that this shooting might have been justified?

This is ok because they do worse?

No, I think that people are just frustrated from suffering casualties simply because we adhere to a higher standard. There has to be a point where you re-evaluate your standards.

But now, with things like this and Abu Ghraib etc. The high moral position gets trashed, and the moral position is what this entire campaign is based on. Indeed what it is relying upon to work. Right or Wrong, the men behind this will need to have an example made of them, no matter the circumstances. If only to recoup some of the massive losses that events like this cause to the US' mission in Iraq.

I strongly disagree that our soldiers need to be made the example. Why do they? It will not bring back our dead, nor change the mind of the insurgents. Once again, our standards, or the way we apply them, need to be re-evaluated.

There has been no condemnation of the 'slaughter' because there
was no slaughter and those two men who were shot in the mosque
definately were not 'victims'.

How do we know who they were? Perhaps 2 of 800 civilians killed In Fuluja? or perhaps 2 of thousands of freedom fighters, who are fighting against their illegal occupation of their country? They're victims whichever way you slice.

Our marines have been subjected to fake deaths, fake injuries,
fake surrenders ... all from 'unarmed' (at the time) insurgants, only
to be shot and killed by those insurgants faking death/injury/surrender.
Our marines have been blown up by dead insurgants who were
booby trapped.

Your marines have also killed 15,000 Iraqi people, abused and molested men, women and children in prisons, and you are saying it is them who are the victims? Who says this? A nationalist, or sheep, or a man with a brain?

Those men in the mosque were not harmless victims. They
deserved to be shot. It was absolutely the right thing for our
marines to do. If insurgants don't want 'injured/dead' men to
be shot ... then they had better stop faking being injured and
dead just to turn around and attack our marines who stop
fighting to help them.

And you know this, how? Is it your belief?

It's their own fault they were shot .. they weren't victims ...
and there was no 'slaughter' (except of OUR marines who
stop fighting to help those who fake injury or death).

Yeah, it's their fault they were invaded, it's their fault that their men, women and children were molested and abused in prisons, it's their fault 15,000 Iraqi's are dead? When is it the US's fault? Never?

Whichever way you slice it, your marines and the government are the culrpits. Yet it does not seem to be their fault they are the culprits?

My post was not just taking this article into consideration, but the alarming hate I saw from so many people, not for Iraqi insurgents, not for Islamic terrorists, but for - muslims.

I ask you? Are you against muslims? I am not muslim, if that what you're thinking, but muslims, hindus, buddhists. jews. christians, iraqis, americans, blacks etc are part of my human family, and anything against them, is an attack on humanity, and that deeply affects me.

[edit on 17-11-2004 by Indigo_Child]

Originally posted by Kano
Really, why is it that everyone insists that the media pretend that everything is fine with the War? Is 'defend the president above all else' syndrome got so bad over there that you would shun any footage at all of bad things happening in Iraq?

Its not even about pictures of dead babies, aren't pictures of US caskets also still banned? Its like people would rather see the war like a big video game, lots of footage of things blowing up and tanks driving around real fast.

Great points Kano!

It is damned ironic when some of us believe that news from the Iraq war when it shows us in a bad light should be censored.

I guess that is part of the reason I brought up this topic here. And through the many posts in this discussion I have been able to see it from many points of view.

I'd like to thank everyone who contributed to this discussion.

All posts are welcome and worthy of applause.

Thank you all.

Gazz

Originally posted by jsobecky
There has to be a point where you re-evaluate your standards.

And like that, they have won.

from Indigo_Child
My post was not just taking this article into consideration, but the alarming hate I saw from so many people, not for Iraqi insurgents, not for Islamic terrorists, but for - muslims.

I don't see hate for muslims. Maybe you can point out where you see it? Now, Islamic terrorists, that's a different matter. But surprisingly, I have even seen symapathy for those murderers.

Originally posted by jsobecky
I don't see hate for muslims. Maybe you can point out where you see it? Now, Islamic terrorists, that's a different matter. But surprisingly, I have even seen symapathy for those murderers.

I am not going to point fingers at the people, there are many. So I ask you to review this thread for the use of the word "muslim" and how it has been portrayed, as well as the reaction to the killing of an Iraqi. It really should not be surprising that there is a lot of discrimination against the muslims now in society as a whole.

The people of the west just do not care about the Iraqi being killed, nor if told, want to listen. That sends a clear message.

[edit on 17-11-2004 by Indigo_Child]

Originally posted by Seekerof
I think that it is safe to assert and possibly conclude that the media, be it on a national level or worldwide level, is definitely against the war in Iraq.
Presenting such stories as has been done by the mainstream ABC, NBC, CBS, etc., etc. media are in the same manner in which they ran like-type stories during the Vietnam War, and they were against that 'war' also.

seekerof

[edit on 17-11-2004 by Seekerof]

Nope not really. Look what CNN, probably also the rest of the news networks in the US, is calling those who are fighting in Falluja: yep, insurgents. This while the vast majority of the bodies found were: Iraqi. If they are really against the war they would have called them rebels or freedom fighters. And this is just one example of biased news.

What NBC has shown is part of war, and we only see the tip of the iceberg. Of course NBC must show the footage, afterall "we are bringing democracy" to Iraq and a necessity of a democracy is free press -didn't we critize Russia for not having free press?

The outcome of the act of this marine will resonate around the world, and the effect is undesired. But don't blame NBC, it only showed the consequences when you "let loose the dogs of war". And this is what we all should realise: war is not a pleasant sight.

What this marine has done, is in my opinion a cold blooded murder.

Blobber

[edit on 17-11-2004 by Blobber]

[edit on 17-11-2004 by Blobber]