DOWNLOAD and UPLOAD to IMMORTALITY

Um... the hostile environment is a movie. ie its not real and nothing to fear whatsoever. And it has no bearing on our souls or soul survival which is inviolate!

David Bohm, a nuclear physicist that we don't get told much about in school, peered into atoms and found the plasmic screen. The film strip basically of this hologram.

The actual image is perfect, it was a lovely universal reflection of home. Over time things have gotten worse for some areas, ie, earth is in a fallen state. But some bigger souls on the grade that uses these dvd's to learn in, (different systems, different dvds, for different grades) make use of the hellish levels to really test what they're made of.

There is no mistaking anyone here, no one is ever lost, they are infinite beings, and this is just a school.

Everyone is loved forever, and precious.

This is just a sliver of your consciousness, to improve, help others, wake up and see what you're made of.

But the ones who are making train wrecks of their lives, giving into the evil asshats at the top and doing their work really really need to stop, drop and roll. They're in for a lot of shame and sorrow and a lot of counseling, when they realize that they know and love all the souls they are hurting.

I know, remember enough already.

The main points are these:

1. This is a film/movie. You are not ONE WITH IT. You enter in, and try to get out as fast as you possibly can, with friends and family. So the hostile enviro around you is not You, not something you want to hang around in.

2. You certainly never try to create AI body suits, which are just a part of the film to stick around in it for any length of time. That would be the stupiest thing going.

3. And the real zinger: you are your soul. You are not your memories. The you that is alive is not the data they are talking about trasnfering. So you wouldn't be living in those robotic forms. All that would be is a machine that has in its memory banks some of your data. It wouldn't be you. You wouldn't be immortal in this realm, ie in the movie.

You are already immortal outside the movie.

reply to post by AlienView


I want to live as an immortal.

Machines do not live. I would miss the sensory experiences.

reply to post by soficrow


I think people who want to live forever are greedy and cowardly.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


This project of "appropriating, stealing and then "downloading" our minds is already occurring through remote neural monitoring. It has long passed the experimental stages.

Take a look at this website www.mindcontrol.se... The minds and bodies of subjects are already being intruded upon- Abusively; You can also look at the "Silent Weapons Silent Wars" document, which can be found at www.stopthecrime.net... They will mind control everyone, after having obtained their personal neurological info.

I believe this is Transhumanism in the making.
See the website:www.2045.com... By 2045, they hope to have everyone mind controlled. If you look at the link, you will see all of the interest you talk about concerning "Immortality".

reply to post by AlienView


Immortality is only interesting if it is my FLESH body. However immortality cannot be attained by transfering your brain's content to a machine. The soul/spirit wont follow what was transfered which is only information not your Self. Once a specific part of the brain that link the spirit to the body is severed, destroyed, you go in the "afterlife" (which is not a specific place but a whole another world harsher than this one). If the brain's content is sent into a machine, the result will be an empty shell with your memory and the memory of what was once called "emotions". It will not be you with your free will but a mere shadow. This will lead to a dead-end and nothing else, period. (but it would be interesting to see what happens when to the "shadow" that was transfered, no doubt it would not react as expected...)

However if they can manage to create a system that would somehow allow the brain to live endlessly at 100% then i see possibility here. But the previous one? Not a chance.

I'd like to bring up an obvious point that hasn't been discussed yet:

(It also blends in with the concept of "eternal life", same thing, different paradigm.)

So by whatever means, immortality is achieved. Yeah team! What to do then?

If you think about it, immortality means infinity. You'd be alive forever. Given the fact that during our lives we experience a plethora of sensations, both good and bad, I don't think that most of us are prepared to handle immortality. Sure, it sounds like a good idea at first, but think about the repercussions. You fall in love and perhaps marry during the course of your life, then grow old and die. The OP negates that, and disrupts all we know about existence. Watching our loved ones grow old and die while we continue to live, many thousands of times over and over, well, that's grief multiplied by infinity. That's just one aspect of immortality.

In essence, it would change the way we look at the world around us. Knowing we have attained immortality, would we still pollute the planet and rape her of resources? It'd seem we'd outlive even the very earth itself, and run out of supplies, to what end? In this case, colonization is inevitable, and we would need to roam the stars.

I guess it all boils down to the definition of humanity. Humanity has no use for immortality. We simply aren't ready for it.

lets say hypothetically this is possible and i managed to program my specific characteristics and personality traits into a computer i still would not be immortal because the programmed entity would continue to learn, adapt and change long after i was gone.

As this entity learns new things and develops new personality traits it would cease to be me and take on it's own identity...

once you give something the ability to learn there is no way to put the genie back in the bottle so to speak, it will continue to learn and change until it becomes something totally different from what was intended...

hypothetically speaking of course

reply to post by Ph03n1x


EXACTLY!!! No one seems to understand that. This is why no one understands immortality. Because they've never tasted it. They don't know what it does to the soul, to never die. Same thing that happens to a toy that never breaks. It spends the rest of its existence trying to find a home that won't get tired of it.

Ph03n1x
lets say hypothetically this is possible and i managed to program my specific characteristics and personality traits into a computer i still would not be immortal because the programmed entity would continue to learn, adapt and change long after i was gone.

As this entity learns new things and develops new personality traits it would cease to be me and take on it's own identity...

once you give something the ability to learn there is no way to put the genie back in the bottle so to speak, it will continue to learn and change until it becomes something totally different from what was intended...

hypothetically speaking of course

Did I not begin by saying: "Would you like to be immortal human? Are you sure? Think about it - Immortality is not for everyone"

In fact I should add it is only for a very select few who really want to go there and really want to achieve it. And while I see some knocking the concept as you say it would be anti-soul and/or anti-humanity, it could be argued that it might be just the opposite - a new way to explore the nature of consciousness, soul, the nature of Man and the very nature of existence itself. In the realm of AI the genie is already out of the bottle - 'they' are already
experiminting with conscious artificial intelligence and if anything I'm trying to put a human face on it so that
conscious AI will end up being more human.

reply to post by AlienView

you have cloned your consciousness into your machine - the machine is a reflection of your mind and can think with your mind - And ultimately will be able to think for you - And in a very real sense will be you!

However, would humans take the risk of uploading everything and allowing the data to be abused.

Look at all of the 'itentity thefts' that occur throughout the world today.

The film "The 6th Day" springs to mind.

i have a question to the programmers out there: would you accept the possibility that 'altars' (a.k.a multiple personalities) could be set up as 'Threads' that run parallel to the main thread once the main loop is initiated ?

To those in denial, think about it. At any moment during the day, you might think 'are you happy'. Well this is just a simple 'IF THEN ELSE' statement.

i just hope to YHWH the programming isn't done in COBOL using ED80 or VI.

reply to post by AlienView


The power of Christ compells you !
I'll put my hope for immortality with him.

Ph03n1x
lets say hypothetically this is possible and i managed to program my specific characteristics and personality traits into a computer i still would not be immortal because the programmed entity would continue to learn, adapt and change long after i was gone.

As this entity learns new things and develops new personality traits it would cease to be me and take on it's own identity...

once you give something the ability to learn there is no way to put the genie back in the bottle so to speak, it will continue to learn and change until it becomes something totally different from what was intended...

hypothetically speaking of course

That's life - an endless ceaselessly evolving process. An 'immortal' must accept this. You are not exactly the same as you were a little while ago when you wrote what you just did - You must accept an ever expanding consciousness and self to be an immortal. As Herman Hesse said in his famous book "Steppenwolf" "for special people only".

Even if this were possible the Machine is a CLONE of me it is not me. Do you understand? It may think the same thoughts as me but unless I can share consciousness which has never been proven. And if I cease to exist my consciousness goes with me and the computer lives on but only as simulacra it is not me...

The only reason we humans, and I suspect the humans who insist they are aliens, can think and reason at all is because we are capable of feeling. Take away the ability to feel and you become a genuine zombie with no thoughts of your own. A machine, no matter how far advanced, is not unlike a zombie. It can never have its own personal thoughts, preferences, biases, prejudices, reasons, likes, dislikes, dreams, wishes, hopes, desires, thrills, orgasms. In short it is nothing more than a man-made, or if you insist alien-made, machine. If anyone feels the need to gain immortality through turning themselves into a machine I strongly suggest you make sure it is not subject to rust.

Shema

The only reason we humans, and I suspect the humans who insist they are aliens, can think and reason at all is because we are capable of feeling. Take away the ability to feel and you become a genuine zombie with no thoughts of your own. A machine, no matter how far advanced, is not unlike a zombie. It can never have its own personal thoughts, preferences, biases, prejudices, reasons, likes, dislikes, dreams, wishes, hopes, desires, thrills, orgasms. In short it is nothing more than a man-made, or if you insist alien-made, machine. If anyone feels the need to gain immortality through turning themselves into a machine I strongly suggest you make sure it is not subject to rust.

That is a reasonable argument but how can you be sure of the limitations you place on machine consciousness. In a very limited sense the machines of today calculate and make decisions based on calculations - Who are you to say that one day in the future it won't have "have its own personal thoughts, preferences, biases, prejudices, reasons, likes, dislikes, dreams, wishes, hopes, desires, thrills, orgasm"? Machines are reflections of human will and human desire and as the programming advances and becomes more sophisticated 'all' human feelings and emotions will one day be reproducible - You don't like that idea - it bothers your human ego, but it will happen. If I told you 200 years ago that the human voice could be recorded almost perfectly and transmitted through the air at close to the speed of light you might think I was crazy - Well my human friend I'm telling you that one day human feeling and emotion will be reproducible through mechanical reproduction so as to be indistinguishable from its biological human source - Can't wait to see the movie - better than the Matrix they tell me!

reply to post by AlienView


Nothing really bothers my human ego.

As to machines offering humans an outlet into immortality:

The day it happens as you so determinedly assure me it will then on that day I will believe it.

There was an episode on Joe Rogan Questions Everything - Artificial Intelligence that spoke of exactly this. You can view that episode here:

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Greedy, yes - there is so much more I want to do, experience, see, feel. Cowardly, don't think so - I am also intrigued by and curious about the death dimension(s). Actually, I'm kinda glad that I don't have to choose which path to take, and grateful I have the opportunity to enjoy sensory life.

This is science and not something based on fairy tales like souls. The "soul" if you will is your collection of memories, which is what makes you, you. Of course, there are a few other reasons why you are who you are and it has to do with the chemical balance in your brain as well as the development of the brain itself, like being more of a thinker than a doer etc...

I think though that OP needs to reconsider the available technology within 40-50 years from now which is about when a lot of us will die. In that time-frame, there's a possibility that a super computer might be able to hold the information of our brain, and if that's the case then brain transfusion to machine will be expensive like you wouldn't believe. I don't think you would necessarily require to have a clone of yourself if you transfer your memories digitally which recently, digital quantum lasers have become a reality. So it's safe to say that you would still be you but in electronic form (which is no different than your physical form IMO).

The question is, is what happens to you afterwards. Do you spend your time in a virtual world, or are you just stored on a cluster of hard drives, waiting to be reconfigured into a new human host or robotic body? What happens if you don't have the money? Can you sell yourself to a corporation as a slave with new skills implemented in you until you work off your debt? (part of a premise of a book I'm writing btw) Do you still have the same memories, in other words would have the organization / corporation / government that held you hostage for a period of time injected any false memories, removed memories, or just overwrote your personality to match their best interest? Will you like things that you didn't like before, ie: if Pepsi paid that company so that you would be addicted to their product.

But say you are normal, and you're into your new shell, you're not exactly immortal, you have just transferred into a new body. Should you die in that body you are dead. If your memories have a copy on a hard drive, then those memories are no longer yours. The only way you could remain you is through quantum science and you cannot have your memories cloned, otherwise whatever remains is a clone of you, meaning you die, you won't be alive by just the mere duplicate, instead that will be a copy of you.

But let's get back to what is happening right now. Our bodies at most are 12-years old since that is the oldest part of our body. Everything about us regenerates and gets replaced by something new. The brain we have now isn't the brain that we were born with, not even close. To claim that we are still the same person as we were yesterday, or the year before or even a decade ago is preposterous and don't even start talking about quantum mechanics and our poor little human bodies which is constantly different.

But fear not, if you die today, you can be cryogenically frozen until whenever you tell them to revive you so long as the technology ever becomes available. The cost for this is around $25,000USD. Not bad =) My wife and I will try to do that if we're able to because even though the chance of being revived is slim, it's better than just letting $25k/person follow you to your grave, which it doesn't.

It's a depressing thought, almost as depressing as knowing you can never truly touch anyone, but I think that anyone under 35 is really lucky as long as there isn't a huge war or civilization isn't thrown backwards for some reason. Anyone above that still has the option to be frozen so, I think that anyone alive today can be considered lucky if they want to try and live for hundreds of years.

For now though, nothing is guaranteed and no matter what path is taken, something can go wrong so enjoy your life for what it is right now because it's not the quantity of life that matters but the quality of it.