D.C. Council votes to Force Walmart to pay "living wage"--50% over minimum wage.

before i crash out. another comparison and i will use my brother again. not moving up the ladder as fast as i did.
i used to wonder why.
well, i mentioned classes i went to. every so often the foundry puts on classes for FREE. i have gone to them. there were 2 classes one summer that i remember trying to get him to go to. he didnt. the classes were given on a saturday. it was both of our days off those days. beautiful days too.
i was at class. he went to the beach instead.
then come monday, who calls off cause they have a 'bad sunburn'? yeah. my little bro.

its a wonder why people with that attitude dont move up as much or as fast. when the jobs get posted and people bid, is the company gonna look to promote people that try and learn the industry or go to the beach?
these same people complain when they are broke and want more hours but when they lay mandatory OT on us they complain about that too. when they ask for sunday volunteers they never toss their name in the box.

i volunteer. i dont complain about the mandatory OT.
i dont partcularly like when they wait till thursday at the end of shift that i have to work 8 hours on saturday and/or 4 hours on sun.
when you have people that depend on you financially you do what has to be turn and it does pay off.

i bid on better jobs and got them. i work 1st shift while he still has to start at 3am. i decide now if i work saturdays or not.

all that said, i did lose a finger. i am an extreme pain all the time now.
and with that said, i have a family. i have responsibilities to them.
people can do better with the proper motivation.
entry level or transition jobs are not going to allow people to support a family on 1 income.

like i said, when they get tired of $8 an hour for 28 hours a week i know a place that hires all the time. most wont do it though. most wont even try.
i always thought walmart paid fair wages for the work that was required.
no skills to speak of required. air condition in summer. head in winter.... what exactly do they expect?

when i would come home from work at my original position, i would be sitting on the couch hours after my shower and metal would literally come out of my eyes. looked like i was crying metal.
all of a sudden walking around the electronics department selling people ps3 goodies in the climate controlled building dont sound all that bad...... for some

i might lose another finger but im gonna risk it.

Originally posted by Metallicus
Here's a fact for all of you that think this is a great idea.

If you force businesses to pay a living wage the prices go up to cover those new increased cost and all of a sudden the new living wage is too little again. You can't legislate a country into prosperity.

Economics 101.

Except that's not true at all. Here's some purchasing power statistics of minimum wage throughout the years:
1950
Minimum wage: $0.75 per hour
Gas: $0.27 or 22 minutes
Movie ticket: $0.48 or 38 minutes
Rent: $42 or 56 hours

1960
Minimum wage: $1 per hour
Gas: $0.31 or 19 minutes
Movie ticket: $0.69 or 41 minutes
Rent: $71 or 71 hours

1970
Minimum wage: $1.60 per hour
Gas: $0.36 or 14 minutes
Movie ticket: $1.55 or 58 minutes
Rent: $108 or 67.5 hours

1980
Minimum wage: $3.10 per hour
Gas: $1.25 or 24 minutes
Movie ticket: $2.60 or 50 minutes
Rent: $243 or 78 hours

1990
Minimum wage: $3.80 per hour
Gas: $1.13 or 18 minutes
Movie ticket: $4.23 or 1 hour, 7 minutes
Rent: $447 or 118 hours

2000
Minimum wage: $5.15 per hour
Gas: $1.49 or 17 minutes
Movie ticket: $5.39 or 1 hour, 3 minutes
Rent: $602 or 117 hours

2010
Minimum wage: $7.25 per hour
Gas: $2.78 or 23 minutes
Movie ticket: $7.95 or 1 hour, 6 minutes
Rent: $789 or 109 hours

There's some actual data for you. The minimum wage has not kept up with the cost of living. If you need a reason for this, it's because a relatively lower wage is more profitable for the company. For wages to be relatively the same as they were in our parents generation, wages would have to double without rent, food, or utilities increasing.

Originally posted by Gazrok
reply to post by SearchLightsInc

 

I disagree, i think governments should work for the people, not the businesses.

I do too, but what's next? Do we make laws that just target Disney World, because they too are evil? Do we make a law targeting Chik Fil A because their founder is ultra-religious? The laws have to apply equally to ALL, not just singling out. Our legal system is based on establishing precedents. This sets a VERY dangerous precedent.

I'm no fan of Walmart, but I'm also no fan of government telling any business that the law is different for one group than for others.

I do see the point you're raising but i simply cannot stomach waiting for good things to happen across the board. Someone has to take charge and it seems it's going to have to happen at a local level rather than national. Its inconceivable that a bill would be passed through congress to implement a living wage, they own government, corporations have that boxed off.

However, they dont have as much of a hold on local governments it seems, so yes, i'm all for the small dog to start biting at their ankles, even if just to give them a run for their money. There will always be people having to work these kids of low paid jobs, its about time they got paid like they're human beings. Not everyone can have a well paid job, ask the graduates that cant find work!

You know the system is fracked from top to bottom and wages are a huge issue when it comes to WHY.

Originally posted by Garkiniss
Reading... it's both fun and mental.

If Wal-Mart wants to pitch a bitch and feel singled out over this move, then that's fine.
Cry me a river. A company that rakes in 400(+) billion in profits each year can afford a nice violin to play me a tune.

Hahahaha!

They'd be to cheap to buy an expensive one

to all the people saying if you dont want to attempt to live on an unlivable wage you should simple deveop some job skills things really arent that simple look how many college graduates are out of work at the moment or flipping burgers (and were not just talking about english or history majors)
the fact is regardless of whether or not you have job skills there are only a certain number of positions that need to be filled if you have ten people with the same credentials applying for five spots you are only able to hire five of those people regardless of the fact that all of them were qualified and deserving of the same pay
and this is increasingly the case as our technology and efficiency continue to increase you need less people to do more work and have fewer positions to fill in relation to the population and therefore have the ability to pay exceedingly low wages because of the increase in competition for those jobs
and because of the lower pay for fewer workers the tax rate is also going to have to raise to compensate for the fact that fewer people even have the ability to pay taxes and the problem will continue to exacerbate itself

the real problem is that our world and way of life has changed drastically in the last several hundred years but we continue to hobble along using the same outmoded system of economics
its reaching point where hobbling a long is no longer an option it simply will not work for the modern world any longer
we need to completely change the way we look at economics or we will see disparity on a scale that is absolutely unimaginable

Originally posted by macman
reply to post by Tazkven

 

So you are a Progressive then, and believe that Govt is here to interject in all facets of life.

Nope, that is not what the Constitution states.

I never said or even implied anything of the sort but you can label me how ever you wish, I care not.

If you insist on labeling me let's go for compassionate or understanding ...

Hell, you can even call me poor. I grew up poor, in a trailer park ... the epitome of white trash you might say. I clawed my way out of disaster many times, lost everything I owned except what fit in my truck and gave me room to sleep, been homeless, slept in bathrooms at public parks in the winter, hitchhiked across the country, slept under bridges, went unbathed for weeks, without food or water for days, left walking the streets with nothing except the clothes on my back. Things that would leave many people crying on the floor in the fetal position or eat a bullet.

Always came back fighting, more determined ...

Never, not even once did I rely on anything from anyone, including the government. No food stamps, no medicaid, no section 8. Nothing has ever been handed to me, I earn what I have, the hard way. Clawing, scrapping, blood, sweat and tears.

I earned my Journeyman license when I was young, in Industrial construction. Not that it did much good for me when Construction jobs fell through or when the mass exodus from this country started so businesses could make more profit using slave labor overseas. Turning this country into a service industry.

Someone should have the responsibility to make sure people are treated fairly, Someone should make sure someone does not take advantage of people others deem "unworthy", right? If not the government then, who? Not you, for sure. You want to take advantage of people you consider beneath you. You believe those people are here to "serve" your needs. You want to complain about how much a person "costs" you. You believe those beneath you deserve a "boot in the neck".

Here I stand, looking at you and I see the mindset of men who is making this country what it is today. A festering mess of greed, selfishness and ugliness, all so that the numbers in your bank account are more than someone else's. It disgusts me, to be honest.

What this Country needs to right itself is for those able to reach a hand down and pull up our fellow man, not "put a boot in their neck" ... why is it all business owners sound Fascist? They want their rights afforded to them by the Constitution but believe those beneath them deserve less.

I fought my way to where I am today, I even have a business license and I can guarantee people I employ will never rely on government assistance to survive, can you say the same?

Originally posted by Tazkven

Originally posted by macman
reply to post by Tazkven

 

So you are a Progressive then, and believe that Govt is here to interject in all facets of life.

Nope, that is not what the Constitution states.

I never said or even implied anything of the sort but you can label me how ever you wish, I care not.

If you insist on labeling me let's go for compassionate or understanding ...

Hell, you can even call me poor. I grew up poor, in a trailer park ... the epitome of white trash you might say. I clawed my way out of disaster many times, lost everything I owned except what fit in my truck and gave me room to sleep, been homeless, slept in bathrooms at public parks in the winter, hitchhiked across the country, slept under bridges, went unbathed for weeks, without food or water for days, left walking the streets with nothing except the clothes on my back. Things that would leave many people crying on the floor in the fetal position or eat a bullet.

How's that american dream working out for you? Im sorry i had to comment, I dont think some people understand the reality for bottom % of americans.

Always came back fighting, more determined ...

Never, not even once did I rely on anything from anyone, including the government. No food stamps, no medicaid, no section 8. Nothing has ever been handed to me, I earn what I have, the hard way. Clawing, scrapping, blood, sweat and tears.

I earned my Journeyman license when I was young, in Industrial construction. Not that it did much good for me when Construction jobs fell through or when the mass exodus from this country started so businesses could make more profit using slave labor overseas. Turning this country into a service industry.

Someone should have the responsibility to make sure people are treated fairly, Someone should make sure someone does not take advantage of people others deem "unworthy", right? If not the government then, who? Not you, for sure. You want to take advantage of people you consider beneath you. You believe those people are here to "serve" your needs. You want to complain about how much a person "costs" you. You believe those beneath you deserve a "boot in the neck".

No wonder half the world is starving with that kind of mentality.

Here I stand, looking at you and I see the mindset of men who is making this country what it is today. A festering mess of greed, selfishness and ugliness, all so that the numbers in your bank account are more than someone else's. It disgusts me, to be honest.

What this Country needs to right itself is for those able to reach a hand down and pull up our fellow man, not "put a boot in their neck" ... why is it all business owners sound Fascist? They want their rights afforded to them by the Constitution but believe those beneath them deserve less.

I fought my way to where I am today, I even have a business license and I can guarantee people I employ will never rely on government assistance to survive, can you say the same?

Bravo sir! Well said!

Originally posted by Carreau
reply to post by Tazkven

 

I've already explained in the very first page of this thread that the very government entity that is forcing a private business to pay their employees a min wage (that is ABOVE the one set by law) that the government itself doesn't do. There are right now DC city employees making less than $10 an hour. There are other private businesses (Retail) right now in DC paying their employees the law mandated min wage of 8.25.

Why are you not screaming about this but only angry about 1 business? Oh the the employees making min 8.25 an hour also have union dues removed from that pay that Walmart employees don't have to.

And those businesses don't employ 30% of the population! The government employs nearly 40%... and guess what??? Their minimum wage is HIGHER than the mandated minimum wage! How? Well first of all, try to find a job aroun here hiring at pay grade GS-1. You won't find one. The lowest that you MIGHT see is GS-5. Secondly, government jobs pay an additional locality pay of 24.22%... just for working in this area! All they are asking is for the second largest business in this area (government itself being number 1) to pay people enough to make it... something that they do themselves. Nothing wrong iwth that.

Originally posted by Carreau
reply to post by Tazkven

 

I just read every post in this thread by you all 2 pages worth and there wasn't a single sentence about the min wage union employees of other businesses in DC or anything about DC city employees making less than the Walmart mandate of 12.50. If you posted something about this in another thread by all means post it here and now.

Otherwise your a hypocrite and unworthy of continued debate.

Lets calculate here:

Government pay grade GS-5 Step 1 in the DC area salary: $34,075.00. OPM.GOV DC Area Pay Scale

26 pay periods per year: $1310.58/mo.

80 hours per pay period: $16.38/hour is what the government pays as minimum wage for this area!

I was curious about absolute minimum wage for the government employee in the DC area, so let me post my results:

Government pay grade GS-1 Step 1 in the DC area salary: $22,115.00. OPM.GOV DC Area Pay Scale

26 pay periods per year: $850.58/mo.

80 hours per pay period: $10.63/hour is the absolute minimum the government can pay one of it's employees in the DC metro area.

Again... try to find a GS-1 position. You absolutely will NOT be able to find one. The only person that I've ever heard of being hired as a GS-1 has been with the government now for 31 years. Out of HS people with no skills are hired as GS-5 or 7. College grads can expect GS-9 or 11 in most cases. Hell, I bet the contractor that picks up my trash and vacuums my office is paid equivalent to GS-7 or more. And you think Walmart employees here should be paid minimum wage only to have the government pay most of their rent and give them food stamps???

Originally posted by OpinionatedB

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000

Originally posted by seagull
Many of you don't seem to realize, or are ignoring...

Minimum wage is a starting point at most, maybe even all, jobs. Starting. It goes up from there, if you can be bothered to stick around.

Stick around you say? That requires work ethic, character and the ability to see something through, day after day in doing something the vast majority of people don't want to do and need to be paid to do.

That's yucky stuff there. Earn a higher wage? EARN a higher standard of living? What? You hate poor people or something? They must have all that with a path to a corner office by the end of their first month or 2nd, at the VERY latest or it's off to churn into another job that better appreciates their....umm...ability to stand upright, I guess.

S&F. Excellent point.

Yes, I agree, people should earn their way in this world, not have it handed to them on a silver platter. Those who get everything handed to them and never have to earn it never once learn to appreciate what they have.

In my life I have gotten to the top and fell back to the bottom again, and the day I cant earn another place at the top is the day I just gave up and quit..... and I am no quitter!

Quitters never gain anything.... and they never experience life to its fullest.

And to the people who say you have to spend over a thousand dollars a month in rent etc... I pay 400 for a 1 bedroom all utilities paid. No, its not government subsidized, and no, its not the taj mahal.... but its mine and I have certainly seen worse... and its not going to be forever either because I will earn my way in this world to gain something better....

And you won't find a $400.00 1 room apartment in DC period. You might pay $400.00/mo out of pocket after the government pays more than half of your rent though. So let's add that you're also paying (through taxes) for these minimum wage Walmart workers residences too! All because the corporation won't give them enough money to live without it.

Originally posted by Carreau
reply to post by Tazkven

 

I just read every post in this thread by you all 2 pages worth and there wasn't a single sentence about the min wage union employees of other businesses in DC or anything about DC city employees making less than the Walmart mandate of 12.50. If you posted something about this in another thread by all means post it here and now.

I also haven't brought up the waitresses in DC making less than minimum wage, either ...

I don't have to jump through your hoops, pal.

Originally posted by Carreau
Otherwise your a hypocrite and unworthy of continued debate.

Oh no!

reply to post by CardiffGiant


My Hats off to you, foundry work is the most difficult job there is. In the area I used to live, there was a foundry that pretty much supported the whole town.

The butcher at the grocery worked in the foundry once, for 3 days. That was it, the heat was too much for him and on his 3rd day he passed out from it and cracked his scull open on the concrete.... he never went back, happily....

My son worked in the foundry for about a month, maybe two... and he decided that "walmart" with its air conditioning was much better, and happily took a job making less pay....

I also know men who did foundry work their entire lives.... its a @#@# to say the least....My hats off to anyone who can do it.


And your right, they are always hiring and no one wants to do it.... but the jobs are always there!

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by benrl

 

I'm sure all that political debate will be very meaningful to the Walmart checkers and stockers told their job has been eliminated due to the store closing.

This is an inevitable result of corporate dominance destroying small businesses.

Walmart moves in, ten small stores shut down, people they employed are out of a job, the owner no longer has a business, those ten stores are no longer paying taxes, profits the corporation make are then funneled out of the community when they would otherwise have remained to circulate.

If a Walmart closes, the reverse can happen, those ten smaller stores can once again return, employing more people, paying more tax than Walmart does, paying higher wages to their employees, and without funneling their profits out to an off-shore account - the profit circulates in the community far more than it would with a corporation only returning some of that profit through very low pay to employees.

What Walmart and others have done to local economies is disastrous, but it's basic economics. It should never have been allowed to happen in the first place.

For a community and local economy to survive you HAVE to have small and local businesses, paying local taxes, employing local people on a fair wage, and with a greater level of that profit circulating within that community. The moment you invite a corporation like Walmart in to replace those smaller businesses you have a massive extraction of wealth from that community, with all profits being sucked out to avoid taxes, and only a small fraction of those profits returning to that community.

This is very basic mathematics.

Originally posted by pavil
reply to post by Garkiniss

 

I hope you will go after Government with the same zeal
Govt Projected to make 50B off Student Loans

According to the Congressional Budget Office's latest projections, the federal government projects a record $50-billion profit on student loans this year. Exxon/Mobil made $44.9 billion in 2012, according to published reports, making it the most profitable company in the country. And if Congress doesn't stop rates on some loans from doubling on July 1, that profit will rise more, up to an additional $21 billion, a recent report found. However, there are those who claim the projections don't accurately reflect risk taken by the government and the profits are much smaller.

Much smaller in Governmentese means "only" 34.3 BILLION if you needed translating.

And we wonder why our Country is so messed up...........

I've already addressed the fact that the government pays its employees in the DC metro a livable wage. Furthermore the government will need that extra $50 Billion to send out to Walmart employees to supplement their rent and healthcare.

reply to post by Rocker2013


People support Walmart when they shop there. People. Walmart in and of itself does nothing but provide people another choice. It is the people who run the small businesses out, by not shopping there. If you do not want a Walmart in your town, simply do not shop there. If there weren't people shopping there Walmart would close....

Originally posted by macman
reply to post by SilentKillah

 

You still didn't answer the question though. If Walmart already has a customer base where they are at, and they are profitable there, why add another location, which will double the cost of doing business.

Makes no sense.

I wouldn't expand in that situation.

I'm not truly sure I understand what you're asking, so I'll attempt to answer what I think you're asking.

Walmart (as stated in this article) stated that they want to build more stores.

The retail giant had linked the future of at least three planned stores in the District to the proposal. But its ultimatum did not change any legislators’ minds. The 8 to 5 roll call matched the outcome of an earlier vote on the matter, taken before Wal-Mart’s warning.

But this bill wants them to pay their employees more. This means they probably won't build those other stores and others are suggesting that Walmart will move away from the area. If they do move away from the area, people in DC aren't going to follow the store and start going 5 miles away to Walmart. Instead they'll start going to Giant, and Safeway rather than paying more in bus and train transportation in addition to 30+ minute travel times to travel into MD or VA Walmart.

Target then has the upper hand in DC and would likely buy, renovate, or outright build a new store near the closed Walmart to gain customers in that area. Those people that were out of work would seek employment there. The customers would start shopping there. And Walmart loses it's hundreds of thousands of customers. That's all I'm saying. Walmart will not end the society in DC, nor will it change the fact that low income people don't have the money and time to go to MD and VA to shop.

reply to post by SilentKillah


DC Has a minimum wage that is $1.00 an hour higher than where I am. And you CAN find inexpensive apartments anywhere if you look. No, wont be the best part of town, but you can live there cheaply enough....

www.apartmentcities.com...

Found this interesting:

reply to post by OpinionatedB


thank you good sir.
i just think that some out there dont know what some work entails. i dont look down on anyone. working for your pay is respectable, no matter what.
im just trying to make the point that there are jobs out there and you dont need to be a college grad to get them. you can start at the foundry with little to no skills but you bet you will be on the low end of the pay(which here is starting $12 an hour and the work will be the worst in the plant(which is pretty bad)....
but, the work/money is there.
you think people would want to leave the 'cushy' walmart to shovel sand in the pits all day? 10-12 hour days? i bet not. they will complain about the lack of hours/pay at walmart but they will turn down 600 a week to START. guarantee.

i got 'lucky'..
i brought skills to the job and i gained some while working there so far as the foundry goes i have a good position. good pay. good shift.

some guys have been there 15 years and make less than me. they are in the physically hardest positions but with the lowest responsibility. still start out at more than walmart would pay after years of service.
those guys that i talk about dont have a desire to move up the ladder for their own reasons. they still make good money though.
in the few years i have been there i learned a lot. skills that are marketable and i could take to other places.
you just have to want it.
i dont blame people for not wanting to work there untill they start to complain about what they make versus what they do and the work environment. if they could see the inside of the foundry or be a fly on the wall during operations they would change their tune.
i make about $9 an hour more than the average walmart employee. IF they get a bump in pay i want mine to go up accordingly. i feel i earned it.
injuries happen anywhere but if i showed you a pic of my finger you can bet that done happen on the cash register.
again, people depend on me so i do it. maybe they should get the same attitude.
thanks again. i do appreciate it

reply to post by Tazkven


That was a very cute rant, but you failed to state anything in it really, that means much of anything.

You want more Govt to control more of life.
Also, please show me where in the Constitution it states that the Govt is there to take care of people, as stated b you.