Bill Maher "(2nd Amendment) just as obsolete as the 4th"

HBO's Real time June 7th, 2013

In a single sentence, Bill Maher managed to call not one but two crucial elements of our freedom and privacy obsolete...remarkable.

I'm a big fan of Bill Maher's intellect and talent, but loathe his propaganda since Obama. That same wit, humor and ability to concisely drive a point home while making your opponent look foolish was something I could appreciate. I made the mistake of believing he would be just as tough on anyone doing despicable things, apparently that's reserved for "The Right". When he made this statement, no one knew how to react, I did, outrage.

It's been a bad week for amendment fans in this country, from full spectrum wire tapping to swabbing, the Police State has now been officially announced publicly, which soon will make it nice and legal. No more sneaking around doing their thing, police and alphabet agencies can do it all right out in the open, right in your face, smirking at your disapproval.

We knew the justification echo chamber was coming, but it usually takes a few days to get their message together, Bill managed to get things going early but I got the feeling his audience was left confused by him, even he said while going against his own rationale, "I'm not the people you think I am". I agree Bill, the occasional light criticism of Obama for egregious behavior isn't fooling anyone any more. You are pure propaganda.

My head is spinning over all this, actually witnesses first had the dismantling of the very things that made America great. How people can justify this in any way, shape or form is literally un-American. The fear card is trying to be played and aside from serious Democrats and old ladies, NO ONE I know can even believe this is be admitted to, much less actually happening. Well no surprise to many of us here, but the general public is once again being told how to react and feel about the complete destruction of their privacy and freedom by TV personalities and sadly, it's always been far too effective.

Our grandchildren will wonder why we didn't stand and fight and how we could just let this happen. I now understand how Germans must have felt watching Hitler, little by little, install the mechanisms to make the Reich effective.

reply to post by Paschar0


And to think that is still people out there than calls to ask what freedoms have we lost, I guess these people never really understood how a govenrment works, used to be for the people and by the people not for corporations and corrupted elite, and they fail to really really understand the constitution or even taken the time to read it.

what a pity.

Very soon we will start looking so bad when it comes to tyranny and erossion of constitutional rights that Nazi Germay will look like a walk in the park and no, no the Jews will not be targeted, this time is just you me and any decent hard working American citizen just for voicing how disatsfy they are with our system of govenrment.

reply to post by Paschar0


So now it's not just the 2nd amendment and right to bear arms that is considered obsolete, but our protections against unreasonable search and seizure? As the 2nd goes, so go the rest. This was said over and over by people while so many just replied by making comments about 'that far right wing and their love for guns'.

It really sucks to be proven right sometimes. What rights go next? The 5th? 1st? The 8th is a laughing stock of a right and history already. The 6th also seems to be a matter of opinion and attitude of the State as to how or whether it's followed at all.

Well.. Fundamental change. We're getting it alright. For all we've done wrong in life, we're getting everything that's been asked for.

reply to post by Paschar0


I used to watch Bill Maher a long time ago, before Obama, but I quickly realized the same thing you did - which is that he doesn't "fight the good fight" unless it's against "the Right". He is completely biased and has been for a long time and I have zero respect for him today after the despicable things he's said and done.

It's only a matter of time before our Republic falls apart. The democratic machine has taken over, and once that happens as it has, the country falls apart. Every democracy in history has suffered the same fate. Once the people realize that they can elect those who will hand over the keys to the Treasury, they realize that they can have anything they want, so what then becomes the point of contributing to society when all you have to do is wait for the mail to get your free money and free food? How does that encourage every citizen to be a productive part of building a great society and nation? It doesn't, which is the intent. Every democracy that falls is followed by tyranny and eventually, monarchy, which is right where we are headed.

The sad part is that we're running out of options to fix the problem now that any dissenting citizen can be labeled a "domestic terrorist" for siding with freedom and liberty, or for believing in our Founding Fathers and fallen heroes. I spend every day wondering what I will have to do someday in the future to protect my children from what is to come.

S&F OP.

~Namaste

reply to post by Paschar0


To accurately describe Bill Maher would welcome a swift action from the site moderators.

Let it just be said that if this is the position of the Obama administration (I won't insult the left by categorizing his actions as an indicator) then the line has been drawn.

For those that endorse, approve of this administration, you have made your position very clear.

There is an "us" vs "them".

Pick a side. Hurry.

reply to post by Paschar0


Heres is the video. Fast forward to 8:15 to see the most relevant part.



www.youtube.com...

Well he admits that the 2nd and 4th amendments are up for debate, so what would he say about the rest of them, say the 1st? He makes his living being a provocative political commentator, so what if he was arrested or forced off the air because of comments he makes on his show that were against the government. I am guessing he would then have a serious problem with trampling on our amendments.

Maher is a joke. He is rooting for his team and will defend them no matter what. I do think it is fun to watch him contradict himself on a constant basis though in an attempt to justify his team.

He says at one point in this clip that he usually doesn't believe in slippery slope arguments, but then finishes by saying that if one amendment is up for debate the others should be too. Isn't that a slippery slope?

And isn't this what many of us on here have been saying forever now? When we said, if you go after the second amendment, the others will be next. And the anti gun crowd said "No, that would never happen".

It looks like the "tin foil hat" crowd was right again.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Doesn't it show that in the modern age the 2nd amendment does precisely nothing to prevent tyranny? The 2nd amendment was happily in place while the legislation to allow this was voted through.

It'll be in place while they carry it forward too.

Maybe they'll be some temporary outrage, maybe the Democrats lose the next election and you get a Republican who continues exactly the same policies under different names.

You have neither choice nor power, guns or not.

Maher is an idiot, so nothing he says really surprises me.

On the other hand, this is exactly the type of thing many of us warned about during all those anti-2nd amendment threads over the last few years. Eventually, they're going to come after a freedom you actually do care about, and guess what? Now they have, and you have no one to blame but yourselves for enabling it.

I'm as guilty as anyone. I've supported similar infringements years ago because they didn't affect me. Then I grew up, and realized that the world doesn't revolve around me. It doesn't revolve around you, either. Stop supporting and enabling politicians who would restrict the Constitutional rights of others simply because you don't care about that particular right. Someone else does, and their opinion, and their rights, are just as important as yours.

reply to post by marg6043

used to be for the people and by the people not for corporations and corrupted elite, and they fail to really really understand the constitution or even taken the time to read it.

It actually never was. George Washington signed a bill that would start a central bank in the USA, the real first federal reserve. This banker bill passed the senate with no issues. This country was ran by foreign corporate interests from the get go. A huge portion of the founding fathers were "corrupted elite". There's a reason why Alexander Hamilton (a banker) was appointed Secretary of Treasury, then went on to help created the first Fed Reserve, and help enslave this country to foreign "investors" in this private national bank. He was just as bad, if not worse than Obama.

en.wikipedia.org...

This country was never for the people or by the people... People don't like to hear the truth, but this silly "this country used to be something special" talk is just NOT true.

reply to post by Paschar0

When he made this statement, no one knew how to react, I did, outrage.

Of course you did, lately, that's all people can react with, outrage.

My head is spinning over all this, actually witnesses first had the dismantling of the very things that made America great.

OMG, an American with a TV show and no actual political power had an opinion different from yours, it must be the dismantling of America!

How people can justify this in any way, shape or form is literally un-American.

Uh huh? So, when the GOP passed the Patriot Act, that was all well and good, but an American TV show host states an opinion and he's now Un-American.

The fear card is trying to be played and aside from serious Democrats and old ladies, NO ONE I know can even believe this is be admitted to, much less actually happening.

What's the problem? The GOP has used the fear card for years, oh, is it that now the other side is using it too so now it's time to be outraged by it?

Well no surprise to many of us here, but the general public is once again being told how to react and feel about the complete destruction of their privacy and freedom by TV personalities and sadly, it's always been far too effective.

As evidenced by FOX News viewers "We report, and tell you what to think about it."

Our grandchildren will wonder why we didn't stand and fight and how we could just let this happen. I now understand how Germans must have felt watching Hitler, little by little, install the mechanisms to make the Reich effective.

Damn, goodwins law invoked post 1. Good job there. Might as well reach the lowest common denominator right off the bat right?

So, here's the problem with your thread, Bill Maher is no more influential than say, Rush Limbaugh, (actually far less so, as if you offend Limbaugh as a conservative, you are forced to publicly apologize to the shock jock) Maher stated an opinion, you disagree with it. Unfortunately the conservative tactic of (make em quit if they upset us slightly) won't really work here.

It's his opinion, he's entitled to it (much to your dismay apparently) You, of course are free to be "outraged" by his expression of that opinion, just as many conservatives are "outraged" by anything that isn't far right in this country anymore.

Do I agree with Maher's opinion? No, I don't, but I'm not going to be outraged by it. I reserve outrage for things that really make me mad, like genocides, and human trafficking.

Should we be happy with what the government is doing? Of course not. We of course have a system in place to fix that, it's called elections, and if you don't believe they work, ask the TEA Party members of congress.

Maher is well.. Maher.. I believe he just likes to say some of the most outlandish things now that he's an influence upon others for no real reason, just to stick out and get people's attention.

He's an ex-comedian. He craves attention and the spotlight.

And if he does really believe that, then America might as well be dead with the corrupt puppets we have in office.

Originally posted by justwokeup
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

Doesn't it show that in the modern age the 2nd amendment does precisely nothing to prevent tyranny? The 2nd amendment was happily in place while the legislation to allow this was voted through.

My belief is that it's there as a safeguard, not to be used at every turn, but as a last resort for serious battles. When all other methods have been exhausted and force becomes necessary, the people have actual physical power to act. This is the only thing tyranny truly respects, I love the argument some have that "you little people and your guns really think you can fight the most powerful military in the world?" Apparently, guys in caves in Afghanistan have done just that. The point is, millions of armed patriots decide to to fight back, you can bet we win, it's only when we allow them to pick us off one by one that they have any chance. Revolutions are fought by single digit percentages anyway.

reply to post by justwokeup


This isn't a 2nd Amendment thread and that debate has been waged across these forums for months in very heated ways. I'm not even going to START to engage in that again on this thread. The OP and the story refer to it as one more lost with the 4th ...not the 2nd...now being the focus to lose. One does follow the other, but if you're good with the 2nd being gone, as so many seem to be, how does that work now?

Perhaps this has been the plan all along. Cracking the 10 amendments, as "fundamental transformation of America" was always going to require, had to start somewhere. They chose the least desirable of the 10 to the highest number of people. The 2nd. Now that's in flux and up for grabs.

Which others are you good with losing after the crack has come? They're going to come for them *ALL* to one degree or another to remove, tweak or re-write in function, if not letter. Which do you care about not losing? They're all under threat now. Just as so many of us warned they WOULD be.

The Bill of Rights is a package deal, not a buffet.

Originally posted by HauntWok
reply to post by Paschar0

 

When he made this statement, no one knew how to react, I did, outrage.

Of course you did, lately, that's all people can react with, outrage.

My head is spinning over all this, actually witnesses first had the dismantling of the very things that made America great.

OMG, an American with a TV show and no actual political power had an opinion different from yours, it must be the dismantling of America!

How people can justify this in any way, shape or form is literally un-American.

Uh huh? So, when the GOP passed the Patriot Act, that was all well and good, but an American TV show host states an opinion and he's now Un-American.

The fear card is trying to be played and aside from serious Democrats and old ladies, NO ONE I know can even believe this is be admitted to, much less actually happening.

What's the problem? The GOP has used the fear card for years, oh, is it that now the other side is using it too so now it's time to be outraged by it?

Well no surprise to many of us here, but the general public is once again being told how to react and feel about the complete destruction of their privacy and freedom by TV personalities and sadly, it's always been far too effective.

As evidenced by FOX News viewers "We report, and tell you what to think about it."

Our grandchildren will wonder why we didn't stand and fight and how we could just let this happen. I now understand how Germans must have felt watching Hitler, little by little, install the mechanisms to make the Reich effective.

Damn, goodwins law invoked post 1. Good job there. Might as well reach the lowest common denominator right off the bat right?

So, here's the problem with your thread, Bill Maher is no more influential than say, Rush Limbaugh, (actually far less so, as if you offend Limbaugh as a conservative, you are forced to publicly apologize to the shock jock) Maher stated an opinion, you disagree with it. Unfortunately the conservative tactic of (make em quit if they upset us slightly) won't really work here.

It's his opinion, he's entitled to it (much to your dismay apparently) You, of course are free to be "outraged" by his expression of that opinion, just as many conservatives are "outraged" by anything that isn't far right in this country anymore.

Do I agree with Maher's opinion? No, I don't, but I'm not going to be outraged by it. I reserve outrage for things that really make me mad, like genocides, and human trafficking.

Should we be happy with what the government is doing? Of course not. We of course have a system in place to fix that, it's called elections, and if you don't believe they work, ask the TEA Party members of congress.

Not to bust your bubble, but I'm not a republican or democrat. I have liberal views right along with conservative ones, You're response is very telling in how you view the world, I used to buy into that nonsense too a while back.

reply to post by Paschar0

Not to bust your bubble, but I'm not a republican or democrat. I have liberal views right along with conservative ones, You're response is very telling in how you view the world, I used to buy into that nonsense too a while back.

Ah yes, can't come up with an adequate response to my post to your OP, so, let's just dismiss the whole post outright. Good job.

Today's fake outrage craze just drives me nuts. Instead of disagreeing with someone's opinion. Let's just go with outrage. People are so "outraged" all the time, it's making the word lose all meaning.

Yes, you are entitled to your opinion against Maher's opinion, that's the name of the game. But to fake outrage? that's just petty. It's pathetic, meaningless, and shows poor judgement.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Fair enough. It was already mentioned or I wouldn't have brought it up. I wasn't attacking the 2nd in as much as saying the 2nd on its own does nothing to protect the others.

I think what this shows is that its quite easy to create a tyranny so long as you do it slowly like boiling a frog. This 'minor furore' is inconvenient and it may cause a brief holding steady of the temperature but it wont affect the general trend which is less freedom and more control.

As long as none of the individual freedom incursions are large enough to upset the main mass of the population there is nothing to stop them all going away.

The only protections are a free media and an engaged populace, both long since gone.

Ah yes, can't come up with an adequate response to my post to your OP, so, let's just dismiss the whole post outright. Good job.

Why do I get the feeling you're in a cheese shop? When you decide what you want to argue about, let me know.

Originally posted by Paschar0

Ah yes, can't come up with an adequate response to my post to your OP, so, let's just dismiss the whole post outright. Good job.

Why do I get the feeling you're in a cheese shop? When you decide what you want to argue about, let me know.

OMG, thanks for making my coffee spray everywhere He'll probably argue Monty Python references now.

for all of you who believe that the 2nd amendment combats tyranny, look at Syria for a real time example....the government has aircraft that bomb, tanks that shoot large explosive shells, and missiles that have large warheads....going against automatic AK-47 personal arms...so far ninety thousand dead and Assad is clearly kicking ass on the civilian masses. it appears that some people here on ATS, as well as hundreds of thousands of other people, want this to happen in America.
so...to diffuse this angry outrage in a rational manner, what does the right want? there are 31 republican governors out of 50 states, the house is controlled by republicans, the senate republicans have used the filibuster to stop legislation in unprecedented numbers....and yet, all the problems are caused by (in their minds) Obama...this is why this type of thinking does not get any traction outside the extreme right-wing.

Bill Maher is a "useful idiot"....he should study what happens to useful idiots after a communist take over.