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Aside from the style and colors of the fragments themselves, (closely resembling others found at the site of Knossos in Minoan Crete and on the Cycladic island of Santorini or ancient Thera, home to the ruins of Minoan Akrotiri), Cline emphasizes trademark Aegean or Minoan processes of production that are not normally found at typical ancient Canaanite sites. "This technique of painting on a plaster wall while it is still wet is an Aegean technique," he maintains. "It is rarely found in the ancient Near East where they typically painted after the plaster was dry. Secondly, they applied a technique of using strings to help in the painting process. They took strings and just tightened them and, upon contacting the wet plaster, created a perfectly straight line. We have evidence of that in plaster. Another technique was to take a string and dip it in, for example, red paint, and then tighten it quickly against a surface to make a perfectly straight line. And we have found evidence of that here." Another Aegean technique seen in Kabri was the use of knife marks to delineate the border of painted bands.
Originally posted by Kantzveldt
There is also the concern with collecting the golden saffron, which is commonly seen in Indo-European tradition as related to the sun, fire. gold, and this light is that which illuminates the moon, so in Minoan tradition the Goddesses can be seen in conjunction with both the sun and the moon...all bases covered.
Originally posted by Kantzveldt
reply to post by ipsedixit
It seems then to be a worldwide phenomena that from the hunter/gatherer stage of development through to the onset of civilization, were applicable, all cultures understood the role of the bees in establishing pathways and patterns across the face of the Earth, and that they were working to a singular design and purpose.
The common denominator then for me, in what might connect seemingly unconnected cultures developing along similar lines, is not aliens, or a lost advanced civilization...it is the bees.
What the 'bees' are in such a context might of course require further understanding.
Originally posted by Kantzveldt
reply to post by ipsedixit
It seems then to be a worldwide phenomena that from the hunter/gatherer stage of development through to the onset of civilization, were applicable, all cultures understood the role of the bees in establishing pathways and patterns across the face of the Earth, and that they were working to a singular design and purpose.
Originally posted by KilgoreTrout
Originally posted by Kantzveldt
There is also the concern with collecting the golden saffron, which is commonly seen in Indo-European tradition as related to the sun, fire. gold, and this light is that which illuminates the moon, so in Minoan tradition the Goddesses can be seen in conjunction with both the sun and the moon...all bases covered.
The White Goddess, or rather the feminine representation of the Moon, is broken down into seperate aspects relational to the complexity of society. So, in the later Neolithic she has not only the White, whole form, and the Black, which carried through from the Paleolithic, but also the Green and Yellow forms, which were integral to the rituals surrounding the success of agricultural practices. The particular characteristics of the Green and Yellow forms of the Goddess regionally, tend to be tied to the environment and local economy.
Graves's value as a poet aside, flaws in his scholarship such as poor philology, use of inadequate texts and out-dated archaeology have been criticised. Some scholars, particularly archaeologists, historians and folklorists have not received the work favourably. Graves was disappointed that his work was "loudly ignored" by many Celtic scholars; however, it was accepted as history by many non-scholarly readers and, according to Ronald Hutton, The White Goddess remains a major source of confusion about the ancient Celts and influences many un-scholarly views of Celtic paganism. Hilda Ellis Davidson criticized Graves as having "misled many innocent readers with his eloquent but deceptive statements about a nebulous goddess in early Celtic literature", and stated that he was "no authority" on the subject matter he presented. While Graves made the association between Goddesses and the moon appear "natural," it was not so to the Celts or some other ancient peoples.
source: en.wikipedia.org...
Igutsaq (The Woman Who Adopted a Bumblebee)
There once was a woman named Igutsalik who adopted a bumblebee. The adopted bee was named Igutsaq, in honour of its mother by adoption Igutsalik. Igutsalik was Igustsaq’s sauniq. [Sauniq is the Inuttitut word for namesake.]
The story goes that Igutsalik had a friend from Kangirsujuaq. Her name was Qattaaq.
Qattaaq helped her friend Igutsalik by threading beads. Together, Qataaq and Igutsalik decorated a tiny sack. The sack was just exactly small enough to fit a big bumblebee.
Artist: Elisapee Inukpuk
Qattaaq did not know why she was beading a tiny sack. Qattaaq did not know for whom she was beading a tiny sack. But nonetheless Qattaaq helped to make a beautifully beaded sack.
Igutsalik did not tell Qattaaq why she was beading a sack. Igutsalik did not tell Qattaaq for whom she was beading a sack. But nonetheless she let her friend Qattaaq help to make a beautifully beaded sack.
And so it happened that Qattaaq did not know that she had made a beautiful outfit for a large adopted bee named Igutsaq.
Until one day… Qattaaq found out that the beautifully beaded sack was used as clothing by a bumblebee named Igutsaq. And Qattaaq became very, very sick.
Afterword
It is not known how Igutsaq was fed or what Igutsaq ate. All that is known is that Igutsaq was said to be a very big bumblebee.
Originally posted by Kantzveldt
This underlying all important role of the bee shouldn't be so surprising as they pollinate the plants upon which life on the land depends.
reply to post by ipsedixit
Yes in Australian lore the Bee Deity is the pathfinder following first creation, connecting all areas to the central hive, as knowing all ways also the guide into the underworld, the bridge between the Earthly realm and the Spiritual
Originally posted by Kantzveldt
reply to post by ipsedixit
A funny story is that when i was younger we lived next door to someone who i always thought of as 'The Bee Man' without really understanding why, and i formed appropriate scary mental images of this hybrid lurking next door.
Later i learned that as it turns out he was the local fence, and all criminal activity began and ended at his house, that the criminal bees with the sticky fingers would go pilfering here and there then return to this hive of activity, as we lived next door and were on good terms this constituted as being connected to the hive, so the criminal bees had to beat a path away from our door.
By night he was a DJ at the local underworld nightclub and all the criminal bees danced to his tunes...i always knew i was right.
Originally posted by Byrd
It's a great read, really it is. But when you start looking at his sources, it's really disappointing.
Originally posted by Kantzveldt
reply to post by Byrd
The Inuit have the Creatrix, Igutsaqjuaq – Big Bee Woman. It is not known how Igutsaq was fed or what Igutsaq ate. All that is known is that Igutsaq was said to be a very big bumblebee.
Originally posted by Byrd
Originally posted by Kantzveldt
reply to post by Byrd
The Inuit have the Creatrix, Igutsaqjuaq – Big Bee Woman. It is not known how Igutsaq was fed or what Igutsaq ate. All that is known is that Igutsaq was said to be a very big bumblebee.
Point taken, and the bumblebee shamans are quite interesting. I'm going to have to go look those up!
I learn new things on ATS all the time.
However, I still feel the leaps you are making by connecting cultures via one symbol are simply interesting coincidences due to environment and nothing else. It ignores other evidence for connections (language) and space and time and geography to connect symbols that may not have the same meaning to the two groups of people.
Originally posted by abeverage
Personally I think those leaps are not taken enough by "The Establishment" more often then not they have become monolithic in their thinking. Much like Columbus discovering an inhabited continent, the History books are strewn with fallacies yet promoted educationally as factual. Occam's razor rarely seems to be applied to the symbology that is often times obviously at the root of all languages and cultures.
This is violated all the time on ATS... but y'all aren't university trained scientists and you don't have to actually stand up and prove your case to a field of experts on the subject matter. It is, however, something I have to be very careful about because I do present papers on anthropology and related subjects and if I make silly logic leaps in front of the rest of my peers, the results aren't pretty.