About: The story of jesus

Ok i should have written this 12 hours earlier. ill try to form the ideas about this now. even if im ready to go to sleep.

We all know the story of jesus and how he has got crucified in it. At least we were TOLD or saw it in a movie that it has happened.

For this question to be understand, i want to write an imaginary scenario (which was formed in my thoughts):

We as humans, experience the time as linear and we are moving in only 1 direction which is the future.
So the only way to see the changes in the past would be to ... (insert your thoughts here).

Imagine the fact that if we could change the past, it would be only with our thoughts. This could be
to decide that the past which has happened is untrue and we form a new idea of changing it.

Now imagine an inteligence which is looking at the earth and on the people like childs from kindergarten.
And this inteligence has set up some Questions to you which you would have to (not to answer) but to
stick on with belief.

Now how Can this inteligence see, which child is ready to move on, and which one is not ?

Well the Question was, one of i think which is most important :

The Crucification of the Jesus.

The hidden part of this Question is the belief that it has happened.

How would you decide, if you would knew all this, that you could change the past with your thoughts.

Would you let him be crucified or would you go and help him with stopping the crucification ?

For me is clear: i would stop the crucification, then nobody deserves that treatment.

Yes i know there is this thing about what would the Rest of humanity learn if he wasnt crucified, and other possibilities which would or would not happen.
But look, he has returned after few days anyway...

I watched Jesus Christ Superstar live with Tim Minchin last night, it was great! And I'm not even a Jesusy kinda guy...

Dude was probably a camel or some shizz, who knows...

I personally don't think that Jesus was crucified. I think someone may have been in his place. My only question is....what happened to the real Jesus. If Jesus was full of god, why would god want to be nailed to a cross.

Jesus said "God, why have though forsaken me". This to me means that the spirit who was within him had left. If it was the real Jesus on the cross in the first place and not someone who looked like him.

I know, I'm going to hell. The only unforgivable sin is to blasphemy the Holy Ghost though. That to me means the spirit of god that is in people. We can cut down people for their actions but not question their belief in god. That is if the god they are following is really god.

Originally posted by Hombre

Yes i know there is this thing about what would the Rest of humanity learn if he wasnt crucified, and other possibilities which would or would not happen.
But look, he has returned after few days anyway...

edit on 4/5/2013 by Hombre because: fixed some spelling errors

Jesus allowed Himself to be crucified so that He could defeat death.

He was the Devine person become human...
...and He was the only human that could defeat death.

The crucifixion was about resurrection...
...and resurrection is a gift to you who believe.

This was the original Gospel before religion took it over...
...that death was defeated by a human who could promise resurrection to all...
...all you had to do was believe that He did it ... and anyone can believe.

Originally posted by rickymouse
I personally don't think that Jesus was crucified. I think someone may have been in his place. My only question is....what happened to the real Jesus. If Jesus was full of god, why would god want to be nailed to a cross.

Here is what some people believe...Jesus had some friends in high places...there was one who had prestige and a lot of money and connections; when Jesus was nailed to the cross; and given some something to drink on a sponge; on that sponge was a drug that made it look like he died; after he was put in his burial place; he awakened; he walked among his disciples said goodbye and was secretly shipped to India; where he lived to a ripe old age and during that time he taught, married and had children.

I am not exactly sure if the above is true or not; but I am inclined to believe it is.

reply to post by Hombre


In my personal opinion... and one that conflicts with many other Christians, the purpose of Christ's walk here was to set an example for people to follow. His physical death was also an example of how we should, using the term from a recent movie, remove ourselves from the equation.

Faith in Christ is not (for me) about preaching religious doctrine but by trying to live that example that was left for us.

The form of his execution; the Roman version of crucifixion, we designed to be both horrid and effective on the population. In sum... behave or you can end up on that same piece of wood. The Romans were excellent at killing and very well adapted to bloody death and so too, using the same forcing preferred opinion on their subjects.

For a Christian who believes as I do, it teaches that self sacrifice is part of the walk; to put one's self second...

...

My family won't let me watch the "Passion of Christ" anymore.

I throw a tantrum and cry uncontrollably every time I see it. I'm standing up yelling at the TV - "Why isn't anyone doing anything? Why is everyone standing there! Those cowards cursed humanity! The sealed the deal that Eden is to become a hell! And to say sorry they create Catholicism? Yeah, that's a hoot!"

The movie was given away and it's banned from the home.

Cirque

Originally posted by CirqueDeTruth
My family won't let me watch the "Passion of Christ" anymore.

I throw a tantrum and cry uncontrollably every time I see it. I'm standing up yelling at the TV - "Why isn't anyone doing anything? Why is everyone standing there! Those cowards cursed humanity! The sealed the deal that Eden is to become a hell! And to say sorry they create Catholicism? Yeah, that's a hoot!"

The movie was given away and it's banned from the home.

Cirque

Jesus said, "...I lay down my life, that I might take it again. No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again." John 10:17-18

He was always in control and could have ended it any time He wanted to but to defeat death you must first die.

He allowed it to happen publically so the story could be told...
...and He appeared to over 500 people afterward so it could not easily be refuted.

For me the answer is motivated by my passion for humanity, if I were to alter historical events then it would prove that history is but a mere false shell to those that retain memories. There were already many copies of "Jesus" present in the world, I started with finding 2, then it grew to 25 and I stopped counting or caring about "Jesus" because he was not unique.


I would not alter past historical events, it would cheapen what we consider history already and if history is reduced to a staged event for the purpose of not letting people feel robbed, then what would it really matter?


If I had the opportunity to witness the cruxifixtion of "Jesus" it would depend on if I found this version of "Jesus" interesting, if not then I would just witness one of the many other "Jesus's" in the world.


If Jesus is fake, I wouldn't bother mentioning it's fake for the sake of the human spirit.

The gears of destiny were set into motion long before you and I, altering anything in this frame of time would just prompt nature to correct any deviation by itself. If there was a "Jesus" and he was saved on that particular day, I believe the forces of fate and destiny would find a way to alleviate him of his life to fix the course of time. You cannot prevent the inevitable but you can stave it off for the trade of a greater repurcusion than what was originally scripted.

Originally posted by Knives4eyes
For me the answer is motivated by my passion for humanity, if I were to alter historical events then it would prove that history is but a mere false shell to those that retain memories. There were already many copies of "Jesus" present in the world, I started with finding 2, then it grew to 25 and I stopped counting or caring about "Jesus" because he was not unique.

"...what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many." Matthew 24:3-5

There is an ambiguity here that works both ways...
...many will come claiming to be the Christ ... false Messiahs...
...and many will come saying Jesus is the Christ ... religionists who claim His name but deceive.

reply to post by troubleshooter


How does this work if other people compare you to christ?


It's very abrasive and grating when I get called anything similar to Jesus or God, is there a bible verse for this situation? I get tired of telling people I'm not Jesus.

reply to post by Knives4eyes


Verily my son, I tell you.... wake the hell up!

I think its in Luke somewhere...

Originally posted by Knives4eyes
reply to post by troubleshooter

 

How does this work if other people compare you to christ?


It's very abrasive and grating when I get called anything similar to Jesus or God, is there a bible verse for this situation? I get tired of telling people I'm not Jesus.

Don't believe them

Mark 13:21 "...if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:"

Well I cant decide if the story is true or not, Im very skeptical of both arguments.
Yeah the pattern was set in history, the stories ring truths of old, but that doesnt mean to see Jesus saw this and saw that he could offer his life for his message. If people around then were believing in different gods and different stories, then he used these beliefs to highlight his. Very well done and also very noble. I think when considering this as a truth people over look the conviction and bravery to do this (because there is no way he came back to life either way imo).

If not true and only writings to guide people then also I belive that it was a good thing to do, I mean, the writings, morals etc were good, no? The message was good, no?

reply to post by caladonea


That is very possible too. Even the one who sentenced him didn't want to.

reply to post by Hombre

For me is clear: i would stop the crucification, then nobody deserves that treatment.

Then you would be under God's judgement. Your answer is silly since Yeshua himself said to his disciples that they could have no part in him unless he washed their feet, which was symbolic of him cleansing the dirtiest part of a man: his soul.

People like you with little understanding of the scriptures always make the same mistake: you discount the old testament and seperate the old from the new in thinking they are two different books.

You couldn't stop the crucifiction if you tried, because you are not greater than God, whose will it was for Yeshua to be lifted up for all mankind. That and those Roman soldiers would skewer you in a heartbeat without an afterthought and then shake your corpse down for your posessions.

Pure foolishness.

Originally posted by troubleshooter

Originally posted by Hombre

Yes i know there is this thing about what would the Rest of humanity learn if he wasnt crucified, and other possibilities which would or would not happen.
But look, he has returned after few days anyway...

edit on 4/5/2013 by Hombre because: fixed some spelling errors

Jesus allowed Himself to be crucified so that He could defeat death.

He was the Devine person become human...
...and He was the only human that could defeat death.

The crucifixion was about resurrection...
...and resurrection is a gift to you who believe.

This was the original Gospel before religion took it over...
...that death was defeated by a human who could promise resurrection to all...
...all you had to do was believe that He did it ... and anyone can believe.

edit on 4/5/13 by troubleshooter because: (no reason given)

Ok so now "death" is defeated where did he go? Why should he need to return! I mean after all death was defeated right?

Did he go with aliens somewhere?

Or in your mind did he open a magic portal where he walks with spiritual beings that we can't see?

Wouldn't that be death?

Originally posted by metalholic

Originally posted by troubleshooter

Originally posted by Hombre

Yes i know there is this thing about what would the Rest of humanity learn if he wasnt crucified, and other possibilities which would or would not happen.
But look, he has returned after few days anyway...

edit on 4/5/2013 by Hombre because: fixed some spelling errors

Jesus allowed Himself to be crucified so that He could defeat death.

He was the Devine person become human...
...and He was the only human that could defeat death.

The crucifixion was about resurrection...
...and resurrection is a gift to you who believe.

This was the original Gospel before religion took it over...
...that death was defeated by a human who could promise resurrection to all...
...all you had to do was believe that He did it ... and anyone can believe.

edit on 4/5/13 by troubleshooter because: (no reason given)

Ok so now "death" is defeated where did he go? Why should he need to return! I mean after all death was defeated right?

He is in ontological spiritual union with His elect who know Him.

reply to post by troubleshooter


My point is death doesn't exist!

If some physical entity "defeated" "death" they must surely still be around! And I do mean PHYSICALLY.

The only way this guy is coming around other then through rituals and evocations is through reincarnation as a physical entity like everyone else does.

My point is death doesn't exist!

If some physical entity "defeated" "death" they must surely still be around! And I do mean PHYSICALLY.

The only way this guy is coming around other then through rituals and evocations is through reincarnation as a physical entity like everyone else does.

no there are few more ways/possibilities

one of them is : we have forgoten (were unlearned) how to SEE them (or maybe our belief system doesnt allow us (too much science ??)) .