Assesment of Boston bomb injuries [Some blood, no gore]

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posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 05:16 PM
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I have seen numerous posts on the subject that the injuries in Boston are "fake", and that it was all an act. There are numerous misconceptions, and countless mistakes made in those assesments. I cannot say one way or another if this was a false flag, and not the topic of this thread (so leave that out of it unless it pertains to the casualties)

I will start this by describing my credentals on this subject

I spent 15 years as a Cavalry Scout in the Army. I have deployed to Bosnia, Kosovo, Iraq, and Afghanistan. I have seen numerous IED attacks, and mine strikes. I have been injured by an IED. I have been in charge of mas cas events, and treated patients in a mas cas event.

After I was forced into retirement from the Army, I became a EMT-Basic, and currently a Paramedic. I have 5 years in EMS (1 year EMT-Basic/ 4 years Paramedic). I have been in mas cas events since I joined EMS, and work in a 911 system as a crew chief. I work part time as a flight medic for a air evacuation service in vicinity of SC.

I am nationaly registered, and SC state certified. If you would like any proof of this I can find means without giving my cert numbers or my identity.

All my conclusions are based off of picture assesments, I cannot be 100% accurate as the only true way to be 100% positive would to be there doing patient assesments.

First you have to understand the method to the maddness of start triage. This is the system EMS uses to attempt to have as many people survive as possible without focusing on one individual. This is a good source to read for an explanation (PDF) Start Triage

After reading this, you will have a better understanding of why EMS did what they did.

I will label each picture, and refer to each with my info.

Picture 1 (pictures edited to meet ATS TOS U2U me if you want direct link)

This picture is used as proof. It is stated that the errors commited are obvious making this a actor. Here is my assesment
#1 it is said that he is smiling and he has too much color. I have to disagree as he appears ashen, and unsure of lip color. It is a misconception that all patients lips turn blue when in shock. I cannot speak for his state of mind as a picture will not give you this answer, is that a smirk or is that confusion setting in? I wasnt there.

#2 #3 This is parts of the tourniquet on his limbs. #2 is the rod being used to constrict the tourniquet and #3 is the parts of the tourniquet. There are numerous ways to do one, but this appears to be effective. I cannot not speak for his right leg as I cannot get a clear view.

#4 It is stated that there is no spraying blood or dripping blood. A tourniquet effectively cuts off all blood flow to the limb below it and residual would be gone minus wetness dependant on time. This damage is consistant with a blast as that is a partial tibia protruding (not a turkey leg). No signs are observable of this person having a previous amputation. I believe he is on a wheel chair is because of triage. Triage, treat immediate life threats, transport are the order. Each ambulance has 1 stretcher, if there are more patients then ambulances then you move the patient as best you can.
The arguement that his legs should be elevated is irrelevant. That position is called the trendelumberg position and is not been taught in EMT- Paramedic classes anymore, as it has not shown to improve patient outcome. In addition elevating tourniqueted legs would have no change in blood pressure as the legs are already excluded from blood flow.
Here is an example of a bi lateral amputation with no bleeding and tourniquets

Picture 2

Picture 3

The woman in picture 2 is atributed to giving a hand signal that the cameras are rolling. To save space you can look at the series of pictures. Is this a signal, or someone that has been struck in the head and feeling her head. If you notice in other pics she has no blood on her hands before touching her head, and blood on her hands and head after touching. Is this her adding fake blood? You can see in picture 3, she has a towel with blood near her head, showing signs that she has a head injury.

Picture 3 is used to say why is she spinal immobilzed and on a stretcher when picture 1 has a bi lateral amputation on a wheel chair. It also atributed that she is getting treatment before the amputations.
First she is not spinal immoblized, she is just on a stretcher. If you read the start triage you would see that respiration, pulse and memory play a role in transport decision (plus you cant see if amputation patient is still there). A head injury leads to a higher priority than someone with controlled bleeding. I cannot say for certain but she may have other injuries in the chest (unclear) which would take a precedence. The wide open eyes is common with someone who is having repirations problems or head injury. I say this as head injuries cause confusion and respiratory problems and if it is a respiratory problem then the eyes lose oxygen flow and you start to lose vision like in passing out. In addition explosions are nortorious for causing tension pneumothoracies, which is an immediate concern and an immediate life threat.

Picture 4

This picture is used to point out that blood is not spraying. I cannot say if there is any sort of belt or restricting band on the injury slowing blood flow in this picture. What I can attest to is that in a complete amputation, the arteries and veins quiver and retract stopping blood flow. If a tourniquet is not applied then the arteries will relax and the patient will bleed out.



What to do
If you witness an amputation:
Call emergency services.
Stop the bleeding. A complete amputation may not bleed very much. The cut blood vessels may spasm, pull back into the injured part, and shrink. This slows or stops the bleeding. If there is bleeding, do the following:

source

Additionally the comment that his blood pressure would drop causing him to pass out is incorrect. BP (blood pressure) is the relationship of how much space available blood has to fill. Shock is the body pulling blood into the major organs. This man has lost blood from the tissue amputated, but with a tourniquet the size of the container the blood has to fill is decreased (body minus space of legs). The patients BP can maintain but saline is recommended to increase volume of blood.

I cannot say I have all the answers, if you have a question I will try to figure it out off of these pics or find others. If you see an error in my assesment let me know. I am hoping to dispell some misconceptions on the injured that are being continuously used in posts

Thank you.
edit on 20-4-2013 by cavscout11cav because: (no reason given)




posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 05:30 PM
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THTERE IS A SOURCE FOR AMPUTEE ACTORS.

www.army-technology.com...



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 05:32 PM
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Originally posted by restful
THTERE IS A SOURCE FOR AMPUTEE ACTORS.

www.army-technology.com...

So that refutes everything I said? Where is your proof he was an amputee beforehand

I researched and don't see where they mutulate the body with BONES sticking out realistic. In fact they say they specifically dont do that
edit on 20-4-2013 by cavscout11cav because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 05:34 PM
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There are plenty of gore pictures available on the net. The MSM do not show them strictly because 1) It is not in good taste 2) It is not in good taste.

ETA:- These people have lost limbs, three people lost their lives. Let's remember the victims and respect their rights for photographs of their plight not to be put up for exhibition like some Victorian freak show!!
edit on 20/4/13 by Cobaltic1978 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 05:35 PM
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reply to post by cavscout11cav
 

Where is proof he wasnt.This more proves what you say is true.

also:

www.4rfv.co.uk...



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 05:37 PM
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reply to post by cavscout11cav
 


where is the proof they werent...



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 05:39 PM
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Originally posted by dc4lifeskater
reply to post by cavscout11cav
 


where is the proof they werent...


So this is what ATS has become, you take 1 part of that entire thing, and you are right? What about all those other paragraphs. Do you think an EMT wouldnt be able to recognize make up? Oh they are in it too...
I can take any topic on ATS, find someone who imitates it, acts it, portrays it and that doesnt make me right on the subject



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 05:44 PM
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reply to post by cavscout11cav
 


Thank you for giving your view based on knowledge and experience. Not much more to say then dont worry about the sheeple that only switched sides of the fence. Man they are everywhere now.
edit on 20-4-2013 by Dumbass because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 05:48 PM
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Originally posted by cavscout11cav

Originally posted by restful
THTERE IS A SOURCE FOR AMPUTEE ACTORS.

www.army-technology.com...

So that refutes everything I said? Where is your proof he was an amputee beforehand

I researched and don't see where they mutulate the body with BONES sticking out realistic. In fact they say they specifically dont do that
edit on 20-4-2013 by cavscout11cav because: (no reason given)

It seems proof isn't the most important thing these days and sounding good is far more important. It's pretty frustrating when you've spent years living something or days, weeks or months researching/learning about something to have all of it casually swept aside as if qualifications mean nothing and work to learn is silly when reading the "right" single source is just as valid (when a source is even offered, of course).

I for one was first repulsed by your OP but then took a moment to read your stated background and what you were trying to do and show here. Taken as a whole? I appreciate the effort you took and came away with a better understanding of a couple things on it.


Some folks definitely do appreciate the experience and effort to share it.



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 05:53 PM
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Originally posted by Wrabbit2000

Originally posted by cavscout11cav

Originally posted by restful
THTERE IS A SOURCE FOR AMPUTEE ACTORS.

www.army-technology.com...

So that refutes everything I said? Where is your proof he was an amputee beforehand

I researched and don't see where they mutulate the body with BONES sticking out realistic. In fact they say they specifically dont do that
edit on 20-4-2013 by cavscout11cav because: (no reason given)

It seems proof isn't the most important thing these days and sounding good is far more important. It's pretty frustrating when you've spent years living something or days, weeks or months researching/learning about something to have all of it casually swept aside as if qualifications mean nothing and work to learn is silly when reading the "right" single source is just as valid (when a source is even offered, of course).

I for one was first repulsed by your OP but then took a moment to read your stated background and what you were trying to do and show here. Taken as a whole? I appreciate the effort you took and came away with a better understanding of a couple things on it.


Some folks definitely do appreciate the experience and effort to share it.

Thank you, I did not mean to repulse in the slightest. Actually the mods had me tone it down and I am thankful for them pointing out that error. To me this is work.
To me the fact that some are mis-representing these pics is repulsive. I am trying to give insight and knowlege so that others can deny ignorance.

thank you and thanks dumass



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 06:00 PM
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Great thread and very interesting. Thanks for taking all the time you did to put it together.

I didn't know people were claiming "actors" on the victims. THat is certainly not an angle I would have pursued. That is a little out there, even for a tinfoil hatter like myself.



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 06:06 PM
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Great job.

I read the other post that analyzed the series of pics as a fake, and it didn't sit right with me. My first husband was a paramedic, and many times he'd talk about the terrible things he'd seen. I remember him talking about how to apply a tourniquet and he specifically stated that a complete amputation doesn't always spurt blood right away.

To me, the guy in the wheelchair looks like he's in shock. I really hate talking about him like this, when he certainly has a name and is more than likely facing a tremendous amount of pain. Has anyone managed to identify him, and confirm his status? I would think it a simple matter for some people.

OP....well done. S&F

ETA: Yes, he's been identified. His name can be found by following this link. I didn't want to post his name, just didn't seem right.

I'm sure he has family and friends who will willingly attest to his injuries. If it had been faked, I also believe someone would have discovered that by now.
edit on 20-4-2013 by smyleegrl because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 06:10 PM
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Originally posted by cavscout11cav

Originally posted by dc4lifeskater
reply to post by cavscout11cav
 


where is the proof they werent...


So this is what ATS has become, you take 1 part of that entire thing, and you are right? What about all those other paragraphs. Do you think an EMT wouldnt be able to recognize make up? Oh they are in it too...
I can take any topic on ATS, find someone who imitates it, acts it, portrays it and that doesnt make me right on the subject


but thats what you did in Mykahs case on Muzzleflash's thread
shall i link?



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 06:13 PM
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No need to link, I countered his info with this info, I did not counter with irrelevant info that cant be verified. I told him I will gladly go back and forth with him. If he would of been right on what he was saying, instead of bad medical knowledge then I would stand corrected. I can be wrong on this, I am sharing my expirence with others who do not work this field.

Heck, I stand corrected on muzzles stance, I was misinformed on some topics, and misunderstood others. Not saying I 100% agree but I do agree some part
edit on 20-4-2013 by cavscout11cav because: (no reason given)
edit on 20-4-2013 by cavscout11cav because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 06:15 PM
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Originally posted by cavscout11cav

Originally posted by dc4lifeskater
reply to post by cavscout11cav
 


where is the proof they werent...


So this is what ATS has become, you take 1 part of that entire thing, and you are right? What about all those other paragraphs. Do you think an EMT wouldnt be able to recognize make up? Oh they are in it too...
I can take any topic on ATS, find someone who imitates it, acts it, portrays it and that doesnt make me right on the subject [/quote


Ok i have been involved in some pretty full on things in my time some i'd rather forget, one thing i do know is that arteries when severed will spurt blood in unbelievable amounts, i mean that if you were trying to hold an arterie in your hand it would spurt blood on to you with every pump of the heart. you can be hit by blood from a severed arterie from up to 2 meters away, major arteries can just pump out like garden hoses and the blood is dark.
no one in the pics seemed to be wiping the blood off of there hands onto there clothes, no stains, just a few, as the blood gets replaced with more and more from the injured.
edit on 20-4-2013 by PLAYERONE01 because: (no reason given)
edit on 20-4-2013 by PLAYERONE01 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 06:21 PM
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Ok i have been involved in some pretty full on things in my time some i'd rather forget, one thing i do know is that arteries when severed will spurt blood in unbelievable amounts, i mean that if you were trying to hold an arterie in your hand it would spurt blood on to you with every pump of the heart. you can be hit by blood from a severed arterie from up to 2 meters away, major arteries can just pump out like garden hoses and the blood is dark.
no one in the pics seemed to be wiping the blood off of there hands onto there clothes, no stains, just a few, as the blood gets replaced with more and more from the injured

First I want to say that I am sorry you had to expirence that.

Im not saying its not possible, but in traumatic complete amputations it is common to not bleed at first. This fact is easily proven I linked one source. Partial amputations are more likely to squirt blood

Arterial blood is bright red, as it carries the oxygenated blood from the heart to the body. Dark red is venous blood

edit on 20-4-2013 by cavscout11cav because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 06:35 PM
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Originally posted by Danbones
here can you tell if this real or memorex?


More than 800 emergency responders participated in the simulated response to two explosions

incaseofemergencyblog.com... -center-site/

note the authors pic
if they said bombing victim or drill participant
at the end of the tube all we know is what they give us
edit on 16-4-2013 by Danbones because: (no reason given)


www.abovetopsecret.com...

two explosions, drill, actors..fake injuries, fake blood
naw
never happen
edit on 20-4-2013 by Danbones because: (no reason given)
edit on 20-4-2013 by Danbones because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 06:43 PM
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reply to post by cavscout11cav
 


Thank you for explaining these injuries. Your Op is greatly appreciated in that it is well written, well thought out, and informative. Unfortunately, during these events, things get misunderstood, thus creating non effective conclusions, and thought processes. Often common sense is tossed out the window, in a effort to justify imaginary , or inconclusive convictions, without forethought. We all are in this together, one planet, one food source, one species. We cannot get off this rock, and it would be in our best interest to begin with each other, in an effort of extreme politeness, kindness and patience. Your Op explains a lot of questions. Thank you again for all your explanations, and for taking the time to give us facts as to the majority of these injuries.



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 06:46 PM
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Originally posted by Danbones

Originally posted by Danbones

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Originally posted by Danbones
what reality are you in sir?

A pragmatic person who is the pure definition of a skeptic. Look it up.


here can you tell if this real or memorex?


More than 800 emergency responders participated in the simulated response to two explosions

incaseofemergencyblog.com... -center-site/

note the authors pic
if they said bombing victim or drill participant
at the end of the tube all we know is what they give us
edit on 16-4-2013 by Danbones because: (no reason given)


www.abovetopsecret.com...

two explosions, drill, actors..fake injuries, fake blood
naw
never happen
edit on 20-4-2013 by Danbones because: (no reason given)


And I suppose the three who died were actors, too?

These people have friends and family, acquaintances who KNOW them. The little boy, who was in third grade....what happened to him? Dad Faked his death? Don't you think people would notice something like that?

What possible motive would there be to "fake" the deaths and injuries? If this is a false flag, does it make sense that the government (or whoever) would take the time and money to set up such an elaborate scheme? When it would better serve their purpose to go for maximum carnage and chaos...far more believable that way.

Why fake a tragedy when you could have the real thing?



posted on Apr, 20 2013 @ 06:50 PM
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reply to post by cavscout11cav
 


yes, very true. and arteries can retract inside the victim.





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