Parents Sue School For Making Children ‘Religious Guinea Pigs’ — By Teaching Them Yoga

reply to post by Sandalphon

My national health service has just referred me to a stress reduction clinic. It is run in a secular environment by a neurophycologist.

It basically an 8 week course in mindful meditation. It's not about anyone trying to convert us to a new religion, but a scientifically proven way in reducing stress in patients, who are going through treatment for all manner of diseases.

No wonder why the bible belt has the fattest people in the USA

Perhaps the OP and the other misinformed contributors should inquire from a Hindu whether or not yoga is part of their "religion". They don't consider it stretching and breathing, much the same a Christian doesn't consider communion wine and cracker tasting. Let a school try and pull that one off, most of you would burn yourselves in the street in protest.

Yoga might sound exotic, but there are no scriptures nor religious lectures. So, I can't say that it might be considered as religious teachings. But, considering how far religious people want to control the bodies of people I'm not surprised. I hope some day we will respect humans more than imaginary creatures.

I'm from Norway and here there are muslims refusing their kids to get swimming education in school. As a result, a couple of muslim kids die every year during norwegian summer. I respect religion to a certain degree. When innocent kids die, I call it stupidity.

Perhaps they should rename the set of exercises. That might make this issue go away.

Originally posted by kingofmd
Perhaps the OP and the other misinformed contributors should inquire from a Hindu whether or not yoga is part of their "religion". They don't consider it stretching and breathing, much the same a Christian doesn't consider communion wine and cracker tasting. Let a school try and pull that one off, most of you would burn yourselves in the street in protest.

But see, that's a perfect example. I'm sure there are lots of people who like grape juice/wine and crackers. Many people eat them in their home for a snack. There's nothing religious about it. They aren't thinking about God while they are eating their snack -- it's just a snack. Now, you go to a church, and you have the priest and the whole religious ritual, and grape juice/wine and crackers take on a whole new meaning. This time, you ARE thinking about God.

It's all about the intent. If you are touching your toes and stretching your arms and legs while breathing deep, and you aren't thinking about any god, then you are just exercising. If you are doing these movements while meditating on a god, then it becomes religious.

Originally posted by Observor
Perhaps they should rename the set of exercises. That might make this issue go away.

You are probably right. Even though the westernized form of yoga exercise has been around for at least 30 years, we'll just call the whole thing something new. How about "boga", because it's a bogus form of yoga?

Originally posted by iwilliam
... We're talking about stretching and breathing here. Not prayers to some hindu god. How very ridiculous....

I am a Christian and I personally attend a yoga class regularly at my gym. I love it, and my yoga instructor is amazing. However, I must add that at the end of the yoga class the instructor has the class bow and "give honor" to ourselves, our bodies, the divine within us, one another, and the universe. How the class is taught depends very much upon the individual instructor. In my class, as a mature adult, I simply opt to not participate in that part. However, in a school setting it is a legitimate concern that a yoga instructor might throw in a bit of this religious stuff here and there and the children would be influenced by it. What is taught depends very much upon the person who is teaching the class.

If this (bowing down in worship to oneself and the universe) happened in a yoga class with young children I would be appalled. If it happened in a class of teenagers, I would be concerned about it. Though I know my kids would be able to discern this was inappropriate, other teens might go right along. It wouldn't be right, primarily because it is the parents role and not the school to engage in religious instruction.

1- Some martial arts could be considered just as much a part of Asian spiritual practice as yoga is, to Indian spiritual practice. But I doubt some of these same parents would freak out about kung fu classes....

I have a friend who is ordained, has a law degree, and is also a ninth degree black belt and owns a karate dojo. He encountered so much opposition to his involvement in karate at the church where he was a member that eventually he left and started his own church.

I only add this to illustrate that there are plenty of Christians who would also object to karate classes.

Again, I personally have no objection to adults taking such classes. They can make their own decisions. But the school had better be very, very sure that the instructor isn't slipping in a bit of spirituality here and there. Because it does happen, and I understand the parents' concerns. Though I wouldn't start a lawsuit about it unless it was an egregious violation.

reply to post by kingofmd


It doesn't matter how Hindu's use yoga or if they've incorporated it into their religion. Here in the US, unless you are actively seeking out the religious aspect, it is a physical activity consisting of breathing and stretching, nothing more.

Originally posted by WhoKnows100
Yoga means "to be yoked". It means “binding two together.” When one practices yoga, he is calling to the spirits to enter his body and mind and possess them - Not Jesus Christ nor your Creator, but with the Hindu gods. I do not think that people are understanding this major point. It is a form of meditation. Inherent in yoga is the Hindu belief that reality (everything around us) is an illusion. In its original purpose, yoga, with its various pos-
tures and mantras is meant to be an act of worship to Hindu gods. Although Westernized, the purpose has not changed. Yoga claims to lead a person to the “Truth,” which the seeker discovers requires a re- nunciation of reality and a submission to a spirit Force. You may THINK that it is harmless and merely exercise because that is exactly what it has been sold to the west as - a harmless stress reducer. But just because it is labeled as such here, does not remove nor change what it is - a religious practice of worship. Likewise, contemplative meditation is sold to the descendants of Christians as mere relaxation techniques - YET, Buddhism cannot be practiced without mindfulness meditation.

Just because an old culture gave a name and a description to a series of body orientation positions that sound spooky to a bible thumper does not mean it is anything but exercise. Again, those aspects only matter to those who feel it matters to begin with. I like crackers. I like wine. I've had both at the same time, but I certainly didn't feel it was communion. See the difference yet?
Really, I promise, the boogieman & it's henchmen do not actually exist to take over a person working out. Come on now.

When are parents going to see their child bowing in a yoga posture and realise that they are allowing the indoctrination of their child into worshipping gods which are NO GODS and yoking them to spirits? When will parents wake up to the fact that Jesus Christ, the Saviour, was kicked out the front door whilst the serpent and his lies were brought in the back door? According to scripture, it truly will be like the days of Noah - the majority not knowing anything until the rain started to fall.

This is just so patently stupid & ignorant that I don't know where to begin. If you're a religious individual, then you should have some decent level of faith to begin with, right? I mean, if you're indoctrinated & solid enough in your belief structure, you have nothing to fear from making a few strenuous poses, working some muscles, building some endurance, and burning some calories. Is this just the bigoted man's way of saying "It's FOREIGN! I don't wanna see foreign stuff!"?

The question is this - next time you see the word "yoga" think about WHAT it signifies. Yoked with the Hindu spirits in worship of them. Then question why you clap and shout hip hip hooray at the removal of Jesus Christ, the Son Of God, the Word Made Flesh, from your children's lives - yet you are willing to believe that those same darn leaders and teachers bringing Hindusism and Buddhism into the vacated school have your children's best interests at heart. Do they have that much power over you as they say "see little Johnny bowing to the false gods? Isn't it cute? Don't worry, trust us, we have his indoctrination under control."

Yeah, no. The next time I see the word "yoga", I'm going to continue to see the only other method of exercise aside from swimming that is low-impact enough on my lungs, and yet high-impact enough on my muscles to do anything without me wheezing from exercise-induced asthma. I cannot run. Biking induces wheezing after a while. I do NOT want inhaler meds. Swimming is not always optional, the beach is a ways off and pools aren't always available. This notion might vex the crap out of you considering the spiel you just gave - - I'm going to see if the book I used to use for pose instruction is still in print. Ashtanga did me a world a good, and I could use it's benefits after a few years of slacking like crazy. I have nothing to fear other than some initially sore muscles. If you want to crawl under your blanket & quake with fear of the exercise demons, be my guest.

reply to post by Kali74


I totally agree with you, but keep in mind that Christian fanaticism takes religion to a whole new level. They're insane! I know because many of my relatives on my mother's side are totally absorbed in their religions, the Bible is the only book that holds the truth, and cannot be questioned period. So to them Yoga, or any other form of physical relaxation such as meditation for example, are deemed Satanic. The funny thing is that there is no mention in the Bible referring to meditation being evil. In fact, the Jews meditate on scripture just as the Orthodox Christian monks on Mount Athos. This whole idea that Yoga is evil, is a man-made concoction. Yoga is something that originated in the East, and to them anything that is non-Christian, is deemed wrong and therefore a construct of the devil. They are not intelligent enough to know that even Jesus Christ meditated on prayer. He may have even received religious training from Hindu Swamis during the missing 30 years of his life. How else would you be able to explain him being enlightened? Point in fact, his teachings are very similar to Buddhist doctrine, which is to love your neighbor, refrain from violence and accept everyone as equals. Unfortunately, as I mentioned earlier not many Christian pastors are educated, and if they are, they are very close minded as well as seriously paranoid. Not to insult any Christians out there, but seriously the world does not exist in a bubble. We live in an enormous universe with endless possibilities. Being so close minded does not allow for free thinking and being open to new ideas.

Star & Flag for starting this post.

I may be a tad biased on this subject as I am yoga instructor myself...but if teaching a "stretching & breathing" class to our young people in PE class is determined to be pushing a religious doctrine on them I truly am missing something.

Without a video or transcript of this class we do not know what is being taught to these children. That being said if you have ever walked into a yoga class at your local fitness club you would see it is a far cry from "religion" more like a grueling exercise session (somewhat like boot camp) being passed off as yoga.

There is a huge gap between the definition of yoga from an East vs West view of the practice. I think if you are offering a program using postures and breathing to spark some interest in getting these kids moving then more power to the school. Everyone has their own interpretation of every situation and if there is the option to not have a child in this class that should be enough due diligence on the part of the school. Maybe the parents could sit in on couple of session to see what is being taught.

Now, after reading further into the article linked from the original post I can see there is an area of suspicion around the "funding" for the yoga program in "this particular school", and that may be the basis of the law suit.

Encintas schools accepted a $533,000 grant for the yoga classes from the Jois Foundation, which the conservative legal firm that filed the lawsuit claims is a religious organization. The attorney who filed the suit called the relationship between the foundation and the school district "improperly cozy."

source link:

www.nbclosangeles.com...

Simply offering the postures and breathing of yoga through schools should not be considered forcing a religion on anyone, but a harmless way to engage them in physical activity. To show an example of that, during the Super Bowl when the lights went out and the cameras were focused on the players doing stretches on the field my husband looked at me and said "Hey, they're doing yoga!"

As I mentioned before, there is not enough information given to determine what "this case" is about. Just my 2 cents worth.

Namaste,
YogaGinns

EUSD and Jois Foundation Respond to Concerns About Religious Yoga

In a news release the NCLP alleges that “the stated goal of the Jois Foundation is to promote the ‘gospel’ of Ashtanga,” which makes it unconstitutional to teach in a public school

According to the news release, the founder of Ashtanga Yoga, Sri Patthabi Jois [who passed away in 2009 at age 94], also known as Guru-ji, has been quoted on numerous occasions saying: “‘It is very important to understand yoga philosophy; without philosophy, yoga practice is not good, and yoga practice is the starting place for yoga philosophy.”

However:

But Baird says that EUSD has made sure to remove cultural contexts from the yoga classes.

“In an effort to make the program more ‘kid friendly,’ and to try and avoid creating controversy with some of our parents, we have removed the Sanskrit terms for some of the poses,” stated Baird, who added that Sanskrit is merely a language and not religious.

Some of the parents have objected to the use of Sanskrit in classes, according to Baird, but he stated “that would be comparable to saying that teaching Latin is promoting Catholicism or using Hebrew is teaching Judaism.”

Balancing a fine line between Ashtanga’s roots and parent’s concerns

In an effort to further placate concerned parents, Baird stated, “We have also removed pictures or artifacts from classrooms that might represent yoga's Indian roots.”

Despite these efforts to allay fears that Ashtanga is promoting Hindu concepts, Baird thinks that these moves don’t equate the school district removing religious concepts from the program.

“I don't really believe that we have taken religion out of the program because the only way to put religion into the program is to teach a religious philosophy and then incorporate the yoga into that philosophy. We are not doing this,” Baird stated.

Source

Non-religious.

Originally posted by woodwardjnr
You should watch the documentary Dharma Brothers. It's about the use of meditation and yoga in a maximum security prison in America. It was proving a success until the church found out and closed the project down. It's sad as it was working with the prisoners making them less violent in a volatile environment.

Really glad you posted this video, unfortunately it made me so pissed off that it was stopped I'm going to have to go and meditate!!!

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by kingofmd
Perhaps the OP and the other misinformed contributors should inquire from a Hindu whether or not yoga is part of their "religion". They don't consider it stretching and breathing, much the same a Christian doesn't consider communion wine and cracker tasting. Let a school try and pull that one off, most of you would burn yourselves in the street in protest.  

But see, that's a perfect example. I'm sure there are lots of people who like grape juice/wine and crackers. Many people eat them in their home for a snack. There's nothing religious about it. They aren't thinking about God while they are eating their snack -- it's just a snack. Now, you go to a church, and you have the priest and the whole religious ritual, and grape juice/wine and crackers take on a whole new meaning. This time, you ARE thinking about God.

It's all about the intent. If you are touching your toes and stretching your arms and legs while breathing deep, and you aren't thinking about any god, then you are just exercising. If you are doing these movements while meditating on a god, then it becomes religious.

edit on 24-2-2013 by kaylaluv because: (no reason given)

Yogi poses are dedicated to specific gods in Hinduism. Therefore ANY person doing that pose, whether they are cognisant of it or not, is prostrating themselves to a religious idol. How do you think indoctrination occurs? Despite western marketing to the contrary, that yoga and meditation are harmless stress relievers,  Yogic postures, breathing, and chanting were originally designed to being a sense of oneness with Brahman—the Hindu word for the absolute being that pervades all things. This is pantheism (all is divine), not Christianity. No matter how many times the western pushers of Hinduism and Buddhism state "it's not religious, but spiritual", what are the school boards doing bringing in worship practices of Hindus and Buddhists whilst denying Jesus Christ?

But it's not just yoga. Goldie Hawn, a known Buddhist, has developed a load of educational tools now being brought into schools - and all the techniques are Buddhist.  We are SO NAIVE and blind. Our kids are doing deep breathing exercises, visualisation and meditation and the parents, devoid of the Word of God, just trust the educators and teachers. Was it not the teachers and leaders of Judea that swayed the crowds to crucify Our Lord Jesus Christ and release a murderer, insurrectionist and thief? Go to India and see the reality of these practices - rampant bisexuality, caste systems, people taking a poo on the side of a busy road and wiping with their hand, bathing next to dead human bodies, a horrible horrible religion which thinks that SUFFERING is deserved because of Karma so they are left to rot and suffer....but yet the west only sees beautiful people sitting blissfully in lotus positions with a beautiful sunset behind them in every poster that we see. Why? You can't sell a lie with the truth. You must make the people desire it and only see benefits - not the reality. 

The goals of Eastern and occult meditation are to change a person’s view of “self” and the world. In the end, as far as the meditator is concerned, “It lastingly changes his consciousness, transforming his experience of himself and his universe.” Any Hindu or Buddhist will tell you this. Buddhism, sold as the most "tolerant" religion on the planet, maintains that ALL WILL EVENTUALLY BECOME BUDDHIST. That isn't tolerance, it's crafty patience. Do you know that Buddhists have  end of the age writings? Go read up. It's not pretty for non-Buddhists.

 we are told this inner secret of the yoga objective:
“Yoga is the progressive elimination of conscious- ness in order to secure pure Self-awareness. This consciousness must be reduced to ashes, its seeds sterilized so as to render all future consciousness impossible.

Render all future consciousness impossible. That is YOGA. Go see a master yogi sitting for years in nappies being spoon fed daily because his mind is gone. Instead of Nirvana, I would have no hesitation in saying that he's in the pits of hell. And you still think getting kids comfortable and accepting of yoga and meditation is harmless?

Jesus said to his disciples: "Things that cause people to sin are bound to come, but woe to that person through whom they come. It would be better for him to be thrown into the sea with a millstone tied around his neck than for him to cause one of these little ones to sin." Luke 17:17-18

That is a promise to every single one of us that we'd best take to heart. Educate yourselves about what is being brought into the schools. It's all eastern religious techniques, westernised in name. It's not just yoga, but meditation, visualisation, breathing exercises etc. Yoga aren't natural positions because they are designed for meditative altered conscious states.

Children should be taught a level of "free-will"...why should parents be able to dictate almost everything their child does?

So what if its part of our culture.... Are you folks just not going to stretch yourself and bend your self that way next time being afraid its part of some "Hindu indoctrination" ? Maybe you folks should learn Yoga to avoid doing all those poses by mistake....

This is just ridiculous. This lawyer is simply a moron in my opinion, and so is the family. The only way this should even be an issue is if the classes were mandatory. If the kids do not have to participate, then there is absolutely no reason for a freaking lawsuit. This is a frivolous suit if I've ever seen one, and I hope the parents end up having to pay out their butts after they lose this case.

And what the west considers yoga is not religious by any means. This is because the west does not practice true yoga, in the religious sense that it is used overseas. Not even close. This is just facepalm territory.

Originally posted by Kali74
reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

 

They aren't just Hindu that's the point you're missing. Yoga can be nothing but movement, it can be Christian, Hindu... anything and nothing. There's no hypocrisy here and since you went and blamed it all on me because I'm not hard right, I happen to think prayer should be allowed in school, for all religions, for anyone wishing to do so... but that's beside the point since yoga has squat to do with religion.

No, I am not missing the point at all. I started yoga and meditation around 1975 and have been to India and been initiated by genuine Brahmins. Yoga is for one thing...that is Union with the Divine. It matters not whether it is a physical yogasana, pranayama(breathing exercise), meditation, or doing good works for balancing karma. I have already listed various types of yogas. I have already explained that just because someone is not teaching the vedas actively does not mean hatha yoga is not a spiritual discipline.
What if one were to walk around a school campus wearing a white Pontiff hat and swinging a frankincense burner around but they do not make comments or verbal prayers to Christ? Would you say that is a religious practice or not?
Bodhidharma, the founder of Shaolin Kung Fu, also taught exercises to the monks to help them be healthier. You can find that the martial applications are hidden within the movements of the forms.

Again I am going to invoke the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali

"The posture of yoga is steady and easy," Patanjali says. Patanjali compares this to resting like the cosmic serpent on the waters of infinity. Although Westerners often consider the practice of asana or postures as an exercise regimen or a way to stay fit, Patanjali and other ancient yogis used asana to prepare the body for meditation. To sit for a lengthy time in contemplation required a supple and cooperative body. If you are free of physical distractions — such as your foot going to sleep — and can control the body, you can also control the mind. Patanjali said, "Posture is mastered by freeing the body and mind from tension and restlessness and meditating on the infinite."

www.yogamovement.com...

This site also lists the book "Light On Yoga" which I read as a teenager.

While I would say that although many yoga classes are devoid of teaching spirituality directly, every true yoga teacher knows what is at the base of the discipline.

The Sun Salutation alone incorporates bowing to the Sun. You can pretend it is not for that, but it is inherent within the pose.
Although most yoga classes do not incorporate teachings such as the yoga aphorisms of Patanjali, the practice is a spiritual discipline, just as kneeling in a Church is a spiritual discipline.
The Kundalini can be aroused when practicing hatha yoga. For this reason I say that the physical discipline can be directly related to a natural spiritual process.
Anyone who suggests otherwise is not being truthful to themselves.
However, many people practice yoga only for it's supposed health benefits.

My issue, as a lifetime yoga student, is not that yoga has spiritual discipline at it's base, but that seculars feel free to insert it into gymn routines, while demanding references to the Christian religion be entirely eliminated because of their hatred of Christianity.
This is my only issue with the program,that these people are using deception to promote New Age lifestyles while declaring Christianity to be unfit for schools.
I happen to think yoga is a marvelous practice, but it should not be promoted as an undercover New Age discipline while pretending to be otherwise.

In Buddhism, hand mudras are used to channel energies. Earth touching mudra is for grounding the energy to the earth. The Hand Mudras channel energy in a spiritual manner. There are chakras in the hands, as well as along the spinal column.

By the way, Sun Salutation incorporates the gesture of praying expressed in hand mudra

www.buddhas-online.com...