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Originally posted by jonnywhite
reply to post by QMask
Tetra50 and QMask...
Freedom from everything. What is that?
On the surface of it, the impression is childish. Very selfish. Don't children often say they just want to be left alone? Part of growing up is realizing that we can't do or say whatever we please.
But that's -this world-. This world has rules. It has limits. We have to follow them to live here. Growing up means learning these rules. BUT we're trying to imagine a different world.
A world where we're at least more free, maybe completely free.
So what does that mean? What's the result of -absolute- freedom?
Do we even want it if we had the chance to have it?
I"m not implying that we don't want absolute freedom. I'm not tryingto make a straw man that I can punch and break and then use as justification to reject your exploration of this.edit on 18-1-2013 by jonnywhite because: (no reason given)
Part of growing up is realizing that we can't do or say whatever we please.
This world has rules. It has limits. We have to follow them to live here. Growing up means learning these rules.
So what does that mean then? What's the result of -absolute- freedom?
Freedom from debt.
Freedom from fear.
Freedom from pain.
Freedom from death.
Freedom from obligations.
Your body is the first sphere of nonlocality for your consciousness, in a physical environment of layers......
Further, our lessons here, wherever that is, seem to be about the link and balance between our consciousness, identity, soul, however these fit together, and the physical realmwe experience with our bodies, producing feelings and/or emotions, which are the physical reactions our bodies provide and experience when effected by the environment, others, and/or actions or happenings....
I believe, as well, that "here" is designed in such a way that in order to survive, it appears we have sold our souls, or gone against the nature of life, or committed some crime against other life, to both show that we belong here and that life is itself, evil, inherently.
Think about it: the design, as you described it OP, for our survival in the environment, is that we must at some point, in some way take the energy from another living thing in order to continue on ourselves. This is just speaking to the basic needs part of your description. Taking it further, it seems increasingly we must absorb or destroy anothers' opportunities in order to achieve more than survival. It is one of the reasons our structure of popularly viewed success is scaled most efficiently by the sociopathic.
But I have to doubt that it would really change anything since it's hard for me to imagine a reality where my actions cannot impact others
I can't imagine a reality where there's no conservation of energy. As in, I can't imagine a reality where things don't run out or do not have limits. Just as I can't imagine having a name if I'm infinite. How can something that has no beginning or end have a name? I think that since there's probably no such thing as infinite resources for everyone forever then there'll always be rules placed on things. And since there're always rules then there's no absolute freedom. Only a measure of freedom.
If you think that I am naive in the extreme that is you trying to define me. The only way you could be right is if I accept your definition of me and I don’t.
Also, this: you can only be defined by others if you allow them to, you wrote.
I find this extremely naive, without meaning any offense. There are many ways we are perceived and defined by others, without allowing this at all.