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Dual Citizenship

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posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 09:59 AM
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I met a woman in her 60s. She told me that she has dual citizenship, both USA and India. She was dressed in a sari. She said that she and her husband came to the US because he got a job. They had kids and raised them in America.

They used to visit India every few years as their kids grew up. Now that her husband is retired they alternate spending 3 years in America and 3 years in India.

She told me that India allows dual citizenships to people born in India. Her kids are not elligible. She and her husband are not allowed to vote (but she never said which country they couldn't vote in.)

As a kid I had dual citizenship because I was born of American parents in Germany. My birth cirtificate is in German. I always assumed dual citizenship was a kid thing.

Does the US allow people to become a citizen and retain citizenship in another country?




posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 10:04 AM
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Originally posted by NotThat
I met a woman in her 60s. She told me that she has dual citizenship, both USA and India. She was dressed in a sari. She said that she and her husband came to the US because he got a job. They had kids and raised them in America.

They used to visit India every few years as their kids grew up. Now that her husband is retired they alternate spending 3 years in America and 3 years in India.

She told me that India allows dual citizenships to people born in India. Her kids are not elligible. She and her husband are not allowed to vote (but she never said which country they couldn't vote in.)

As a kid I had dual citizenship because I was born of American parents in Germany. My birth cirtificate is in German. I always assumed dual citizenship was a kid thing.

Does the US allow people to become a citizen and retain citizenship in another country?


Sure they do... Just ask the 100's of US / Israel dual citizens in the US Congress / Government.



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 10:10 AM
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reply to post by RocksFromSpace
 


That is funny, but why is the first response to anything here on ATS a joke?

The joke would have been OK except the jocker never answers the question.



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 10:15 AM
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reply to post by NotThat
 


Short answer, yes. You were born in Germany so you cannot lose that nationality unless you renounce it formally. Here's a State Dept. link that explains it pretty well.

travel.state.gov...



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 10:19 AM
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reply to post by NotThat
 


What are you talking about!? Of course dual citizenship is okay, regardless of the example given. Just google it.

I've been living outside the US for more than half my life now, though I was born and still retain only my US nationality. When I moved abroad, dual citizenship was *not* allowed and when the law was changed, not only did our beloved Vice Consul at the embassy lie to me (saying that I could *theoretically* have both) but the law was also changed in the country where I live to disallow dual citizenship by the time I found out about the liars. So anyway my three children are all dual nationals and they do not have to choose which nationality to retain at any point. They are equally citizens of both countries.



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 10:22 AM
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When I became a citizen in the US at the age of 25, I was told I had to renounce the citizenship of my country of birth. Rules are different for people born in the Us or to US parents though.

Like, I was told I could lose citizenship under certain conditions, because I became a citizen as an adult, but my daughter who was already born in the US could never lose it.

I distinctly recall that the US said if I take up the citizenship of another country, that may be the cause of them filing a suit against me to deprive me of citizenship.

I must add that when I got my citizenship, my country of birth was already good friends with the US and stayed that way ever since.

However, other countries have different laws which sometimes allow citizens to be dual, and they will not notify the US of a list of their citizens, due to their own privacy laws. Nor does representatives of the the US inquire about you unless you are an internationally wanted criminal.



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 10:34 AM
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Originally posted by WmassCrooner
reply to post by NotThat
 


Short answer, yes. You were born in Germany so you cannot lose that nationality unless you renounce it formally. Here's a State Dept. link that explains it pretty well.

travel.state.gov...


I thought that when you became a citizen of the US that you renounced your citizenship to another country. My son-in-law had a difficult time giving up his country of birth.

Thanks for the web site.



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 10:37 AM
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Originally posted by CosmicEgg
reply to post by NotThat
 


What are you talking about!? Of course dual citizenship is okay, regardless of the example given. Just google it.

I've been living outside the US for more than half my life now, though I was born and still retain only my US nationality. When I moved abroad, dual citizenship was *not* allowed and when the law was changed, not only did our beloved Vice Consul at the embassy lie to me (saying that I could *theoretically* have both) but the law was also changed in the country where I live to disallow dual citizenship by the time I found out about the liars. So anyway my three children are all dual nationals and they do not have to choose which nationality to retain at any point. They are equally citizens of both countries.


She said that her kids were American citizens only. She also said that she became an American citizen and was able to keep her Indian citizenship. I found that interesting.



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 10:44 AM
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Originally posted by NotThat
reply to post by RocksFromSpace
 


That is funny, but why is the first response to anything here on ATS a joke?

The joke would have been OK except the jocker never answers the question.



isnt that what this thread is really about though (US/Israelis in Congress)? why else would you come to ATS to ask this question?

also- I have US/Canadian citizenship. the US allows dual citizenship with only certain countries. being born into Canada (until recently anyhow) made that person a Canadian/British citizen automatically.

I was born in the US- my father in Quebec. Canada has a law (since 1980 I think) whereby if one of your parents was born in Canada, you can can apply for citizenship. at the age of 35 I filed for Canadian citizenship, paid the fees, and received a citizenship ID. I have yet to use it for anything- even identification- but its like a get-out-of-jail-free card to me.
edit on 5-1-2013 by IandEye because: clarification



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 10:49 AM
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reply to post by NotThat
 


yes.

I am a dual citizen of Spain and the US.

Spain allows the first generation (male, yeah..?) children of a natural born Spaniard to be eligible for Spanish citizenship. You have to be registered in the consulate by your parents if a minor, or you can do so before your 18th birthday, I think. It may have changed.

If I had to chose, I would opt for the US hands down though. Most people would.


edit on 5-1-2013 by zedVSzardoz because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 12:24 PM
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reply to post by NotThat
 


I can retain my American citizenship and take Finnish citizenship if I like. There's no problem with that. I had a problem with our lying, worthless wankers in the embassy. The law is the law but they pick and choose who they will minister to fairly or not-so-fairly, in precisely the same way as all embassy staff do the world over. If you want to see a huge waste of tax dollars, visit your country's embassy abroad.

The nationality laws are reciprocal, for the most part. But it's never cut and dried, there are always twists and turns along the way. You don't find them out until you start doing the paperwork.

I worked in Consular in another government's embassy for some time. It's very complicated stuff. But generally speaking, the nationality conveyance laws are pretty standard. For some countries it extends back a few generations even, like Ireland and (now) Finland, for example.



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 12:46 PM
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Originally posted by NotThat
reply to post by RocksFromSpace
 


That is funny, but why is the first response to anything here on ATS a joke?

The joke would have been OK except the jocker never answers the question.

The "Joker" answered the question, and the answer was no joke.
In essence he/she is saying YES, not only can you have dual citizenship, you can be a lawmaker for the USA while your loyalty is split between the USA and another country. Fishy business, that.



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 01:01 PM
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reply to post by NotThat
 


Yes. Not only that but many of our high level government officials, have dual citizenship. For example:www.abovetopsecret.com... Richard Perle. Michael Chertoff, and many others.
Personally, I think people with dual citizenship should not be allowed in any sensitive, policy making, role in the Federal Government. They have dual loyalties, which could cause a conflict of interest in our country.www.abovetopsecret.com...
edit on 5-1-2013 by hypattia because: more info



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 03:17 PM
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It's simply not true that you have conflicting loyalties. You're subject to the laws of both countries and basically treason is treason no matter whose side you're on. Because you are loyal to one country does not mean that you would do something to hurt another country.

I suspect we would all have some regrets in the event of war between those countries, but that doesn't mean that treason is an option in any case.

What do you say about people who hold three or more passports? It's not that uncommon.



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 03:30 PM
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I do not have a problem with Dual Citizenship UNLESS said holder of both is in high levels of Government; the President, VP/President Pro Tem of the Senate, Speaker of the House, WH Chief of Staff and Cabinet Level heads and Ambassadorships. Then there would exist an unacceptable conflict of interest....one could even extend that restriction to all Congressional Committee Chairs without a peep from me.



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 03:36 PM
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I have often thought of the improbable situation of a war between Spain and the USA, or being elected into office of any sort in the USA. I have come to the conclusion that although not mandatory, I would only feel right if I renounced one.

You can be a dual citizen without any conflict but the prospect of sharing state secrets, or using any sort of political power to aid another foreign entity is disloyal to the majority of the country that is not a dual citizen of that country.

It is easier if they are allies, but I still think that even among allies, there should be a line drawn. We will not be allies for eternity. Hopefully we will, but realistically, even Europe may one day be at war with the US, or even Israel.

If you hold any sort of office, I think you should renounce your external nationalities. I also would renounce if a state of war existed between the two countries. Like if I was Iranian now, I would formally renounce my Iranian nationality if I wanted to live in the US.

I dont know, It is not a rule, but you should do it anyways. I would want to.

edit on 5-1-2013 by zedVSzardoz because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 07:10 PM
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Originally posted by CosmicEgg
It's simply not true that you have conflicting loyalties. You're subject to the laws of both countries and basically treason is treason no matter whose side you're on. Because you are loyal to one country does not mean that you would do something to hurt another country.

I suspect we would all have some regrets in the event of war between those countries, but that doesn't mean that treason is an option in any case.

What do you say about people who hold three or more passports? It's not that uncommon.


I was thinking about someone like a dual citizen, Kissinger. If Israel and the U.S. became enemies(God forbid) what then? How much influence do our policy makers, law makers, have on our international policies, wars, etc?
edit on 5-1-2013 by hypattia because: grammar



posted on Jan, 5 2013 @ 07:29 PM
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Originally posted by Kokatsi
When I became a citizen in the US at the age of 25, I was told I had to renounce the citizenship of my country of birth. Rules are different for people born in the Us or to US parents though.


Yeah, they did that with my old lady, too. However, being British, she cannot lose her British citizenship by renunciation.

The way it works is, you notify the British embassy that you plan to do an end run. Then you renounce your British citizenship by oath, and accept your newly earned US citizenship at your naturalization ceromony. They take your British passport and destroy it.

Then you go to the British embassy and get a new one. Voila, a dual Brit-US citizen.

You can do it the other way, if you're born a US citizen you can get a dual elsewhere, especially if it's someone they like, like Australia. You cannot, however, do so and retain a higher level security clearance. I think you can keep S but not TS.



posted on Jan, 6 2013 @ 11:44 AM
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reply to post by hypattia
 


What difference does it really make at the end of the day? We can look at that in any aspect of society. If there are a lot of Catholics lobbying against certain personal choices, then we have to assess their influence in the shaping of our personal freedoms, don't we? What about corporate interests? They certainly outweigh even national interests at present.

Things simply need to be put into perspective. I live in Northern Europe and have done for over a quarter century. I lived slightly less time in the US but was born and raised there. Where do my loyalties lie? My loyalties lie with planet Earth. There is no country that treats the citizens with the respect they deserve. Laws in no country are made with the good of the people in mind. Not one country is above harming its citizens should said citizens decide to change things from the ground up. But who is a country? It's the citizens. It's not the government or the corporations or the weather. It's the people. Planet Earth is planet Earth: She cannot be chopped into bits for our ego's sake.

The people can decide where they are divided or united. We accept this nationality crap I cannot for the life of me fathom why we do it though. It's stupid and absurd, at its very best. At its worst....look around you.



posted on Jan, 6 2013 @ 08:09 PM
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also- I have US/Canadian citizenship. the US allows dual citizenship with only certain countries. being born into Canada (until recently anyhow) made that person a Canadian/British citizen automatically.

I was born in the US- my father in Quebec. Canada has a law (since 1980 I think) whereby if one of your parents was born in Canada, you can can apply for citizenship. at the age of 35 I filed for Canadian citizenship, paid the fees, and received a citizenship ID. I have yet to use it for anything- even identification- but its like a get-out-of-jail-free card to me.
edit on 5-1-2013 by IandEye because: clarification



I think that means that you are no longer a US citizen. Check out the web site.






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