White House Vigil: Dozens Plead With Obama For Gun Control Action, page 1


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ATS Members have flagged this thread 4 times
Topic started on 14-12-2012 @ 10:56 PM by GrantedBail


reply posted on 14-12-2012 @ 11:03 PM by gladtobehere
reply to post by GrantedBail



Like the Patriot Act, torture, warrantless spying, suspension of habeus corpus, indefinite imprisonment, citizen kill lists, citizen assassinations, naked body scanners, the TSA, the NDAA etc.

Confiscating guns...

These guys mean business.


reply posted on 14-12-2012 @ 11:07 PM by GrantedBail
reply to post by gladtobehere


You are so right. The agenda is so obvious. Funny (well not so funny) how the rest of the country doesn't get it. Man they got it down, dividing and conquering and all. Everyone is so busy being angry about the "war on Christmas" that they just don't get what is going on.

Just an aside: Is there fluoride in bottled water too? We are doomed.



reply posted on 14-12-2012 @ 11:09 PM by ShotGunRum
reply to post by GrantedBail




All of a sudden we have a gun control vigil.


Is this surprising to you? I feel like right wingers live in a world all of their own.

There are plenty of Americans that are anti-gun, even though that position is a minority of the whole population.


reply posted on 14-12-2012 @ 11:33 PM by digital01anarchy
Originally posted by ShotGunRum
reply to post by GrantedBail




All of a sudden we have a gun control vigil.


Is this surprising to you? I feel like right wingers live in a world all of their own.

There are plenty of Americans that are anti-gun, even though that position is a minority of the whole population.


The position is a stupid one. Why must responsible people be denied the right to own a gun because of action's not taken by them? why is it liberals think just by outlawing something they fix a problem? it hasn't worked with drugs or alcohol has it? You outlaw guns just watch the crime rates jump, armed robbery, home invasions ect. The criminals will have guns you will not! . I believe the problem is not enough guns had that guy walked into a school with a few armed adults he wouldn't have racked up the death toll. Lol what did the anti gun rule on public schools do? DId it stop the gunman? no but it stopped responsible adults from having anything to protect themselves or the children with.


reply posted on 14-12-2012 @ 11:33 PM by pheonix358
reply to post by Flatcoat


Yea, they took my Ruger 10/22 but I can go into any gun store and buy a bolt action sniper rifle of any caliber I choose.

The egotistical Police have guns, the criminals still have guns, we still have drive by shootings and armed bank robberies.

So, what changed, home invasions went through the roof as a crime wave.

P


reply posted on 15-12-2012 @ 03:33 AM by Xcathdra
reply to post by GrantedBail


This annoys me to no end...

Guns do not kill people... people kill people. If we are to use this idiotic argument then cars kill people and not the driver... Cars kill people and not the alcohol....

Gun control would not have prevented this incident from occurring since the weapons were legally purchased by the mother, not the son.

Gun control only affects those who abide by the law in the first place.

Criminals are assigned that title for a reason, and its not because they abide by the law.

What about knife control?
screwdriver control?
baseball bat control?


Any item can be used as a deadly weapon.

A knee jerk reaction by people running on emotion instead of common sense can create results that are just as deadly as as a gun itself..

The Torricelli principle comes to mind.. It has since been repealed (after 9/11/2001) but back in the mid 1990's it prohibited the CIA from doing business with any person who had a criminal link / background.

a rule banning CIA agents from employing any sources who may have done anything illegal.


Is this a tragedy? Absolutely...

Its a tragedy anytime a life is lost... Regardless if its from a gun or a motor vehicle accident or natural causes.

Until humankind can go down to the lake and walk on water, we will always be imperfect... as will our laws.


reply posted on 15-12-2012 @ 04:18 AM by justwokeup
reply to post by Xcathdra


"What about knife control?
screwdriver control?
baseball bat control?


Any item can be used as a deadly weapon. "


The above is true but the distinction is that these things can only be forced into a killing role in a limited way. They have purpose in society other than making people dead.

Guns are purpose designed to kill. Handguns and automatic rifles are designed specifically to kill people. The comparison to other things doesn't really add up.

Thats not to say i disagree with your sentiment though. Legislation made in times of high emotional stress is always bad. Attempts to rush through some radical change on the basis of this tragedy should be resisted. The time is not right to have the discussion in a sensible way.



reply posted on 15-12-2012 @ 05:21 AM by justwokeup
Originally posted by sonnny1
Originally posted by justwokeup



The above is true but the distinction is that these things can only be forced into a killing role in a limited way. They have purpose in society other than making people dead.





Before there were "guns", people killed with rocks,blunt objects, or their hands. People will always kill. There will be no shortage of dead people, and innocent victims. You could wipe EVERY gun off this planet, and still have the staggering numbers of dead. Look to history, to see how people have been murdered. People kill people. Not the objects that they use. ANY object can be used. I bet you many everyday objects have been used to murder. Look at Pol Pot saving bullets, and using Plastic Bags to suffocate his victims.Stalin using the lack of food, to starve his victims.3.3 million dead by it!

Humanity will never be civilized. That's what people need to realize, and understand. I shall say Morals and Principles have been declining steadily. The World has become Desensitized. Tragedy's are the Norm. Its sad.




If people want to kill people they can and will. Thats obvious.

The difference is in ease of achievement. You put a depressed teenager with a rock or a blade in a movie theatre and he can kill people. However unless he's Jason Bourne the amount of damage he can do is limited.

You put the same depressed teenager in the same movie theatre with an AK-47 and plenty of ammo and he can kill everybody.

Thats what the tool is designed to allow. Thats the primary function. Thats the difference.

I'm not american so i wont comment particularly on gun control applicability or not. However, as the discussion is had i think its fair that the difference between guns and other innocuous objects is recognised.

I also think (its being discussed now on another thread) that the reason our young people want to die in a blaze of murder and publicity needs to be examined as much as the tools by which they can achieve it. I personally think the media and the morally bankrupt celebrity culture its spawned in the western world is responsible for much of this.
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