Life-sized Noah's Ark launches!!

reply to post by mellisamouse
There are datings that suggest the Pyramids go back 10,000 years for original construction or a bit earlier. It varies and dating is such an imperfect thing. There is also still so much we don't know about the Pyramids. It's really exciting to know new things are still being found in and around the main structures as well as new Pyramids around the world.

reply to post by CALGARIAN


I have been reading your "answers" to things in this thread. You have to be taking the Pi$$. There is no way anyone could seriously believe the dribble you are putting forward. Your statements aren't even based on anything remotely resembling what the bible says. You just seem to make things up as you go along. We ask you questions based on logic and science and you answer with just utter dribble. From now on I believe you need to start supporting your claims with evidence. At least other religious folk on this site use the bible as a reference, you just seem to pull things out of thin air and expect people to buy into it. Either post supporting evidence or stop with the nonsense

Here's a photo of one of the T shaped stones found at Gobekli Tepe. Look at all the animals in groups carvied into the stone.



You can't help wondering that this ancient place of worship in such near proximity to the supposed resting place of the Ark in the "Mountainous regions of Araraat" might just have something to do with being a memorial in some way to the Flood or the Day of the Dead - still celebrated all over the Earth at Halloween or "All Souls Day" as I posted earlier.

Some of the animals carved on the stones at Gobekli Tepe do not and have never as far as we know existed in that area eg Jaguars.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by mellisamouse

 

There are datings that suggest the Pyramids go back 10,000 years for original construction or a bit earlier. It varies and dating is such an imperfect thing. There is also still so much we don't know about the Pyramids. It's really exciting to know new things are still being found in and around the main structures as well as new Pyramids around the world.

The problem is Science cannot date stone - they attempt to use organic matter found around the stonework to date it or they make assumptions based on the type of stonework.

For instance at Maes Howe in the Orkneys - the actual tomb is much older - with Viking graffiti added much later. It doesn't mean the Vikings built Maes Howe at all. This could be the same with other ancient monuments - they may have pre-existed the civilisations that re-used them, making them much older potentially.

Of course aslo IF the Flood took place & the enveloping fresh water bubble that protected the planet from Solar Radiation did fall to the Earth at the deluge, then radio carbon dating of older organic matter maybe giving false readings because of the radical change in the conditions they were found in.

reply to post by JB1234


If you believe in creationism how do you explain the current 10 million species of land based animals. God created everything as it is.

Rebuttal ?

reply to post by jasonl1983


Before the Flood we are given a few details of the descendents of Adam & Eve through their son Cain who was father to Lamech & the particular area of craftmanship/accomplishments they specialised in:-

(Genesis 4:19-22) . . .And La′mech proceeded to take two wives for himself. The name of the first was A′dah and the name of the second was Zil′lah. 20 In time A′dah gave birth to Ja′bal. He proved to be the founder of those who dwell in tents and have livestock. 21 And the name of his brother was Ju′bal. He proved to be the founder of all those who handle the harp and the pipe. 22 As for Zil′lah, she too gave birth to Tu′bal-cain, the forger of every sort of tool of copper and iron.. . .

You'll notice Tubal-cain specialised in tool making. It's easy just to imagine these were primitive tools he forged, because that's how we've all been programmed to consider ancient civilsations to be less advanced than we are - but then the evidence of ancient monuments actually makes a mockery of that - because they are in fact great feats of engineering. Remembering the 7 wonders of the Ancient World - only one of which still remains
the Great Pyramid of Giza in Egypt.

Of course I would imagine almost all of the pre-Flood stoneworks would have been destroyed, buried in sand & mud or sunk altogether.

reply to post by JB1234


with the undeniable proof that we evolved from homo erectus even the catholic church has come forward saying the story of adam and eve was a religious metaphor. Thankyou come again...
which discounts all references to linage, original sin etc etc etc even the vatican knows it is preaching dribble. why oh why do people still use the bible as historical evidence?????
I guess it beats having nothing at all

Originally posted by Hijinx
reply to post by JB1234

 

If you believe in creationism how do you explain the current 10 million species of land based animals. God created everything as it is.

Rebuttal ?

I don't really think this is the place so just a short rebuttal -

1. I'm not a Creationist - I do not believe that God created the Earth & life on it in a few days. The Hebrew word "Yohm" can have lots of meanings including a 24 hour day.

2. The Bible in Genesis merely sets out the order and the events briefly which took place in each Creative Period.

3. The very first verse of Genesis states in the beginning that God created the Universe & the Earth - that couldn have taken a Creator Billions of years.

4. If each "kind of animal" has the ability to adapt eg the Polar bear from a common ancestor "bear kind" within it's programmed genetic code the DNA - then why wouldn't we see the diversification of life?
When considering DNA & the genetic code I'm actually very much minded of the Psalmist's description of Life -

(Psalm 139:16) . . .Your eyes saw even the embryo of me, And in your book all its parts were down in writing,. .

.

Actually that descripton very much backs up science because it's true the DNA sequencing of all life is like a code written down in a book - it's mapped to each individual entity - what's more all of the DNA that lifeform requires to complete it's growth to the adult state is formed at conception.

5. Many molecular biologists are saying that there is so much information in living cells that it is very difficult to argue against a designer originally. Whereever we find information in the Universe - we know there is an intelligent agent behind it.

reply to post by jeramie


Who Estimates Noah was 10-12 ft tall??? Men were shorter in the past, not taller. The earliest man ( neanderthal) was estimated at 5'5" and that was many 200,000 years ago.. It's generally fluctuated up and down over the years. Around the time of the " Great flood" Men averaged around 5'8". Not that big, not that short, but no 12ft. The tallest man ever 8 ft 11 in Robert Wadlow Tallest person 1918–1940. Robert didn't live very long, this is because human bodies aren't designed to get that large. They just can't do it, quite often people this tall have enormous health problems usually related to their hearts.

A 12ft man!!! His heart would give out at an alarmingly young age.

Irregardless, if Noah was 12ft tall, and you believe in creation. Where did 2 of all the 10 million species of animals go? If god created the Earth and everything on it at the same time, and the great flood killed everything Noah didn't save. He had to have all 10 million right? Just using the religious logic here. That must have been some ark to house 20million animals feed and water enough to keep them alive for 40 days and 40 nights. Did you catch the stats to feed and water a single elephant for a day? for the trip? For two elephants? Okay, now what about the other 19,999,998 animals?

reply to post by JB1234


No you don't know and can't prove that there is a intelligent designer

reply to post by JB1234


Now you're bringing in evolution, at which point I will say this. Polar bears have been around long before the great flood. A LOT LONGER!. All of the 10 million land based species pre-date the flood. So were they on the boat or not? Polar bears can't swim for 40 days, or 40 nights. In fact, a polar bear in open water is doomed to death. They may be great swimmers but they can't swim with out a place to get out. This is actually a concern with the ice fields melting. Polar bears not only lose their hunting grounds, but those who get trapped out at sea will certainly perish.

No Land Animal can swim for that long, so 10 million species of land animals that predate the biblical flood. How did Noah build an Ark for all of them? He either did it as it was said, or he didn't.

Originally posted by Uberdavo
reply to post by JB1234

 

No you don't know and can't prove that there is a intelligent designer

And as even Richard Dawkins had to admit in a recent interview - the opposite is also true

No one can say how the Universe came into existence -
No one can say how life began on Earth -

I guess it all boils down to faith at the end of the day. Faith like Noah & his family had, who listened to God and
built an Ark, despite all the ridicule they faced in the process...

Hebrews 11:7. . .By faith Noah, after being given divine warning of things not yet beheld, showed godly fear and constructed an ark for the saving of his household; and through this [faith] he condemned the world, and he became an heir of the righteousness that is according to faith.

As Jesus stated( who I presume the Catholic Church still believe existed) Matthew 24:37-39 . . .

For just as the days of Noah were, so the presence of the Son of man will be. 38 For as they were in those days before the flood, eating and drinking, men marrying and women being given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark; 39 and they took no note until the flood came and swept them all away, . . .

reply to post by Hijinx


I didn't say that Polar bears could swim for 40 days & 40 nights ! I was merely using polar bears as an example as they had been mentioned by others...if you look back you'll see that!

The point being Noah didn't need to take a polar bear which is much bigger than other species of bear into the Ark.

Before the flood ALL of the same creatures may have existed - ALL I was stating was that the common kind that all of the creatures before the flood and afterwards could have descended from eg "a bear kind" would have been taken into the Ark.

That particular "bear kind" not the inividual species of bear would have needed to be in the Ark & the genetic programming contained within that common ancestor could have re-populated the Earth with all it's diversity once again when they returned after the Flood.

Science has just recently had to do a complete about turn regarding Junk DNA - because it now appears that the so called Junk - in fact did have a purpose. Life is a lot more complex than we have even begun to explore
and molecular biologists have only just started to tap into the information that the genetic code of every living thing contains.

reply to post by JB1234


We may not have any clue how the universe began but we have some pretty good ideas on how life came to be on earth. Here's an easy to digest video.



and more

reply to post by JB1234


Yes, life is much more complex than we had thought, but it doesn't change the fact for a regular bear to become a polar bear in the time since the biblical flood wouldn't happen. That kind of change takes a very long time, much longer than the time of the biblical flood.

There are even species that have gone extinct since that flood, so they would have had to be on the boat before the flood. You keep missing this point, these 10 million species are unique enough they would not have come to be since the flood. That kind of Evolution takes a looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong time.

reply to post by Hijinx


This is going way way off topic so I'm not going to continue debating these points - another time.

Abiogenesis (spontaneous generation) can't be proven - but Abiogenesis has been relentlessly exposed as a fraudulent claim by thousands of scientific experiments and observations. (Abiogenesis claims that life came from nonliving things.)

Therefore the Deists and Theists can also correctly claim that their belief in a God can be scientifically proven through the science of Biogenesis (life comes only from living things).

Stephen Meyer gives a fine rebuttal on Abiogenesis in these videos

reply to post by JB1234


Your explanation was amusing to say the least. You do realize when Noah's Arc was supposed to exist right? Long after there would be a base cat species or any other one for that matter. So again what animals were on this ship? How didn't they kill each other? Where was the food stored? Hmmmm I could continue, what's the point.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say....If I start seeing reports of paired animals showing up to this ark, I'm going to make my way there as fast as I can.

Originally posted by Uberdavo
reply to post by CALGARIAN

 

I have been reading your "answers" to things in this thread. You have to be taking the Pi$$. There is no way anyone could seriously believe the dribble you are putting forward. Your statements aren't even based on anything remotely resembling what the bible says. You just seem to make things up as you go along. We ask you questions based on logic and science and you answer with just utter dribble. From now on I believe you need to start supporting your claims with evidence. At least other religious folk on this site use the bible as a reference, you just seem to pull things out of thin air and expect people to buy into it. Either post supporting evidence or stop with the nonsense

Not everything needs to come out of the bible........

Air bubbles have been found in SAP and thousands of year old amber that tested with extremely high saturation of oxygen. I thought this was common knowledge taught in high school?

Originally posted by nosacrificenofreedom

Originally posted by abeverage
I have often wondered if Noah took 2 of ever local species as he could and then a regional flood took place. Not a world wide flood but one they have proven happened.

I do not believe that the entire world flooded or that Noah took 2 of "EVERY" animal, but there is something to the story as it shows up in many religions and stories.

That's a very interesting theory! I wonder how long it would have taken Noah and his sons to make something so enormous? To think, just the time it took to gather and shape all the timber, craft the tools, then whatever joining glues or nails they used! I don't think it could have been possible to do this in one lifetime! Nevermind to have the storage for the animals, then collect enough food for them! Quite improbable but for some reason I do feel that God does exist! So maybe there is more to the story of Noah! Maybe God kept noah and his family strong and young enough so they could work on the ark for long enough! Maybe they did'nt have to save every species! Maybe just enough species so the lord could manipulate them genetically! Whatever they case is, it has been shown that a great flood did happen many millenia ago!
I don't think it's by chance that there never is any undeniable proof and the more unlikely the story the more faith that is required! the more science shows us our past the more it seems that religion and science are divided!
I am not one of those that will deny facts and say the earth is only six or seven millenia old!
I am also not going to deny God and say there is no such thing! There is so many people that have had near death experiences! So many who were saved by angels! Some who experienced demons (possession)!
Who is arrogant enough to think we evolved without any guidance?
I never wanted to believe in God and for what I have been through it would have been much easier to believe that after we die we go to sleep! I feel that there is this connection, that something or someone has been protecting me! I have not always believed in a higher intelligents but i do now, I also prey to God and Jesus in times of stress and I've never understood why this comforts me! I am not trying to convince anyone to believe but am only validating my own experiences! I shall never understand why so many people seem like there is a hate for anything religious. Why they are so angry at those of us who believe! It's not as if i believe in the religious hierarchy but actually dispise the hierarchy and though i was born into the catholic belief system, i had stopped worshipping or believing in my early teens but about at my late 30s started to see there is more to life then meets the 5 senses! Today I would say I'm of the gnostic belief basically because of a lack of faith in humanity! We should all be equal in the eyes of man whether we are athiest, believer, bishop or pope as we should all be judged by our actions and not by our positions in the eyes of the lord as well!
Sorry for going off topic people but the existance of God has more relavance to this time then any Arc of the son of Abraham being remade for a tourist attraction!

Science will never prove or disprove God. My idea of a regional flood (the known world) does not negate my belief in God nor does some inconsitancies of times and dates and other things in the bible. The bible is a good book on certain ways to lead your life, but not accurate (at least to me) on the full nature of God. Faith comes from within not from without...