ATS and Freedom of Speech

Forgive me members, it has been over 4 months since my last rant.

I have noticed that there are quite a few threads being posted on the new changes that were passed on election day. It seems that members here are on a one track mind with the laws that were passed. Some of the OPs state 2 changes in different locations, but it is only one change being discussed. The fact that 3 States have passed same sex marriage is being completely overlooked and ignored in favor of breaking the T&Cs to discuss the other topic. The topic of same sex marriage is just as important if not more so, to a lot of people out there, but members here would rather scream "We have freedom of speech and you are censoring us" so I would like to dedicate this rant to the issue of "Freedom of Speech" here on ATS.

Where does it say we have the freedom of speech? Where does it say we have the right to say anything we wish? The answer to this is NOWHERE. We do not have the freedom of speech. The powers that be(the 3 amigos) have given us the freedom to complain and/or disagree as well as the freedom to say almost what we like, but that is just not enough for some people. I see in post after post about how we have the freedom of speech and quite frankly it is getting old.

In the United States, afforded by the Bill of Rights, there is the freedom of speech. It is documented, expressed, and upheld(for the most part). When asked, a Citizen of the U.S. can bring it up and show it as proof. Now this is not complete freedom of speech as other laws have been passed that define what that freedom really is. It is not universal on all topics of discussion in public arenas. One can complain all they want, but this is not going to change like it or not. Thus is the World we live in. Stating the government has no right to limit our speech is false because the can and do. It has been accepted by the Supreme Court and passed as Law also recognized, accepted, and enforced.

ATS is not the U.S. It does not recognize the rights granted to you as a citizen of the U.S. or any other country nor does it have to. It must follow and enforce laws and regulations regarding those placed on companies such as illegal activities that govern internet usage, but it has nothing to do with the rights given or not to you as a human being.

If a U.S. citizen were to travel to China they no longer have the freedom of speech as they are NOT IN THE U.S. One will be arrested just as easily as a Chinese National for breaking the law of THEIR land. Another example is all these U.S. citizens who are arrested in other countries think they have the right to and demand a phone call and an attorney. Guess what? They are not bound by those rights and can deny you these assumed rights. The only thing SOME countries must do is to notify your embassy of your incarceration because, and only because, that is what their laws state.

When you come to ATS you are not a U.S. citizen nor are you a British citizen, an Australian, a German or a South African. Your rights afforded by your government has nothing to do with ATS so stop trying to hold the staff to that criteria. You can say, " There SHOULD be the freedom of speech" or "You SHOULDN'T censor peoples opinions" but to say they must give you freedom of speech because it is your right or that they can not censor your posts is ignorant and arrogant. They have every right to create and enforce their own laws and regulations based on the way they want their site to be.

We should consider ourselves very lucky to have the freedoms we do have on this site but for some people this is just not enough. They want their cake and to eat it too, but guess what? The cake is a lie like it or not. Just because a law is passed in a few States does not change the laws here on ATS. Don't you think the 3 amigos and the rest of the staff are fully aware of the new laws that were passed? Don't you think that if they felt they should open the forums and agree amongst themselves the discussion should be allowed it would be? Do you honestly think the entire forum was closed due to a single infraction? No, it was closed due to repeated violations even after many many warnings to members to not discuss it the way the members were.

You do not have the right to freedom of speech. This is ATS law. They have the right to censor posts. This is ATS law. Stop trying to impose your countries law on ATS. Stop assuming you can dictate to the staff what your rights are because your country allows it in regards to how they enforce their laws. Stop being assumptive, ignorant, and arrogant and follow the laws set down.

I will probably get flamed for this, but I have written nothing but truth accept it or not, and if not be prepared to accept the consequences of your actions set down by those that give you the freedoms you do have. All I ask really, is that everyone stop and realize, we do have a lot of freedom on this site and because there are many other sites out there that do allow for discussions not allowed here, getting mad about the rules or pushing the limits to the staffs patience is immature, ignorant and arrogant. take some time to go to another site and discuss it to your hearts content then come back and see what you missed while you were at the neighbors place.

yeah you keep telling yourself that everyday....hey why dont you use those ideas in your daily activity as well? tell everyone around you what you want them to do. Even better, remind them of EVERY new law being passed by the supreme court and that we must obey them at all cost, Cause that's the law right?

reply to post by Agarta





I just u2u'd you.
I guess it didn't take long to get that response I mentioned.


Its ats not the USA people....get it yet??
The T&C is stated pretty clearly.

reply to post by DrumsRfun


T&C is what it comes down to.I completely agree with the OP. I don't know why some people get so riled up over a website.Personally I think this is one of the more relaxed sites out there which is why I enjoy posting here.Really though if people don't like it they're free to log out and never come back.They won't do that though,they'll just continue to complain.

Originally posted by BacknTime
yeah you keep telling yourself that everyday....hey why dont you use those ideas in your daily activity as well? tell everyone around you what you want them to do. Even better, remind them of EVERY new law being passed by the supreme court and that we must obey them at all cost, Cause that's the law right?

edit on 9-11-2012 by BacknTime because: (no reason given)

See that was the whole point to the rant and you missed it. This is a virtual country and has nothing to do with the rights or laws outside of it nor does ATS effect our personal physical life or its laws. Your post is not much more than a nonsequitor, It is apples and oranges but thanks for replying.

An easy and simple way to say this is:

Freedom of Speech means the government may not prevent your rants, sort of, but it has nothing to do with private property. ATS is private property.

Now, what don't you understand about this?

I used to (bring a brand-spanking new member) think that the lack of freedom of speech on ATS was a horrible travesty of justice. What? Censor our words? Never!

But then I became more familiar with ATS, and researched the why. Now I have no problem with the censorship, being an informed member.

We do have freedom of speech here, save it does not violate the T&Cs. The violations? Talking about illegal substances, harassing others, vile profanity, and solicitations. Feel free to add others, if you wish.

My point is this: The censorship is not to curtail what we have to say, it is to prevent chaos and unrefined conversations. It brings a certain quality, and pride, to what I read here. Anything that does get censored I can live without anyway.

When you realize that ATS is a family friendly site, and that certain activities are not accepted, you'll begin to understand how wonderfully awesome ATS actually is.

Thanks, Agarta. You perhaps should rant a bit more frequently.

Yes Agarta, it's quite simple.

This thread that SO authored explains the problem quite well and it's conclusions are the ones that we maintain.

ATS is a venue, not a platform. The venue has rules and regulations as this is as noted above, "Private Property", I like to call it the playground.

THere's a list of rules posted at the entrence, and we the mods sit around and make sure that you all are playing nice with each other. Never has ATS promised freedom of speech. The owners created a venue for people to discuss topics in a manner that is seldom found on the internet today, much less when it was first created.

.

~Tenth

Been here for seven years, two plus as a member, the last four plus a member of the staff here.

I've seen, at first hand, several of the attempts at discussing "that topic". It's failed every single time. It's over. Regardless of what laws are passed, where ever they're passed. They do not apply here. Sorry. Most of us wish it were otherwise. But the answer is, and barring some sort of cosmic happening will remain so, no.