US Soldier Intentionally Exposes His Position to Draw Fire Away From Squad VID

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posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 04:17 PM
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Originally posted by repeatoffender

Originally posted by MrWendal
I am curious....

For all those who are bashing this Soldier, may I ask how many of you have been involved in Combat?

I do not mean paintball, I mean real combat. Vietnam? Gulf War? Anything?

If you have not been in combat, I think your opinion on how he handled the situation holds very little weight.


Oh come on man, I cant stand how you guys do this.




may I ask how many of you have been involved in Combat?


Really,Really, thats like getting into a debate with a baker and him cutting you off saying " dude have you ever worked as a real baker, or french patissiere, worked from midnight till dawn? NO DIDNT THINK SO, so eat the cream bun and shut up, your not entitled to an opinion on my product"


Yes but odds are whos opinion is going to be more accurate? The person with training in the topic of discussion or someone who just blurted out a random thought that came to their head?


Further comparing baking to gun combat is a more than a bit silly.A hobbyist can learn a lot about cooking and excel at the the craft by reading books , watching shows and then practicing. Learn tactics in a gun fight isnt as easily accessible to the average person. So until rachel ray hosts her own special on how to to survive a fire fight and put together and m-16 i think its best people who haven't served do alot less talking and alot more listening to those who have seen combat.




posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 04:26 PM
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Heroic for sure, but as soon as he stopped moving I had a bad feeling he was gonna be hit. Maybe that's from playing so much BF2 lol



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 04:41 PM
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reply to post by loves a conspiricy
 



His squad clearly trained on Battlefield 3, "Im hit, MEDIC", no response. "I need ammo" *wanders off*

The same goes for his tactics, running out of cover on his lonesome then rolling around screaming like a girl.

Hero? I dont think so somehow. Idiot more like.


Idiot, huh?


Well....you’re welcome anyway! Go back and have a seat.

S&F Domo….Thanks for sharing.



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 05:36 PM
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Ah, the armchair quarterback debate – This is why I am against the helmet cams to begin a competent and thorough AAR can be conducted without every firggin field grade in the chain of command having the opportunity to weigh in on each Privates actions/inactions in every situation. Helmet cams are here to stay though and I am glad they were not SOP for other than the shoot house when I retired. In the shoot house when things happen in splseconds they help a lot teaching but are just an unnecessary pound of BS we don’t need. Maybe even on say some HVT raid like the OBL take down where its national level stuff.

Anyway, I have been in combat, close, far, in engagements that were initiated by me and those initiated by the Hajjis on me. It is always preferable to initiate since you know where the enemy is. My experience is in Special Forces – I was both enlisted and an Officer.

In my opinion this is one of those situations in which the enemy has opened up on a patrol of some kind from a position unknown.

I am not going to hold this Marine to the SF standard as a matter of fact I’m going to give him a break because I’ve been there and I have no idea what happened before or after the segment.

I know I don’t hear his team/squad leader...leading, if anyone should be criticized it’s him. We should be able to hear his voice as should this Marine. Hell, maybe he is the team leader sometimes in the Army they choose to carry the 203’s in a squad. If that’s the case he has had a Leroy Jenkins moment…

Honestly everyone has them – even highly trained and disciplined operators. For all the arm chair Generals out there firefights follow a pattern. The pattern is a little different if you initiate, the enemy does or if it’s a simultaneous one. This one appears to be enemy initiated to me. So the pattern is…

The first moment of terror when you realize you are being shot at and you have no cover. Then you breathe a sigh of relief when you find it. If it is your role you return fire in the general direction (say the SAW gunner or those designated as suppressive fire). The rest of the men are trying to figure out where the hell the enemy actually is. In cases like this one appears to be it’s a long distance engagement that can take quite a while. Unlike in the movies there are no dramatic flashes that tell you where the enemy is. So then there is the lull when the enemy realizes you have no idea where they are. You fire back sporadically – these engagements can go on for a long time and ammo is a finite resource. Sometimes during this period someone will get fed up with the not knowing part and have their Leroy Jenkins moment…which is what I think this guy is having.

That breakdown in reason when you just want something to happen and make a move toward the enemy. This should be a coordinated maneuver by fire and buddy teams initiated by the squad leader but again we don’t hear anything from this guys leaders which is probably why he is acting this way.

Once you actually locate the enemy then you need to figure out how best to maneuver against them using the terrain, your force and all your force multipliers like artillery and air cover. In this case the leader is silent so we don’t know what he’s doing but seeing the houses down there he’s not going to get a fire mission. He might get an Apache if they have on station.

After that it’s pretty standard fire and maneuver IMT and such until you get them followed by the friggin crash…if you’ve been there you know what I mean. There are a few things people noticed I will comment on though…

First is the fact that he sounds out of breath – this could be that he’s out of shape, or sometimes just so pumped with adrenaline you sound like that. Who knows, I’ll give him the benefit of a doubt.

Second was the magazine changes someone commented on that. They are indeed slow and sloppy, there are a few things this could be. Poor training, poor physical condition thus slowed reactions, or most likely he has been conditioned to fear losing magazines more than he fears making a slow sloppy change.

We see this in SF all the time when guys come first come to teams. Because at the school house you get eaten up for losing one. You have to counter that bad habit with drills. Sure you don’t want to just waste them all over the battle field but honestly he changed magazines while totally exposed – I’d just drop it and move on to cover... However, my SF team has a bigger budget than a Marine Company or even a Battalion most likely. Again, I give him the benefit of a doubt that he has been trained to not lose them to the point of risking his life for it. Not a good thing.

Then lastly is the fact he was hit in the vest. I have personally been struck in the back by a 7.62 round. That said, I also have to weigh in that it is not something one just shrugs off. I was knocked off my feet and very much out of breath, disoriented and out of action.



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 05:42 PM
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reply to post by Golf66
 



Ah, the armchair quarterback debate – This is why I am against the helmet cams to begin a competent and thorough AAR can be conducted without every firggin field grade in the chain of command having the opportunity to weigh in on each Privates actions/inactions in every situation.


Exactly, Sir. It is a bit silly we’re debating the actions of a soldier under duress via YouTube video!


I bet Chesty Puller, Dan Daley, Audie Murphy et al wouldn’t be as revered if we had all the armchair generals weighing in on their every move.

HELL, who am I kidding? They would all have been through Court Martial proceedings and been BCD’d or worse.



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 05:52 PM
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reply to post by seabag
 


Yea but he opened his self up for criticism when he put it up on youtube



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 05:53 PM
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reply to post by Golf66
 


Thanks for your insight and service.....



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 06:09 PM
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Originally posted by seabagI bet Chesty Puller, Dan Daley, Audie Murphy et al wouldn’t be as revered if we had all the armchair generals weighing in on their every move.

HELL, who am I kidding? They would all have been through Court Martial proceedings and been BCD’d or worse.


Well, I know Puller would have been court martialed for sure...

Anyway, in my opinion unlike in the movies where the high speed guys close with and kill the enemy in a coordinated and professional manner most combat - especially engagements you don't initiate are a comedy of errors and uncoordinated movements.

People trip and fall, and slide down the hills and bust their faces on cars - I've done them all those things mentioned personally. We had a guy slide like 400m down a rock face during a fight. This is in SF so let’s cut the Marines and Joes some slack I say.

I once was running for cover so hard I couldn't stop and ended up doing a full on baseball slide under the bumper of a truck and my rig got caught up on something. I was totally stuck there my legs and body up to my arm pits half under the truck. Making it worse my Afghani interpreter had to pry me out....

I didn't live that one down for a while. I got the broken arrow award for it. Given the person on our team who made the most dicked-up move that month. So glad that is not on you tube.

I like this Marine (speculating) am just glad the Taliban have crappy weapons and can't shoot well or I'd not be here today.



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 06:11 PM
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reply to post by Juggernog
 




Yea but he opened his self up for criticism when he put it up on youtube


You’re right….he most certainly did.

I still don’t think his heroism, knowledge, tactics or anything else should be ridiculed by people who have never experienced what he went through. But YES, he brought this upon himself.



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 06:23 PM
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reply to post by Domo1
 


I'll call this guy a Hero.
Although I argue against this Campaign, and possibly another in Iran, the "boots on the ground" should be commended for doing their Duty.
Hope he recovered well.



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 06:28 PM
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reply to post by jerico65
 





And you're basing this on how much combat experience? How many life and death decisions you've made while under fire? Yeah, thought so.


Does being in Drive-By cross fire count? It should bullets are still flying at you...Yeah, thought so.



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 06:35 PM
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post removed for serious violation of ATS Terms & Conditions



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 07:00 PM
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Haha,yea it seems he has a case of "John Wayne" syndrome. He just wasnt to good at it
edit on 27-9-2012 by Juggernog because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 07:26 PM
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From my perspective, I don't think he realized the seriousness of the situation until he got hit. At first he started off as an adrenaline junkie then when he got hit he realized it was a bad move on his part. I didn't see anyone coming to his aid towards the end.
edit on 27-9-2012 by Manhater because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 07:31 PM
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reply to post by Druscilla
 


Yeah, as a Veteran, I'm not sure what this soldier/NCO(pft, doubtful)/Officer was doing, but when you have contact, you better move your ass like you have a PURPOSE. "CONTACT LEFT/RIGHT, 8 O'CLOCK, XX METERS) Jesus, I was scared/pissed off the whole time.

Awesome firing position and buddy movement (sarcasm)...btw, where was your buddy? Hell, even light-birds walk around with a 3-man di**-sucking team in a Green Zone like Camp Liberty (or whatever its called now..Joint Base Balad).

Two words for this soldier: remedial training.

Lima-1, out.



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 07:32 PM
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reply to post by Druscilla
 


Everybody has an opinion and we know what opinions are like.

Experience, on the other hand, is not equally valid.
edit on 27-9-2012 by badgerprints because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 07:35 PM
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reply to post by Manhater
 


What he is, is an undisciplined pig.

If he would have been killed i would have been in a world of pissed off i have never been in before. Never have i seen such a break down of # discipline and a total disrespect to superiors.

HE CANNOT BE TRUSTED and TRUST is EVERYTHING.
edit on 27-9-2012 by milkyway12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 07:40 PM
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reply to post by Manhater
 



From my perspective, I don't think he realized the seriousness of the situation until he got hit. At first he started off as an adrenaline junkie then when he got hit he realized it was a bad move on his part. I didn't see anyone coming to his aid towards the end.


For the first time I will agree with you and star your post!


I think his intentions (based on the narrative we’ve been fed, of course) were heroic and brave (which they were). Were his actions stupid and foolish? YUP!

He figured it out quickly though, right?


That boy found the nearest rock after it hit him (no pun intended) that he was in the line of fire and the enemy was serious and fired real bullets.

I respect the guy for his effort. He deserves the respect of his peers.



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 07:43 PM
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So many points and emotions come from watching this I'll just leave a few words, there's no point trying to make sense of it all-

- Video games
- Henry Kissinger
- Global Mafia
- Drugs



posted on Sep, 27 2012 @ 07:58 PM
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Originally posted by Domo1
So language warning.



Where was Dick Cheney and George W. Bush when this was happening...





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