What is going on here?

reply to post by stumason


Yep I know we are in neighbouring counties and there are flight paths here probably Southampton and Bristol as well as London and loads of military bases.

...but they normally aren't anywhere as low and they keep to a pattern. Today they were very low and over all the sky...and more 'griddy' than normal.

reply to post by theabsolutetruth


Well, like I said before I don't usually see them quite like that either. I can only assume it is something to do with the hot air on the ground, with a layer of cool air above. it has been unseasonably hot past few days. I am just making an educated guess, but I assume the contrails will sit on the boundary of the hot and cold air, dispersing outwards, but unable to penetrate downwards.

Originally posted by stumason
reply to post by Uncinus

 

Aye, that is true.

Given the UK's position to western Europe, it makes sense we see many overlfights...

Indeed, check flightradar24.com and set a filter for 28,000 feet, you can see all the contrail-likely flights:

reply to post by stumason


Maybe....I will keep an eye to the sky for a few days to see if it happens again and check if the weather corresponds.

I am in Woking, Guildford UK and earlier on this evening I took a pic wondering the same, the skies are a mess!!!!!!!!!!!!

More pictures?
It seems the debate over lines in the sky is just
a venue, for both sides of the debate, to say hey look at my pictures of the sky on the internet.
Never addressing, what is going on, just a debate about pictures.
Its a pretty picture, a good record of current life on planet earth.
And just like cave paintings of the past,
the debate can go on, far into the future.
What were these primitive people trying to convey?

reply to post by TheSparrowSings


What has seeing upper air routes miles away from airports got to do with anything? Why is this mis-perception so common on 'Chemtrail/Contrail' threads? Aircraft utilise upper air routes. Check out the J and Q routes in the US/Canada. Perhaps then you can understand that aircraft utilising such upper air routes can cross over, under and fly side by side and even cross within the air route and still remain legally separated by Air Traffic Control. Also military aircraft with the performance can also be permitted to operate above the upper air routes. In the UK high performance aircraft such as Typhoons are regularly cleared to operate above the upper air routes.

skyvector.com...

You can see how little people actually know about upper air routes in their region from the following ATS thread. One poster in the UK actually stated that he lived in a region with very little air traffic. In reality he lived under a major upper air route and busy everyday with transatlantic air traffic. There are also other posters within the thread that also have no idea what upper air routes are in their vicinity.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

See following video. Upper air routes can be located anywhere. Some people just get over excited about 'grids trails' in the sky when all they are are aircraft utilising upper air routes. Also don't be fooled into thinking that the lines indicating upper air routes have no real width. The width various according to regulations and the air routes width is measure in miles. Now watch the following video and you can see with the crossing of upper air routes and their width measured in tens of miles how grids and X's can form.

Originally posted by hrabialolo
Well my friend,..contrails stay only for several minutes and disappears,

What is that based on?

Contrails are visible moisture in the air - I presume we both agree on that?

So they are essentially the same as clouds - although the cause is different. Clouds can stay for hours, so why can't contrails?

There re scientific studies of contrails that measure their persistence at many hours- I can go look them up if you want the link but I'm just back from 8 days in Samoa (where I saw aerodynamic contrails flash on top of the wing of a Virgin Blue 737 climbing out of Falelolo airport one days as I was lazing on the beach,.......)....

chemtrails stays for hours and slowly expanding like those on your picture

And where are the studies that support that??

...so what's going on..??

IMO what is going on is that you and many others have been sucked in to believe some sensational lies.

Unicus - Thanks for the link, I think I will be looking further into this for sure. I have been searching for a good site to track commercial air traffic.

Tommyjo- It just seems strange to me that they start in the East and progress to the North, then end in the west by the end of the day, but I am no expert and would like to learn more about the flight patterns around my city. I will look into your links posted. The best way to understand what I see is to be educated, I know this. Also I definitely agree that they don't need to be commercial. We do have a large base not far from here and those flights are not always tracked/marked.

ps- I am no DIE-HARD something is happening kind of person. I do not believe in keeping absolutes about concepts/ideas/ or conspiracies.

It appears they have drawn a line in the sky,
and knowing human reactions, want us to declare a side.

History has always shown once a line is drawn,
and people divide up,
and choose a side,
that is when it becomes dangerous,
and a true threat.

More pics,

I dont actually care of what the argument is, but I just know that looking at the skies really ruins the beautiful warm sun set! I mean just look at it!! you can play a few games of naughts and crosses on that! humanity ruins everything on this earth! shes on the way to destruction because we are too lazy to produce more efficient technology because money talks too much! its clear where humanities priorities are and its not preserving the planet that is our only home in our lifetime!

Originally posted by Yellabelly
I am in Woking, Guildford UK and earlier on this evening I took a pic wondering the same, the skies are a mess!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not really suprising as you are in a region with extensive upper air routes. Take a look on the upper air route map as you are west of navigational aid OCK. (Ockham). You can zoom into the location.

UK Upper Air Route Chart South

Navigational Aid at Ockham (OCK)

www.trevord.com...

reply to post by tommyjo


yeah I gathered its pretty close to the airports, but the point really is its damn annoying look at them everyday

reply to post by Yellabelly


I thought the point of identifying chemtrails was to stop them poisoning us or whatever??

However I agree contrails can be visually annoying - if you want to do something about that you should probably move through normal "political" and "activist" channels to force airlines to identify contrail altitudes and avoid them through legislation.

But of course you'll have to fight against the greenies who will oppose it on the basis that such a measure would burn more fuel and thus create more global warming.....but it is certainly an option for you if you care enough.

So I have come to a point where in my mind,
that both sides of this debate are right.
Chemtrail (corporation wannabes) sites are selling an idea for profit,
Airlines (corporations) want to slow dissent (against corporations) to enjoy profits.
Above Top Secret is laughing all the way to bank with ad money,
as people watch debates and lines being drawn in almost all the threads.

So my ATS friends if you see me caving to human instinct,
and trying to attack or defend a line remind me,
by saying stop.
Thank You

reply to post by tommyjo


Hey tommyjo. If you come back to this thread I think it could be beneficial to me (and others) if you help explain that skyvector site and what it means. Looking at my area I see how easily flight paths can cross in the linework but I don't really get the map as a whole. (purple circles) Or maybe there is a "help explain this" button on the site that I missed. I really am interested in learning more.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


Its not that I dont care but what is the point when money talks more than sense. They dont care unless it affects $$$$$

reply to post by Yellabelly


And that is why it would take legislation to force airlines to not fly at contrail altitudes - jet engines are more efficient the higher they fly (within limits - there needs to be enough oxygen in the first place!! ) so they fly as high as possible to reduce fuel burn and keep costs down.

Generally it would be a trivial matter to fly lower and not make contrails....but it would cost money to do so, and no airline is going to add to its costs voluntarily if others don't have to.

Originally posted by hrabialolo
Well my friend,..contrails stay only for several minutes and disappears,chemtrails stays for hours and slowly expanding

So, then they were spraying "chemtrails" back in the 1940's?





And some more persistent contrails, this time from the 1960's:




Give us a break. You have absolutely zero proof to your claim.



reply to post by tommyjo

Very cool video. I had to download it so I could watch it in HD on a big screen. Thanks for posting it.

Originally posted by Rudy2shoes
So I have come to a point where in my mind,
that both sides of this debate are right.
Chemtrail (corporation wannabes) sites are selling an idea for profit,

Who are these "corporation wannabes", and what idea are they selling for profit??

Airlines (corporations) want to slow dissent (against corporations) to enjoy profits.

Corporations want to show "dissent" against corporations for "profit"?? What does that mean and how does it work??

I'm pretty sure airlines want to fly passengers and freight for profit - is that what you man by "dissent"?? It seems like a strange way to say it....

Above Top Secret is laughing all the way to bank with ad money,
as people watch debates and lines being drawn in almost all the threads.

So chemtrails are all a plot by ATS to make money from adds?? Ah...I see now...