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Another Marine Gone Off The Deep End. Another Small Reason For Govt. to Back Gun Control??

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posted on Sep, 1 2012 @ 08:10 AM
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Originally posted by Swills
reply to post by mountaingirl1111
 


Mental health evals? I never went thru one and I'm pretty sure recruits presently don't go thru one. I had a friend who wanted to join the police dept. once and he failed their mental health exam
, but the military doesn't care.


You're right, I think I got that confused. I just did a search and apparently, your mental health is only checked before deployment. From what I've read, that are definite ways to circumvent that. The only way to be excluded from the military upon enlistment, due to mental health problems, is to have a severe disorder, such as BPD or Schizophrenia, etc. However, that is pretty much up to the person enlisting to disclose. Seems like there should be better rules in place!




posted on Sep, 1 2012 @ 08:22 AM
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Originally posted by Swills
reply to post by mountaingirl1111
 


Mental health evals? I never went thru one and I'm pretty sure recruits presently don't go thru one. I had a friend who wanted to join the police dept. once and he failed their mental health exam
, but the military doesn't care.



In the newspaper arcticle from todays Star Ledger www.nj.com... it says he was "honorably discharged from the Marines" and that the Marines listed "major depression" in the medical history of those papers. He also was taking prozac for his depression, and made alot of disturbing comments from previous years regarding his dislike of people in general.



posted on Sep, 1 2012 @ 09:13 AM
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Sorry if this has already been posted

And I'm wondering if some of your accounts have been hacked, as over the last few weeks many of you have seen and posted in the threads regarding the demonising and targeting of your troops by the gov and media, and expressed your anger toward it.

The new domestic terrorists !

And have even acknowledged that these troops are probably being targeted due to being one of the few social groups that are a threat to the plans "they" have for you and your country, and indeed the world

But now look at you ...........some belt fed anti military/vet media, and you've all fell in line .........even though you saw this comming you've lapped it up like the good little fluridated subject you are ......AND YOU BLOODY KNOW IT !....???


"No, f*** that, you won't take me, you won't break me
And you'll never make me, step in line and step march in time
Well, you can violate my body but my soul is still mine
You must think that I'm fing stupid, man

If you think I'm gonna hang with the program, some fool schedule
I don't give a s*** about what is or isn't cool
I make the rules, I stand alone
And if they try a tap, I leave 'em hangin' on the telephone

One of these days I'm gonna get sectioned
I bet they even say it's for my own protection
Rejection leads straight to correction
Look out, here comes a strange injection

They've got a drug to numb my erection
But they won't take this from me
My state of mind"


www.elyrics.net...

You deserve everything you get

Me .....yep I prefer a booth or sit near the corner it's no biggie
It's just so I can see everything and no one can approach from behind
It's just a reflex that can take a little to get out of when returning from ops
It becomes instinctive as do so many other things that appear strange to you....it's no harm it's just a force of habit
After a little while it subsides and yu move back into 'home' routine, but still catch yourself doing things from time to time ......and even do them intentionally occasionally to prevent certain skill fade

Yes some return messed up, I don't deny it, been there myself recently, and am happy to discuss anything regarding this topic to any that would like to know

My intro so you can see where I'm comming from
www.abovetopsecret.com...


But as usual ........from the outside looking in ...........you saw it coming and fell for it anyway



posted on Sep, 1 2012 @ 11:47 AM
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reply to post by elrem48
 


So he was discharged on medical leave. This is why the military should do pre screenings to all new recruits, like many police depts, just to save them time, money, and to keep the potentially dangerous people away. Many people who join the armed forces that have mental illnesses usually do get separated not long into their military career. The pressures of the military is often to much for them so they get discharged.

Thanks for updates.
edit on 1-9-2012 by Swills because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 2 2012 @ 02:43 PM
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reply to post by Swills
 


Alright, i honestly did leave some out, yet it was not on purpose as there was and still currently is no agenda on my end. You are just analyzing this way too hard dude, and if there is a problem with the information that i had left out ACCIDENTALLY, that is why i had left the link. The link was left for the ATSers to follow, so they can decide which information to nitpick at for themselves....instead of just making this discussion in its entirety, a circus act in which immature children decide for themselves whether he was crazy or not.

It has been said already and i will re-iterate for you....You were just spoon-fed a decent amount of generalized information that had no biased standpoint, and you chose the "deny everything not exasperated to the highest degree by the media" aspect. Yes the man was obviously at a point where everything to him most likely seemed problematic enough that he had finally just snapped.

That does not mean that YOU or anyone else knows what had actually happened in relation to this tweaked man. Sure he had postings on facebook and had also been saying things that would obviously be of question to this man's sanity.

Yet.....you are not this man. You are not his psychologist. You are not his mom, nor his friend.

The story i told you was just a small tidbit of information on how messed up SOME of these people end up after a tour in the Marine's, or what have you.


No I'm 99.9% sure being a Marine didn't make him kill two co workers. There's no maybe there. This kind of sad crazy most likely left us the exact reasons why he did this in his apartment, and then when the people who knew him come forward the picture will begin to come clear, and him being a Marine I'm sure won't be the reason he did this.


I'll show a definition that I BELIEVE will help in later arguments and come in handy when YOU ARE "99.9% sure"


be·lieve [bih-leev] Show IPA verb, be·lieved, be·liev·ing. verb (used without object) 1. to have confidence in the truth, the existence, or the reliability of something, although without absolute proof that one is right in doing so: Only if one believes in something can one act purposefully.


Oh and here's the link in case i left something out for support of my agenda with lack of info


dictionary.reference.com...

I also BELIEVE that you had probably missed the initial point of my thread though,as you seem to be jumping on just one aspect of it....

So here's the honest to God reason i had initially written this article....YA READY??


MODS i know this was spoken of earlier, but there was no link to the article or anything such, so i figured id a bit more info.



So that's for you and maybe you should take into account that you are probs thinking way too hard to try and lay down an argument, in which no one is arguing back.....you're so off topic that very few people care.

I posted the thread so everyone could just read a little into what had happened that day, and asked a few questions to see what people are actually thinking.

Who the hell are you to tell anyone how they should think? Nothing you are arguing is supported by actual cold hard evidence...

Will we ever know whether it was the training or if he was just a nutter butter to begin with?
Probably not.

Mainly though, as i said in my OP.....
This is happening way too much.

I'll leave you with this......

www.youtube.com...
Even though it may not be accurate to at tee, this may give you a bit of insight on how it actually is in the Marine's, except without the name calling as that is banned.

Ya Chud

Mike

edit on 2-9-2012 by PsyMike91 because: added link

edit on 2-9-2012 by PsyMike91 because: typo

edit on 2-9-2012 by PsyMike91 because: explanation of video



posted on Sep, 2 2012 @ 03:23 PM
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reply to post by PsyMike91
 


I don't expect you to admit you created this thread with the intent of portraying this story as another Marine gone off the deep end. All I can do is point it out and I'm satisfied with that. Your intent was to create the idea that he was a war vet gone postal until I pointed out that he wasn't a war vet and that's when you tried to make the argument that his training made him the killer on that tragic day. I will not repeat myself or re-quote you, it's all here in this thread for everyone to read. So you can stop defending yourself to me because I don't believe you and have nothing more to say about the matter but you can keep replying claiming your innocence in hopes of getting others to agree with you.

So at best, we agree to completely disagree.



posted on Sep, 2 2012 @ 04:45 PM
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Originally posted by Swills
reply to post by PsyMike91
 


I don't expect you to admit you created this thread with the intent of portraying this story as another Marine gone off the deep end. All I can do is point it out and I'm satisfied with that. Your intent was to create the idea that he was a war vet gone postal until I pointed out that he wasn't a war vet and that's when you tried to make the argument that his training made him the killer on that tragic day. I will not repeat myself or re-quote you, it's all here in this thread for everyone to read. So you can stop defending yourself to me because I don't believe you and have nothing more to say about the matter but you can keep replying claiming your innocence in hopes of getting others to agree with you.

So at best, we agree to completely disagree.



Id like you to point out in my OP where i had stated that it was due to his oversea tour, which had led to the initial "snapping", so to speak and kill these people.

Never had i said that what so ever. You are just putting words in my mouth to support your own foolish agenda and breed more ignorance toward the subject matter.

I have not and still do not have any intention on defending myself on this matter because there is no way possible to argue with fool-hearty, ignoramuses that continue tip-toe around the initial subject of the thread which i have posted in relation to what had happened.

Your argument holds no water, and now you've just nose-dived into the most defenseless, random conglomeration of garble that i have honestly ever seen on this site.

To anyone whom actually read this article and had appreciated it for what it actually meant to be, i am sorry for errors that i had made in my OP, and i apologize that ignorance did not lay dormant in this conversation, and had thrown off the real topic of the thread of which ive started.

Also, to everyone, whom are actually taking all this Swills' words into account. You are very much welcome to, as i do not refute the freedom of which we are so blessed to have......

But that does not mean anyone should take any of this person's words to heart. Anyone can spin a conversation in the direction that they intend, but it is much harder to stick to the original content of the matter and at the same time, support an opposing conclusion in which the ensuing argument holds no water in any which way.


Listen to yourself... your argument has turned into rambling. Everything you are saying right now, is as if a one year old child were asking for a diaper change.

You're telling me what i had meant to do and the REAL argument in which my topic was meant for. That shows that you sir, are the one which needs to do the GROWING UP as there is no plausibility behind any refute that you had made here, but the sheer fact that YOU "BELIEVE"
(did you read the definition?) that i meant something that wasn't even implied....is just ridiculously pathetic.

Only to try and get everyone on this thread and I to deviate from the original topic??


If you don't like anything i was/am saying here, why do you not take the initiative to write your own thread on the matter, as this one was pretty generalized about this topic. Why not make a response thread in which you can moan and complain about what you; yourself are writing? That would be very much more interesting and in the time you took out to do all of this senseless bickering and continuing on about how my OP was wrong, you couldve written your own damn thread on how my topic was wrong because YOU do not agree with it.

Just a bit of information for anyone else reading this and deciding that MY OP was wrong, (which i have no idea how my own personal thoughts on a subject matter of this imperative could be, because they my ideals and thoughts on something i BELIEVE
to be important).....just remember.

There's that word again, ya do your homework?


Ignorance Breeds Ignorance,
Mike


P.S.-- Anyone who has the tenacity to think for themselves and has an actual credibility to that decree in this department, has very much of my respect.
edit on 2-9-2012 by PsyMike91 because: typo

edit on 2-9-2012 by PsyMike91 because: add on



posted on Sep, 2 2012 @ 05:03 PM
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reply to post by Swills
 




You're real funny actually, you know this is a tactic that corrupt politicians use ALL the time.

Twist the word how you see fit to get people to back your own corrupt agenda.

NOTHING that i had said anywhere on here had ever directly stated that he went off the deep end due to his tour, it may have been gently grazed upon, but nonetheless ive never said that, and never will as it stands against my strict moral code.

Ive never conveyed information that i knew was not definite and had/tried to claim it as fact.

You're just using all of my sentences out of context to sway the conversation in the direction necessary to get your half-assed point across the the readers, so just stop, no one's falling for it lol.

Good for you bro, im sure you've learned how to do this from someone who doesn't actually know how to hide what they're doing very well..

Do you really think that with all of the ridicule on ATS, I would actually get away with that?

C'mon man this is my first thread in which ive posted actual news, in case you do not believe me....once again here's a link....which is what they're used for.....so you can do your own digging so i don't have to for you.

www.abovetopsecret.com...
Once again start your own thread and reply to that and insult yourself further than you already are,
itd actually probably give you more credibility than what you're doing on mine


Take it easy dude, and thanks for the various laughs i had gotten today. Needed this

Mike



posted on Sep, 2 2012 @ 05:06 PM
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reply to post by PsyMike91
 



Try doing that before posting something stupid in response to my thread you chud, Mike


And you should try to research more thoroughly before posting a thread and calling other people names...As has been pointed out, the fellow in question was not sent overseas...and your OP gives no reasoning for the title. Why should the government become more heavy handed toward private gun ownership on the basis of this shooting?
edit on 2-9-2012 by totallackey because: formatting and clarity



posted on Sep, 2 2012 @ 05:28 PM
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Originally posted by totallackey
reply to post by PsyMike91
 



Try doing that before posting something stupid in response to my thread you chud, Mike


And you should try to research more thoroughly before posting a thread and calling other people names...As has been pointed out, the fellow in question was not sent overseas...and your OP gives no reasoning for the title. Why should the government become more heavy handed toward private gun ownership on the basis of this shooting?
edit on 2-9-2012 by totallackey because: formatting and clarity


Was just a question posed for the ATS community....Why did my thread not get deleted if this is such a problem as per this argument would support the terms and condition if it were not a question....

Thats the problem with this thought...i apologize for not asking that in my OP, but i had a lot of thoughts running through my head at that point and had a bad filter the other night due to a couple of drinks..

I know the fellow in question was not sent overseas, as was read in the article that i had posted. Maybe you should practice what you had preached in your first sentence there.

I APOLOGIZE for threading half-assed information, which i had said already about three times, but if anyone has a problem with what i had NOT posted on a quick whim...THEY COULDVE TAKEN THE TIME OUT TO FOLLOW THE LINK AS SUGGESTED.

I do not understand how you or anyone could hop on the bandwagon and tell me i should research more thoroughly and that he did not go overseas, whereas i had never directly stated such, and as i had continuously HAVE STATED though, that this information lies within the article..

Is it really too hard to click on a link and find something for yourself???
Seriously id really like to know if everyone is missing fingers or something.


wth,
Mike



posted on Sep, 2 2012 @ 09:37 PM
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Originally posted by mountaingirl1111
"Soldier going off the deep end" is a headline that has been in the making a while. As of last year, we have been told time and again in the media and other sources that we, as a country, need to be prepared for the realization that the greatest terror threat isn't from abroad, but from those here at home. They keep repeating the phrase "lone wolf attacker" and that is exactly what has followed most of these stories. The disgruntled lone wolf. The anti-government lone wolf attacker. Add to that the penchant for the arrests of ex-military men lately and for no reason other than questioning their sanity and declarations of danger (according to the press) and you see the trend that's about to play out, that has throughout the summer. The question is, why? Personally, I believe it's gun control, part of a larger agenda that's about to play out.

Most of these stories lately, too, focus on individuals buying guns through legal channels. That keeps getting stressed, which is the interesting part.

Just my two cents.



This.

The fact that (even here) more people haven't noticed the fishy aroma emanating from all this is just sad. It really does appear that they're setting anyone who's a little different up to be suspects.

Most likely anyone who doesn't exactly trust TPTB or doesn't socialize a lot is going to be made to feel very uncomfortable in the coming years. While I'm sure they're going for gun control (and eventually a complete ban) as well, it's hard to miss the way they're going out of their way to demonize people who are quiet, maybe a little odd and not very sociable. Heaven forbid anything happens and the person turns out to be a major conspiracy buff. Let's just hope that doesn't happen.

And yes. The "gun was bought legally" angle really is suspicious. Especially when you look at the Holmes guy. His criminal record was clean, it seems. The psychological angle is what they keep emphasizing.

I think the next step they're going for in "gun control" is some kind of psychological evaluation before you can buy a gun. Which might seem sensible but would be wide open to limitless "new" mental illnesses. That just might be their holy grail. If they can get that, there is almost no one who couldn't be excluded from buying a gun.
edit on 2-9-2012 by BrianFlanders because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 2 2012 @ 09:48 PM
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reply to post by PsyMike91
 


it is true wat they say my friend really do u think the human race cud handle the truth if the goverment released all of the black book of secrets we no the truth i just wish everybody else to too



posted on Sep, 2 2012 @ 11:53 PM
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Originally posted by daryll116
reply to post by PsyMike91
 


it is true wat they say my friend really do u think the human race cud handle the truth if the goverment released all of the black book of secrets we no the truth i just wish everybody else to too


I honestly would have no idea what would happen if they had released that book. It contains the knowledge that so many people have been denying for so many years, but this thread honestly was not about truth, i really was just trying to throw some information in a few people's direction about the event, and i got slammed for leaving things out by accident, even though there was a link for everyone to follow, so they could draw their own information and talk about whatever the hell theyd like to lol

But welcome to ATS dude, remember to deny ignorance and don't take crap from anyone when it comes to your personal feeling and ideals.

Mike



posted on Sep, 3 2012 @ 12:02 AM
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Originally posted by BrianFlanders

Originally posted by mountaingirl1111
"Soldier going off the deep end" is a headline that has been in the making a while. As of last year, we have been told time and again in the media and other sources that we, as a country, need to be prepared for the realization that the greatest terror threat isn't from abroad, but from those here at home. They keep repeating the phrase "lone wolf attacker" and that is exactly what has followed most of these stories. The disgruntled lone wolf. The anti-government lone wolf attacker. Add to that the penchant for the arrests of ex-military men lately and for no reason other than questioning their sanity and declarations of danger (according to the press) and you see the trend that's about to play out, that has throughout the summer. The question is, why? Personally, I believe it's gun control, part of a larger agenda that's about to play out.

Most of these stories lately, too, focus on individuals buying guns through legal channels. That keeps getting stressed, which is the interesting part.

Just my two cents.



This.

The fact that (even here) more people haven't noticed the fishy aroma emanating from all this is just sad. It really does appear that they're setting anyone who's a little different up to be suspects.

Most likely anyone who doesn't exactly trust TPTB or doesn't socialize a lot is going to be made to feel very uncomfortable in the coming years. While I'm sure they're going for gun control (and eventually a complete ban) as well, it's hard to miss the way they're going out of their way to demonize people who are quiet, maybe a little odd and not very sociable. Heaven forbid anything happens and the person turns out to be a major conspiracy buff. Let's just hope that doesn't happen.

And yes. The "gun was bought legally" angle really is suspicious. Especially when you look at the Holmes guy. His criminal record was clean, it seems. The psychological angle is what they keep emphasizing.

I think the next step they're going for in "gun control" is some kind of psychological evaluation before you can buy a gun. Which might seem sensible but would be wide open to limitless "new" mental illnesses. That just might be their holy grail. If they can get that, there is almost no one who couldn't be excluded from buying a gun.
edit on 2-9-2012 by BrianFlanders because: (no reason given)


Also, i know that if you are considered mentaly i'll, and it is taken into account on record by a hospital or such, be it you have been hospitalized for any reason, or have been diagnosed by a doctor, you are not legally able to purchase a gun in the United States due to certain legality. Bet a lot of people did not know that.

People deemed mentally i'll that would not be able to purchase a gun, do not fit into TPTB's agenda, so they would, for obvious reasons now, pick a perfectly legitimate person that fits into the character that is to be portrayed by the media as such. A perfectly normal guy, that just had a few loose ends to tie up within his life, and just a few close friends and family that do not know him htat well. In Holmes' case, they could've chosen him, because he had just recently dropped out of school and was living by himself in an apartment without many close friends due to his lifestyle(work and school all day).

I believe this to be the truth, yet for obvious reasons it is still and only still just speculation on my part, as i do not know him personally and do have access to any information on such.

thanks for the serious reply that had actually pertained to the thread dude,
Mike

Added: i should not say that you cannot EVER. There are certain indefinite restrictions on models and types, yet i do know that pertaining to the amount of time you are restricted is due to the nature and severity of your case...atleast thats the way it is where i live...ive been diagnosed with clinical depression and was hospitalized due to attmepted, and i was talking to a friend of mine, who is currently in training and taking classes at the local community collee around here and he had conveyed this information to me.
edit on 3-9-2012 by PsyMike91 because: add on



posted on Sep, 3 2012 @ 12:38 AM
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Originally posted by Neocrusader

But as usual ........from the outside looking in ...........you saw it coming and fell for it anyway


It is funny how fast we went from "thank you for serving" to "crazy terrorist"....

First thing they do is look to see if some nut job had prior military...they don't care if it was four years as a cook...doesn't matter... their agenda is the same, I guess they were seriously disappointed with the Aurora shooting.



posted on Sep, 3 2012 @ 12:55 PM
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Originally posted by Xtrozero

Originally posted by Neocrusader

But as usual ........from the outside looking in ...........you saw it coming and fell for it anyway


It is funny how fast we went from "thank you for serving" to "crazy terrorist"....

First thing they do is look to see if some nut job had prior military...they don't care if it was four years as a cook...doesn't matter... their agenda is the same, I guess they were seriously disappointed with the Aurora shooting.




I for one wasn't....if any portion of this post was meant as a stab toward me or my thread. I apologize for the thread not being clear enough, as it was meant just to convey information and get the thoughts of some of the readers.

That is all, im not going to reiterate what i have been constantly repeating throughout all of the three pages here.

Im sorry for not being direct and not quoting the entire link,
Mike



posted on Sep, 3 2012 @ 06:26 PM
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Originally posted by PsyMike91
I for one wasn't....if any portion of this post was meant as a stab toward me or my thread. I apologize for the thread not being clear enough, as it was meant just to convey information and get the thoughts of some of the readers.

That is all, im not going to reiterate what i have been constantly repeating throughout all of the three pages here.

Im sorry for not being direct and not quoting the entire link,
Mike


My post was not directed towards you at all.... just the flavor that the anti-gun crowd seems to be going lately.



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