This is how Anders Breivik gonna live in detention

reply to post by tyfon


That's good to know. Thanks.

It would appear that the natural reaction in dealing with a convicted criminal (like Brevik) is to punish in spite of the, generally espoused belief that detention is a means to rehabilitate or, in the very least, to confine and segregate offenders from the general society.

. I am very impressed with Norway's standard for detention.

reply to post by benevolent tyrant


So if this man comes to senses and good behavior , he should be placed back in society?

I wasn't expecting anything less than this:

Originally posted by tyfon
I'm a Norwegian and not angry. He is in jail. He will never get out and he knows that.
To treat him like an animal would only reduce our society to his level.

We have something called human rights here that seem to be missing from a lot of other societies.

I understand that it might be a hard concept to understand, but it is a cornerstone in the way most of us think about other humans. Good and bad, they are still human.

While I respect your opinion I'll have to respectfully disagree. In my opinion when he murdered those 77 people he lost all humanity and as such his basic human rights. I have a serious issue with someone who callously violated those same human rights of the 77 individuals he murdered.

Only harsh punishments can deter criminals.

There's a reason why Saudi Arabia has the lowest crime rate in the world, people leave their gold shops open when they go for their 5 times prayers at local mosque without the fear of getting robbed.

reply to post by Cabalis


Thats what I think to, How can one have rights if he took so many of others not alone the victims but mothers, fathers, brothers,sisters and children all the people who are left behind will live that agonizing pain for the rest of their lives.

Originally posted by tyfon
I'm a Norwegian and not angry. He is in jail. He will never get out and he knows that.
To treat him like an animal would only reduce our society to his level.

We have something called human rights here that seem to be missing from a lot of other societies.

I understand that it might be a hard concept to understand, but it is a cornerstone in the way most of us think about other humans. Good and bad, they are still human.

I read in the newspaper the other day that most of the families were happy and relieved that he got his sentence. A recent poll by phone showed that 90ish percent were happy with it among the general population.

There is some debate about the general prison lengths, but so far the political parties feel that the current system of containment in extreme cases and rehabilitation in the rest is working good.

I'm on my tablet right now, but I can provide link to the poll when I get on a real computer tomorrow morning (it's 9pm here)

It is one thing for the People of Norway to be relieved that he got his sentence, BUT QUITE ANOTHER issue with HOW his sentence is to be carried out.

The SOLE purpose of him being put away is only to ensure he cannot remain within civilised society. Keeping him behind bars would ensure it. The sentence was never meant to bring back the dead, for no man has such powers, OR ensure no one follows his example, for no human has total control upon another.

However, beside the obvious physical luxuries he is entitled under the humane Norway prison system, which is meant to rehabilitate wrong doers to later contribute back to society, did that sentence meant ANY rehabilitaion for him, this unremorseful mass murderer, to return to society?

He still gets FULL contact with fellow prisoners and have visitation rights to spread and preach his murderous filth to, access to letters, books, free medical benefits, legal rights to complain, TV, etc, etc. There had been no change in his previous hermit lifestyle, perhaps had even upgraded it right now, for he no longer needs to worry about jobs to pay for his rent and upkeep for the rest of his life.

And who provides it for him? None other than Norwegians and the victims of his horrors, many whom had to struggle with life, maimed and brokened both physically and mentally, while this remorseless beast lives it up for life. It is not about money or envy, for no free civilised human can ever envy him, but is this how Norwegian justice is served?

While civilised men should never lower themselves to that of beasts, may norwegians realized whom had been elevated and stands tall with a smile today, laughing silently at his victims and society.

He should be kept alone in a bare room, isolated from all, and made to face up his wrong doing for the rest of his life facing 4 bare walls, for the taking of innocents with no remorse.

Apparently he said that he regretted not killing more people before they handed down the sentence on him.

Yet he's got a nice clean comfortable place to stay at with all the amenities?

30-40% of the people out there don't have a place like this to live in.

They should have just turned him into a lab rat for new drugs testing.

reply to post by forklift

They should have just turned him into a lab rat for new drugs testing.

In Norway it is considered rude to punish crimes that are not related to tax matters.

reply to post by 0bserver1


I don't think you really understand the concept of freedom.

Fun fact - Norway has one of the lowest crime rate in the world.

You can make the criminals very comfy - give them comfy beds, Xboxs, TVs, anything.


Only thing is taken away from them is this:

FREEDOM

They can't go out and party. Have sex. Going out with friends or with girlfriends to eat out or to movie theaters. Etc etc. You get the idea.

Give them as much luxury as you want... the can't get those.

I know Breivik is one of those extreme examples... but the idea is to treat them as humans. Makes you wonder why our (USA) criminals keep coming back?

Originally posted by CALGARIAN
Actually... I found a source that shows these pics:

That still is a comfortable cell, for a mass murder.......





How long would he survive in a prison like this?



Gitarama Prison, Rwanda Africa

Gitarama has the most overcrowded penitentiary in the world housing over 6000 prisoners in a building design for only 500 people. Inmates are so hungry they bite chunks of meat out of each other to survive. The jail is so congested that inmates have no option but to stand all day and all night and many suffer from rotting feet. The floor is moist and filled with raw feces. Gangrene slowly sets on inmates toes, they turn black and fall off later. Inmates that are not so lucky to only have toes fall off, doctors have no choice but to amputate lower limbs to save the persons life. The unbearable stench is so horrible that it can be noticed a half mile away upon arriving to the prison. The survival rate is low due to the violence and the diminishing conditions in the building where one in eight prisoners will die from disease or violence. Interesting Fact 1: Most of the prisoners are locked up for genocide committed against Rwanda.

Top 5 Most Horrible Prisons on Earth

Just makes you wonder, if killing 77 people because you think there is some conspiracy against your "people" and you think you are "Europe's perfect knight" gets you declared sane why does a child in class get labeled "ADD" for not paying attention?

Ya but he was a mind control patsy used and abused by TPTB. Don't blame him, blame TPTB in there country. Thats' who really killed the 77 people.

Well the question is, what is jail?

Is it a punishment, or is it correctional in nature.

Should he be forced to break rocks all day in the sun, or is Rehabilitation the goal?

What ever the answer, I know that here in America Our system is deeply flawed and needs reform.

I am not saying it should be like NORWAY, Simply that Americans are kinda of the last people that should be commenting on prison conditions in other countries as we clearly have no clue how to do it properly.

Originally posted by benrl
Well the question is, what is jail?

Is it a punishment, or is it correctional in nature.

Should he be forced to break rocks all day in the sun, or is Rehabilitation the goal?

I dont think he can be Rehabilitated. Period.That said, Breaking rocks, is probably the kindest thing, the family's of his victims, would want.

Originally posted by benrl
What ever the answer, I know that here in America Our system is deeply flawed and needs reform.

I am not saying it should be like NORWAY, Simply that Americans are kinda of the last people that should be commenting on prison conditions in other countries as we clearly have no clue how to do it properly.

Star for you.

That for sure, is a legitimate opinion, to Americas Prison Complex.

reply to post by benrl
This is the question isn't it? Most prison systems are creating monsters out of people who won't be able to reintegrate into society. The funding and the will isn't there for training, counselling or education on the inside. Allied to that is the perpetual punishment meted out to ex-cons on the outside - no employment prospects.

Not everyone who gets sent to prison is a bad human being, probably a very small minority could be classed as bad or broken humans. Some people are simply unable to function in society and belong somewhere else.

To me, these Scandinavian justice systems seem very enlightened.

Originally posted by Kandinsky


To me, these Scandinavian justice systems seem very enlightened.

I tend to agree, and the facts are there, actually......

In general, my reaction to Norway's lenient, rehabilitation-focused justice system is not that the Norwegian sense of retributive justice is underdeveloped and defective, but that America's is. Norway has one of the world's lowest murder rates. America is worst in the developed world. Maybe we could learn something. Perhaps we should wonder why our detention facilities aren't more like Halden. Of course, we couldn't afford it, as we imprison such a disgracefully huge portion of our population, and in often sub-human conditions.

Norwegian v American justice


Sorry for the edit, but its worth the extra info.......

Nothing can be done to bring Mr Breivik's victims back to life. The most compelling, non-mystical case for vengeance is that it offers some consolation to those wracked by desolation and fury at the murder of their loved one. But the point of a criminal justice system in a civilised society is not the mental peace of those collaterally wounded by crime. All evidence supports the proposition that Norway's criminal justice system is both practically and morally superior to America's. If America's abominably cruel and unjust system delivered results even remotely comparable to Norway's enviable level of civil peace and order, then there might be some reason to take seriously American animadversions against Norway's short sentences and humane prison. But we don't. We're not even close. So Americans should just shut up and watch. It could do us some good to see how a civilized society handles such a horrifying crime.

So true........

You could have just as easily posted a thread of a woman being stoned to death in Saudi Arabia or Iran. Unfortunately, some are punished quite less fair than others. Is extreme punishment right either?

You posted what looks to be minimum security with no source, so I doubt he will be staying there. And even if the amenities are top notch, it doesn't matter because he isn't free. If you don't know what freedom is, then you are no better than someone who threw it away for some psychotic cause.

What's really important is being free, being a human, and no matter how nice it looks somewhere, being locked away trumps any of the good there.

You want these people to feel remorse as well. You will never teach them by inciting more hate through ill treatment. I think the phrase, "kill them with kindness" has a very deep meaning. People will not learn lessons until they truly feel remorse for what they have done, and if that means making them a more developed person through programs, schooling, communication, activities, then so be it.