Desperation: Obama Surrogate Calls to Make Voting Mandatory

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
reply to post by Grimpachi

 

If you understood it the first time why be such a jack #ss and act like you didn't Mr Spade is a Spade.

Only a jackass would piss all over the unalienable rights of all people and declare only those who vote have the right to speech.

Please find where I said only those who vote have the right to speech also use the entire quote.
Jack

Originally posted by Grimpachi

Originally posted by Misoir
What about those of us who do not believe in the ridiculous notion of individual participation in an "electoral process", i.e. anti-democratic folks?

That doesn't sound American to me. Those of you who are anti-democratic may want to find a country that isn't democratic. That is entirely up to you.

edit on 24-6-2012 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)

What a load of horse sh#. So now in order to be an American one must subscribe to a certain set of principles which change every several years? To be an American meant something entirely different just 50 years ago, were they not American? I am just as much an American as anyone else born in this nation regardless of what my beliefs are. Never will I accept the notion of a propositional nation, where so long as you accept X and Y you are a true American and if you do not then you are not a true American. That is not a country, that is an abstraction!

Originally posted by Misoir

Originally posted by Grimpachi

Originally posted by Misoir
What about those of us who do not believe in the ridiculous notion of individual participation in an "electoral process", i.e. anti-democratic folks?

That doesn't sound American to me. Those of you who are anti-democratic may want to find a country that isn't democratic. That is entirely up to you.

edit on 24-6-2012 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)

What a load of horse sh#. So now in order to be an American one must subscribe to a certain set of principles which change every several years? To be an American meant something entirely different just 50 years ago, were they not American? I am just as much an American as anyone else born in this nation regardless of what my beliefs are. Never will I accept the notion of a propositional nation, where so long as you accept X and Y you are a true American and if you do not then you are not a true American. That is not a country, that is an abstraction!

If one is anti-democratic then it doesn't sound American to me.

A better question is what is American to you?

reply to post by Grimpachi

If one is anti-democratic then it doesn't sound American to me.

Here you are voter, making absurd comments like this, with no idea what the Constitution for the United States of America is about:

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government

~Article IV, Section 4~


That guaranteed republican form of government is an express restraint placed upon democracy to protect people from voters like you.

Democracy is the most vile form of government... democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention: have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property: and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths.

~James Madison; The anti-democratic Founder~

It had been observed that a pure democracy if it were practicable would be the most perfect government. Experience had proved that no position is more false than this. The ancient democracies in which the people themselves deliberated never possessed one good feature of government. Their very character was tyranny; their figure deformity.

~Alexander Hamilton; The anti-democratic Founder~

Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself.

~John Adams; The anti-democratic Founder~

On and on and on our Founders railed against democracy and endeavored to create a Constitutional republic so people like you could have the comfort of exercising their right to tell non-voters to shut-up.

reply to post by Grimpachi


Being an American has nothing to do with subscribing to any particular politico-philosophical values. The most fundamental of American values of today, and many even of past, have been completely discredited in my eyes and are held dear only by the foolish and wishful-thinkers. To me being an American is of blood and soil. Have you the blood that made up the American stock from which our founders had sprang forth? Do you love the land and the fruits it yields? Would you be willing to cry tears of blood for its defense against those seeking to defile it? I have rejoiced in approving of each. For I do not fight for values, I would not take up a gun to defend some abstract principle - I would take up arms in defense of America for it has given my the blood which flows through my veins.

I do not fight for values, my friend, for I would fight for America even if we were a Communist nation. True values, the ones that really matter, are not to be found written upon documents or preached in political debates; they exist in the transcendental realm. To me, that is an American.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


You couldn't find it huh? Lieing hurts your credibility.

Originally posted by Grimpachi
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux

 

You couldn't find it huh? Lieing hurts your credibility.

Dude, when I said I quoted you precisely I was talking about your initial post. Now keep deflecting and pretend like you weren't exposed as ignorant about "anti-democratic". Or, you could deny ignorance and own up to the fact that the United States of America is not a democracy and that this is good thing.

Ignorance hurts your credibility, and no one has lied about you.

reply to post by Grimpachi


Couldn't find what?

Proof that America is democratic?

Because it isn't, never was.......correction.....people like you are turning it into that ie mob rule.

Democracy is majority rule......this country was not founded on that.

reply to post by Misoir


To me if someone is anti-democratic it sounds like anti-American. Its nice what you wrote and I can agree with most of it except where you wouldn't care if it was communist because that to me is not American but to each his own. I served in the military a good portion of my life so I like the sentament about fighting for something however if this nation ever became communist I would leave it if I hadn't already died fighting that change.

reply to post by Grimpachi

I served in the military a good portion of my life

This means you swore an oath to support and defend the Constitution for the United States of America. That doesn't mean to support and defend a piece of paper, but the principles enshrined in it, which includes a republic.

Shame on you, indeed.

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux

Originally posted by Grimpachi
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux

 

You couldn't find it huh? Lieing hurts your credibility.

Dude, when I said I quoted you precisely I was talking about your initial post. Now keep deflecting and pretend like you weren't exposed as ignorant about "anti-democratic". Or, you could deny ignorance and own up to the fact that the United States of America is not a democracy and that this is good thing.

Ignorance hurts your credibility, and no one has lied about you.

You knew exactly what I was reffering to if you didn't then you would be the one that is ignorant.


If you do not consider America to be a democracy then what do you think it is?

reply to post by Grimpachi

If you do not consider America to be a democracy then what do you think it is?

This has been explained to you, sport. You swore an oath to support and defend the Constitution, which includes Article IV Section 4.

reply to post by Grimpachi


Did you ever hear these words?


"I pledge allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
reply to post by Grimpachi

 

I served in the military a good portion of my life

This means you swore an oath to support and defend the Constitution for the United States of America. That doesn't mean to support and defend a piece of paper, but the principles enshrined in it, which includes a republic.

Shame on you, indeed.

The old republic democracy crap. This country is the most democratic country I have ever been in and I have been to so many countrys that it would be to many to list. I have been to several where it is manditory to vote and in many ways it works much better for the people.

Please unless you have served in the military do not pressume to tell me what my duty was.

reply to post by Grimpachi

An Important Distinction: Democracy versus Republic It is important to keep in mind the difference between a Democracy and a Republic, as dissimilar forms of government. Understanding the difference is essential to comprehension of the fundamentals involved. It should be noted, in passing, that use of the word Democracy as meaning merely the popular type of government--that is, featuring genuinely free elections by the people periodically--is not helpful in discussing, as here, the difference between alternative and dissimilar forms of a popular government: a Democracy versus a Republic. This double meaning of Democracy--a popular-type government in general, as well as a specific form of popular government--needs to be made clear in any discussion, or writing, regarding this subject, for the sake of sound understanding. These two forms of government: Democracy and Republic, are not only dissimilar but antithetical, reflecting the sharp contrast between (a) The Majority Unlimited, in a Democracy, lacking any legal safeguard of the rights of The Individual and The Minority, and (b) The Majority Limited, in a Republic under a written Constitution safeguarding the rights of The Individual and The Minority; as we shall now see.

lexrex.com...

Forced voting in an indirect democracy.

reply to post by Grimpachi

A Democracy The chief characteristic and distinguishing feature of a Democracy is: Rule by Omnipotent Majority. In a Democracy, The Individual, and any group of Individuals composing any Minority, have no protection against the unlimited power of The Majority. It is a case of Majority-over-Man.

A Republic A Republic, on the other hand, has a very different purpose and an entirely different form, or system, of government. Its purpose is to control The Majority strictly, as well as all others among the people, primarily to protect The Individual’s God-given, unalienable rights and therefore for the protection of the rights of The Minority, of all minorities, and the liberties of people in general. The definition of a Republic is: a constitutionally limited government of the representative type, created by a written Constitution--adopted by the people and changeable (from its original meaning) by them only by its amendment--with its powers divided between three separate Branches: Executive, Legislative and Judicial. Here the term "the people" means, of course, the electorate.

lexrex.com...



If you think thedifference is crap....you are the anti American here.

reply to post by Grimpachi


By your logic thus far -- I shouldn't be able to exercise a religion because I do not exercise one; or I shouldn't speak out against protestors because I choose not to exercise my right to freely associate; or I shouldn't, shouldn't, shouldn't....

It seems you are fond of telling others what they shouldn't do.

Originally posted by timetothink
reply to post by Grimpachi

 

Couldn't find what?

Proof that America is democratic?

Because it isn't, never was.......correction.....people like you are turning it into that ie mob rule.

Democracy is majority rule......this country was not founded on that.

As I have stated before this country was founded where only white male land owners were alowed to vote.

Those votes were in democratic process

I made a mistake by thinking The people I was talking to had common sense enough understand what I was talking about. Either that or you just like to argue by spliting hairs for the sake of argueing and playing dumb when everything isnt spelled out for you..