Was the reasoning for the Korean War a big lie?

reply to post by NorthKorea

Well if what you are saying has any truth to it...and it doesn't...I have a few Uncles who would be very PISSED OFF since they fought in that war. When China entered the war the reason they overran U.S. Positions is we Killed so many Chinese in their Human Wave attacks that our Gun and Morter and Cannon Barrels would over heat. We Killed MILLIONS of Chinese and they kept coming.

This would not be the case today as the U.S. Military does not need to use Nukes anymore to defeat such numerous enemy attacks. China is no match for the U.S. and neither is North Korea...the issue is Seouls close proximity to North Korean Canon Fire.

The U.S. has a plan to deal with this and North Korea is doing what they always do...hoping to Blackmail money out of the South. But that War was started by the Communist Norths Incursions into the South. Split Infinity

Back in 1979 the cold war was at an all time high and Russia could have pushed the red button to launch nuclear missiles, i know i have a documentary somewhere on my hdd relating this (true) story. The cold war was very real and has never ended in fact imo

Mutual nuclear deterrence would be a good explanation on why Russia and America rarely engaged each other directly. So you are saying the Russians and Americans would not have turned the guns on each other even if there would have been no nukes. I guess we will never know.

Originally posted by KonquestAbySS
reply to post by gorgi

 

Those fighters that were north korean were manned my soviets and yes the USSR was a threat.

A threat to whom? We were allies with the Soviets back then apparently...So what happened between the bombing of Japan and Korea? Nothing...Cold War...Cold meaning nothing...No heat toward the U.S. just jibber jabber.

We were allies of convenience, to fight the nazis. The soviets had spies all over the us government. Project Venona. By the time the 1950's came around there was no "alliance" like there was in WW2, the cold war was in full swing. The soviets did everything they could to bring down the US.

Originally posted by NorthKorea
Funny thing that the U.S never fought with Russia directly, as to war in their own Countries. But outside war between puppet states.

As another poster stated above, we did face Soviet pilots in MIGs during the Korean War, though it was kept pretty quiet on both sides as to not stoke the flames of possible world war. Everyone wanted to keep the Korean War localized if possible, though MacArthur eventually threatened to kick it up into World War III when he wanted to start using nukes against the Chinese when they started to turn the tide. Calmer heads prevailed (Truman, I mean), and his requests were denied, thank goodness.


As for the whole Cold War, I honestly think the history of Soviet/Western relations would have been very different had Stalin not achieved power in the USSR. Had the more rational Trotsky and other leaders there won out and taken control after Lenin's death, I believe they would have been a far more open and less paranoid system instead of the totalitarian government Stalin made them. Lenin was even starting to experiment with a more open system at the time of his death. So as I see it, Stalin's paranoia bred a pretty necessary paranoia in the West to counter his activities, which unfortunately created a very dangerous post-War situation that lasted for almost 50 years.

Stalin wanted to over run Western Europe. His plan was to embroil the US and China in a major war to make his conquest easier. Truman knew this, and is why Truman fought a limited war in Korea; with allied support from the UK, Australia, and others. Stalin was poisoned by other Soviet leaders, to prevent WWIII. Once Stalin was dead, the threat of war between the USSR and US greatly decreased. It wasn't until detente under Nixon and Brezhnev, that the threat of war between the two was largely removed.

reply to post by NorthKorea


What ISNT a lie coming from the US government, or any Western government for that matter?

reply to post by NorthKorea


The biggest reason Korean war was fought was to stop the spread of communism.Truman believed in the domino theory.He figured that he would see all of asia fall to communism unless he stopped the countries from falling. When China turned Communist in 1949 and Truman feared that the next ‘domino’ would be Japan. In order to prevent this ta da we got the Korean war. This war was just a way that Soviet Union and the United States to fight without it going global. The Truman Doctrine had been one of ‘containment’ – stopping the Communists gaining any more territory. In April 1950 the American National Security Council issued a report (NSC 68) recommending that America abandon 'containment' and start 'rolling back' Communism. This led Truman to consider driving the Communists out of North Korea.

In retrospect Truman was partially right but for the wrong reasons he said for the sake of democracy we had to stop communism.In reality what they had to stop was Stalin.He indeed did see himself as dominating the world.Heres one of Stalins quotes "As Lenin has said, a terrible clash between Soviet Russia and the capitalist States must inevitably occur...Therefore we must try to take the enemy by surprise, seize a moment when his forces are dispersed."

This was nothing more then a continuation of the berlin wall Stalin trying to consolidate Soviet gains. Do you know how there became a north and south?When Japanese occupation of Korea ended with its defeat in the second world war. The victorious Russians and Americans divided Korea at the 38th parallel. In 1948, both super powers withdrew. In the South, the Americans had installed Syngman Rhee, a long-standing, aggressive nationalist leader. For the North, Stalin chose Kim Sung, a former captain in the Soviet Red Army, to lead the communist regime.So this was nothing more then a proxy war but i honestly believe had the United States not fought this war Stalin would have seen it as weakness and continued his expansions and eventually even Europe would have been under his control.

reply to post by LifeInDeath


bull#


"MacArthur eventually threatened to kick it up into World War III when he wanted to start using nukes against the Chinese when they started to turn the tide. Calmer heads prevailed (Truman, I mean), and his requests were denied, thank goodness. "

soory i diagree,

,ignore above outburst.

Calmer heads prevailed (Truman, I mean), and his requests were denied, thank goodness.

the u.n betrayed MacArthur,,as did Truman.

MacArthur eventually threatened to kick it up into World War III when he wanted to start using nukes against the Chinese when they started to turn the tide.

They should have let him go,,,
we would not be where we are today,,fighting the same war.

Patton was right as well.

Originally posted by BobAthome
the u.n betrayed MacArthur,,as did Truman.

And how, exactly, does a President betray a commander who is sworn to obey the President's orders? The President sets policy, including whether or not to use nukes, a General's job is to carry out that policy. He's welcome to make requests and suggestions, as he did, but denial of those requests is not betrayal.

They should have let him go,,,
we would not be where we are today,,fighting the same war.

Patton was right as well.

MacArthur wanted to drop 30 or so atomic bombs on the Manchurian border with China. You really think allowing a nuclear holocaust like that to happen is a good thing? How many would have died because of that? Not just in the initial strike, but decades on from all the radiation it would have released? You don't think killing millions is ever a good idea if it can be avoided?

Patton was nuts that he thought we could have beat the Russian Army in Europe at the end of WWII. They had better tanks, more men and were far, far more willing to absorb losses then we ever were. They lost almost 400,000 men in the conquest of Berlin alone, and still had over 2 million men in that one army left over, where as the U.S. lost about 500,000 in all of WWII. The Russians lost even more than that in other battles they fought. Also, we didn't really have a big stockpile of atomic bombs right after the war (and at the time of VE day, we didn't even have the bomb yet), so the threat of the bomb vs. the USSR was basically a big bluff until we had built a bunch, and that took a lot of time.

reply to post by LifeInDeath


the u.n betrayed MacArthur,,American Forces were told too enter through a certain Pass,, by there,, un commanders orders,, they were ambushed,,too this day i believe that military intelligence was given wholeheartadly too Russia and China,,through the U.N,,command,,they were Betrayed.


as did Truman. was Duped,,by the New Idea of a United Nations,,for Peace,,one of its originators a Canadian Prime Minister,,named lester B Pearson,,


Truman. was Duped,,he listened too a united nations body,,its instead of his General,,

he was betrayed by his American ,,President.


Patton was still right.

reply to post by BobAthome

I still fail to see how any of what you say, even if true (and I don't even begin to know what incident you are talking about, you really should link to some article or something, at least), makes it right to unleash a nuclear holocaust on the region that would have killed millions and maybe started a third world war.

Also, how would have been right for Patton to start a war with the USSR in Europe that would have probably led to all of our forces there being wiped out completely? How would that have improved our position in Post War Europe?

reply to post by LifeInDeath


"would have probably led to all of our forces there being wiped out completely?"

got a link for that?

anyway gotta go,,watch the **************BATTLE OF NEW YORK**********

its a hockey game

reply to post by LifeInDeath


As far as nuking i agree all around bad idea however Patton would have taken the rest of Germany if they let him.He was ordered to stop and wait for the Russians it was politics.As for Russians having better tanks what are you talking about the t 26 or 28 or maybe the t 70??? First the T26 and T28 they were held together with bailing wire and spit. The only tank they had worth anything was T-34 they didnt start producing them until about 43
were in limited production just didnt have that many.Had a lot of sherman tanks though.So the irony is Patton would have been fighting US tanks luckily for him he had M26 Pershing tanks. Hed of demolished the Russians if need be but he wouldnt have had to. Where ever he met the Russians they would have stopped the point was to link up.

reply to post by LifeInDeath


He was recommending we nuke the Korean border actually.I think this was one of the reasons they pulled him out of the Korean war.Let us just say all those years of combat hardened him and he believed in winning at all costs.

Originally posted by dragonridr
reply to post by LifeInDeath

 

He was recommending we nuke the Korean border actually.I think this was one of the reasons they pulled him out of the Korean war.Let us just say all those years of combat hardened him and he believed in winning at all costs.

He wanted to nuke Manchuria just over the Korean border, or perhaps right along it, he was trying to take all of N. Korea to unify the North and South, and by nuking the region he would have wiped out the supply lines, bases, etc. the Chinese were using there. Looking at it as just a military problem, it makes sense, but looking at it as a geo-strategic and political problem, there's a lot more to consider.

Originally posted by BobAthome
reply to post by LifeInDeath

 

the u.n betrayed MacArthur,,American Forces were told too enter through a certain Pass,, by there,, un commanders orders,, they were ambushed,,too this day i believe that military intelligence was given wholeheartadly too Russia and China,,through the U.N,,command,,they were Betrayed.


as did Truman. was Duped,,by the New Idea of a United Nations,,for Peace,,one of its originators a Canadian Prime Minister,,named lester B Pearson,,


Truman. was Duped,,he listened too a united nations body,,its instead of his General,,

he was betrayed by his American ,,President.

edit on 25-5-2012 by BobAthome because: (no reason given)

Patton was still right.

edit on 25-5-2012 by BobAthome because: (no reason given)

What are you talking about? There was no ambush set up by the UN. His plan for the Korean war was to bomb China’s “sanctuaries” in Manchuria; blockading the Chinese coast; unleashing Chiang Kai-shek’s army, holed up in Formosa,And diversionary raids on the Chinese mainland. Such was MacArthur’s plan “to bring hostilities to a close with the least possible delay.” As he stated “In war, indeed, there is no substitute for victory,” However the nuclear option wasnt discussed publicly its all rumors started by Truman camp ( not sure if i believe it) but keep in mind Truman was fighting for his survival against MacArthur the US public and congress were infatuated with the war hero.

www.dailymail.co.uk... html
It was Chuchill's plan to attack Russia, and Patton bought into the idea. The plan was to use the atom bomb. The western Allies had much better logistics at the end of the war. Given time, the Soviets would repair their damages so the time to strike had to be soon. American leaders had no stomach for a war on the USSR, and neither did the British public. Churchill and Patton were both realists when it came to military operations. When they said they could win a war against the USSR, I believe them. Churchill and Patton were aware of the savagery the Soviet Army was inflicting, including the killing of American soldiers captured by the Soviets. Neither man had any illusions regarding Stalin.

reply to post by CaticusMaximus

I will tell you a Statement that the U.S. Government as well as several U.S. Presidents and the U.S. Military have ALL said that is a TRUTH. If North Korea decides to attack South Korea...the North will be wiped off the map. If the North Koreans attempt any kind of Nuclear Attack on either the South or any U.S. Targets or U.S. Interests.....
....NORTH KOREA WILL CEASE TO EXIST! This is not a lie. Split Infinity