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Do Ron Paul Supporters Want a Totalitarian Regime?

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posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:15 PM
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I want to start this off by saying I'm not creating this thread to bait anyone. I'm actually interested in the answer considering some of the rhetoric that I have seen on these boards. Now I don't generally frequent the political boards unless I see a specific topic trending across a number of threads so admittedly my observations are somewhat limited.

What I'm seeing are people trying to figure out how bound delegates can get away with not voting for Romney. To many this probably just seems like political strategy but when you look at the bigger picture it takes on a darker hue. For the most part the delegate process represents the government of the United States as a whole, just on a smaller scale. We have the general population expressing their wishes and then we have representatives who are supposed to represent the desires of their constituency. In this case we hold a primary to determine who the people want as their candidate in the general election and then we have delegates represent that choice at the National Convention. While the specifics are a little different it is more or less a representation of the government laid out in the Constitution.

The point where it gets dark is when it is pointed out to Ron Paul supporters that by abstaining or attempting to vote against the candidate to which they are bound that they are ignoring the will of the people they are supposed to represent. When this gets mentioned the general response that I have seen is that people who do not research the candidates should more or less not be allowed to vote. Now combine this with the fact that many Paul supporters in the past have said that anyone who properly researches the candidates will support Ron Paul. What you're left with is the opinion that only Ron Paul supporters should be allowed to vote. I'm not saying this is what people actually mean but this is the direction the rhetoric I have seen suggests.

Now I do want to say that I am not saying that Ron Paul wants a totalitarian regime. He truly does seem to know and support the Constitution. What I'm saying is many of his supporters aren't exemplifying the ideals of their candidate. It seems like they are willing to throw the Constitution out the window in order to get their candidate in office, ignoring the will of the people, simply because they think he's the right choice.

So, I guess I'll end this post with a question to all Ron Paul supporters that I hope can cut to the heart of what I've seen. If you could invalidate the votes of everyone who doesn't support Ron Paul would you?




posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:18 PM
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I thought that was precisely what we were trying to replace ?

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posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:21 PM
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So, I guess I'll end this post with a question to all Ron Paul supporters that I hope can cut to the heart of what I've seen. If you could invalidate the votes of everyone who doesn't support Ron Paul would you?


The simple answer is no, I wouldn't. Anyone who in this day, at this time in our country who believes any change will come about for the betterment of our people and our society by voting for Romney or Obama for that matter is either delusional or actively ignoring all the simple truths in the world and choosing to stay in the "matrix".

People wan't real change, and not the kind Obama promised.......



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:23 PM
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Originally posted by Helious
People wan't real change, and not the kind Obama promised.......
I 2nd that.

And just looking at Romneys background makes me want to vomit.

Really the only other reasonable (and consistent) candidate is Ron Paul.



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:24 PM
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reply to post by R0CR13
 


That's what I thought as well. However, look at some of the strategies being laid out in the threads on here. They want to ignore the will of the majority and work the system in a way that will benefit their interests. How is that any different than the tactics used by corporations and 1%?



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:26 PM
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reply to post by Xcalibur254
 


What? Your entire thread confuses me...




Do Ron Paul Supporters Want a Totalitarian Regime?




I want to start this off by saying I'm not creating this thread to bait anyone.





Now I do want to say that I am not saying that Ron Paul wants a totalitarian regime.


Send mix signals much? And if you're so concerned with the delegate process, because it's the theme of your thread, are you upset about the delegate fraud/issues Ron Paul supporters faced in a few states so far?



You do know this delegate game to get RP the Rep. nomination stems from the RP campaign, not his supporters. So you're saying RP supporters are throwing out the Constitution but RP himself isn't? Do you really think the RP staffers and RP himself are throwing out the Constitution to hopefully become President because they're playing the delegate game?.....


Either way, you're wrong.
edit on 30-4-2012 by Swills because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:29 PM
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Wait, the delegates aren't people? Abstaining to vote on the first ballot unwinds them. They aren't forced to vote for Romney, that's exactly why they CAN abstain from voting. The republican party is a private corporation. They choose their rules. They aren't breaking the rules even if they do abstain from voting. Just like the MSM isn't breaking the rules by saying Romney won (when he wins the straw poll but not the delegates) and that Romney won (when he won the delegates but not the straw poll) its not breaking any rules, it's not totalitarianism. The totalitarianism would come in when a bound delegate must vote for the candidate he/she is bound to. Yes, I agree that the candidates and vote counters should listen to the people. But if they really were listening to the people we wouldn't have the electoral college (who can conveniently ignore the will of the people)



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:30 PM
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Right because using the delegate process in our favor, despite the voting fraud, the diebold voting machines, the msm bias, and the shills that seem to fill so many websites and news media (not talking about you). The fact is that most people don't vote, and that the voting process is currently rigged. People aren't being represented properly, and voting should be seen as a celebratory kinda-of-deal, rather than the mundane process its been turned into today. People seem to be acting like the Ron Paul supporters don't count as American voters...
edit on 30-4-2012 by dadank because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:30 PM
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Oh come on with this thread title...


You could have worded it a bit better, if your goal wasn't to "bait" anyone.

Your entire point is that:

"All those who promote and support Ron Paul's views wish for a totalitarian government because the delegates think Mitt Romney is an idiot."

.... Come on...


Sounds like you are voting for Obama, which is perfectly fine.
Because it's all an illusion in the first place.

This whole idea that you are stating "the people clearly want Romney" is a farce --- due to vote rigging and media lies.

People have been brainwashed into accepting Romney/Obama just as they were with Bush and the majority of presidents before them.

Look at the bigger picture.


---- I like Ron Paul's speeches, and fully agree with them. I liked the ones he made 30 years ago too. Obama never impressed me, although he can sing very well he is not fit to be President as he openly dishonors MY Constitution.

Hope I've made it a bit more clear for you.



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:31 PM
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reply to post by Xcalibur254
 


It is fighting fire with fire to engage an enemy opposition who dictates the battle ground requires us to do just that ...engage in the same tactics they have ... subvert control over the reigns of power ... Hey aren't you glad were are Libertarians not fascist totalitarians ? ... enjoy the ride this should be good .

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posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:32 PM
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reply to post by Helious
 


You as well as a few others around here would do well to face the fact that the majority of the people of this country and in fact many countries like Ron Paul! When this country is finally freed, you may leave it if you wish. As each day goes by, we see more and more truth about Paul's popularity. It can no longer be hidden by TPTB or anyone else for that matter. TPTB and their tools are not only losing the battle but the war!



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:32 PM
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I think that you need to give your fellow citizens a little more credit. Most people are honest, hardworking individuals who want nothing more than what they believe is rightly theirs. I simply want the 100% of the money I work for, the land I live on, the right to grow my family's food, and the right to my own thoughts.

I don't think the majority is willing to cheat to win. It is all about the message of what direction we should be heading towards. Forwards instead of backwards.



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:34 PM
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We already have a "Totalitarian Regime". If I have to have a "Dictador", let me choose him at least one time in my life.

Let's face it, there aren't anymore JFKs.



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:36 PM
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Given that the media refuses to not acknowledge him and that some of the primary voting results have been proven to be manipulated, I don't know what choice he has. Also, I don't agree that his supporters are disregarding the constitution - it's not like they're breaking any rules... unlike some of the other candidates. I actually think of his strategy to be rather clever



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:39 PM
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reply to post by Xcalibur254
 


Haven't you heard, Ron Paul supporters know better than everyone else.

They are the only ones that know the "true" meaning of the Constitution.

They are the only ones that know the real delegate count.

They are the only ones that know the true level of support Ron Paul has (by the way, it is close to 99%...according to them).

They are the only ones who's votes matter.

They are the only ones who really know the rules.

They are the only ones that matter.

They are the only ones who are "awake".

And they are the only ones that believe all of the above.
edit on 30-4-2012 by OutKast Searcher because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:40 PM
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When your country is in the process of electing a presidential candidate, I'm painfully observing the process. Either way it goes, regarding who's elected, my (western) country bows and follows the tone your government sets. This regards any policy, regulation or general direction your government takes. They'll do anything to be part of the table of the "cool guys".

But if Ron Paul were elected as president, I'm not sure how my country would react. It would actually confuse the politicians so much, they would'nt know up from down. At the least it would make us, the people, realize that the economic and moral corruption we've been allowing all this time would meet its end. At least I hope so.



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:42 PM
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Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by Xcalibur254
 


Haven't you heard, Ron Paul supporters know better than everyone else.

They are the only ones that know the "true" meaning of the Constitution.

They are the only ones who's votes matter.

They are the only ones who really know the rules.

They are the only ones that matter.

They are the only ones who are "awake".

And they are the only ones that believe all of the above.


Here he comes, ATS's #1 Anti Ron Paul poster.

You didn't even read the OPs post did you? If you did you just ignored it so you can, yet again, make baseless and general attacks of Ron Paul supporters. Do you just sit and wait for any and all Ron Paul threads to be created so you can hurry in with your Negative comments?
edit on 30-4-2012 by Swills because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:43 PM
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Originally posted by Monsatan
But if they really were listening to the people we wouldn't have the electoral college (who can conveniently ignore the will of the people)


The Electoral College is bound by law to vote in the manner prescribed. They don't "conveniently ignore the will of the people." The mistake here is assuming only the vote of the people matter and all votes should be strictly person to candidate. So once in awhile you have a candidate who wins via the electoral college when the popular vote was very close, but opposite.

If there were no Electoral College, then the East and Eest Coast states would elect the President, and everyone iin any other state should just as well stay home, including all the flyover states. Because of the nature of the Electoral College, candidates are forced to pay attention to all states, even those with few electoral votes, because each one on its own could tip the election.

This was done originally quite on purpose in an attempt to keep the power out of the hands of the Federal government and in the hands of the states, i.e.: States were considered equal partners in the Federal government because iot was teh States that agreed to form the union. The People had a direct voice through the House and an indirect voice through the Senate. In other words, Senators were to be the representatives of the States, not direct representatives of the people. The 17th amendment changed all that.

Now the argument is that the Electoral College should be eliminated, but look what we have done. The 17th amendment stripped states rights and gave that power not to the people, but consolidated it in the Federal government and cutting the states completely out of governing the Federation. Abolishing the Electoral College would complete the process. In wanting power for ourselves, we ceded it to an over-reaching government.

Next, we will be complaining about the power of the Federal government. well, if we give it to them, what do you expect? We killed what power the states had, then we bemoan the fact that the Feds keep telling us what to do.



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:49 PM
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reply to post by Xcalibur254
 


The Republican and Democratic National Parties are independent organizations. The votes of the people do not matter regardless and they are not bound by any rules and regulations to determine who is their candidate. The only thing is that they need to maintain their image in front of the public.

If you want to blame anyone with how the delegate selection process was created, and how it can be abused, then blame the party system, a system that has been created outside of the Constitution and the rules for voting that exists in the American government.

If there were existing, fair ways for candidates to stand a chance in presidential elections, and if the parties did not hold a standing monopoly over the candidacy, then these methods would not be necessary.

Get the idea that there is any fairness or unfairness in a primary election. It isn't even required by law, we just accept it and thus have to abide by the principles set forth. Deal with it.



posted on Apr, 30 2012 @ 06:51 PM
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To summarize, when the actual general election is being abused and defaced, then you can talk. Luckily, as it stands, the general election still abides by the Constitution, even if the voting system has shown signs of heavy tampering.



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