Man arrested for reading the Holy Bible in public

Originally posted by Ex_CT2

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
The point i am trying to make in this thread, is that this is the beginning of something nasty thats coming our way. What else can we be losing? Arizona passed a bill where you can get 6 months in jail for saying something someone found offensive. So for all the trolls on ATS that love to do drivebys, that could potentially put you in a bind and would be a violation of your freedmon of speech.

Our freedoms as americans are being eroded one by one, without hardly a fuss. This is not the america i grew up in years ago i can tell you this. Freedom of speech and freedom of religion heading out the door, the right to bear arms next on the chopping block...where will this end?

I don't think anyone would argue with you about how we're losing our liberties. But preaching at captive audiences is not right, and it's not a recognized liberty....

Then why don't they arrests people that protest at funerals?

Originally posted by CaptainNemo
reply to post by XelNaga

 

Yeah, that's essentially NAZI mentality!

Didn't some of the first people that came to this land, come to escape religious persecution?! And now, in this day people can be thrown and jail for exercising religious freedom and freedom of speech... I am OUTRAGED. See how this hotshot moron grins as he's arresting this man. He didn't warn him and he couldn't even tell him what he was being arrested for. This is NOT the type of person I want prote..I mean harassing my fellow man.

What the hell is the matter with religious people that they think forcing their preachings on trapped and helpless people is religious FREEDOM?

What our ancestors came here to escape was that exact thing, for chrissake!

Originally posted by CaptainNemo


Then why don't they arrests people that protest at funerals?

I do not know. But that doesn't make this nonsense right.

Two. Wrongs. Do. Not. Make. A. Right.

Mother never taught you that?

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


The answer to this is here: LINK

The Doctrine: This is why the Court has acknowledged that "we are often `captives' outside the sanctuary of the home and subject to objectionable speech," 41 and concluded that despite this such speech can't be restricted. This was first made clear in Cohen v. California, where the government sought to bar public profanity. But even though constitutionally protecting such profanity made us all captive to it -- wherever we go on the street, we might run into profane or otherwise offensive speech -- the Court held that banning such profanity, even in the presence of a "captive audience," is unconstitutional.

But, and this is a big but...

The only other serious mention of captive audiences outside the home is a dictum in Erznoznik v. City of Jacksonville, where the Court said that certain content-based restrictions may be permissible if "the degree of captivity makes it impractical for the unwilling viewer or auditor to avoid exposure" and when at the same time "substantial privacy interests are being invaded in an essentially intolerable manner." 55 But as the examples I mention above suggest, this must be a narrow exception indeed: Even where it is in fact impractical for people to avoid exposure to picketing, demonstrations, and the like, the government may not restrict them. And in fact, the Court has never acted on this dictum. 56

It still comes down to a matter of who owns the property, they in turn have the right to not allow anyone to be there or tell them how they can act. Someone or thing owns that parking lot they were in and in America private property rights are sacred.

even though I believe in religious freedom, these people were standing line in waiting to do something and these people were annoying.

Personally I think the guy had good intentions, but that's not how you deal with people these days.
If you want to talk to someone about God you don't start reading random chapters out of the Bible.
Pull someone aside, ask them if they would be interested in hearing what you have to say.
If they say no, then pray for that person, if they say yes then great but forcing someone to listen to you is not the answer!

Amen Amen

Anyone who get offended at anyone reading anything, apart from something totally obscene, in a public space is absolutely pathetic in my opinion. If you do not agree with it, you don't have to listen to it. And I don't care what religion, whether Christianity, Islam, Judaism, etc, was being represented by the act, because free speech is free speech.

It isn't just free speech when YOU or anyone else wants to hear it, and if you do not want to hear it, that doesn't mean it isn't free speech. All of these little laws that cops use to keep people from exercising their rights, especially city ordinances in some places, are nothing more than an assault on American liberties. Americans like to tout that they are "free", when everywhere you turn there is restriction after restriction. All in the name of national security...trust the government, etc...People need to first grow up, and then wake up.

Originally posted by Ex_CT2

Originally posted by CaptainNemo
reply to post by XelNaga

 

Yeah, that's essentially NAZI mentality!

Didn't some of the first people that came to this land, come to escape religious persecution?! And now, in this day people can be thrown and jail for exercising religious freedom and freedom of speech... I am OUTRAGED. See how this hotshot moron grins as he's arresting this man. He didn't warn him and he couldn't even tell him what he was being arrested for. This is NOT the type of person I want prote..I mean harassing my fellow man.

What the hell is the matter with religious people that they think forcing their preachings on trapped and helpless people is religious FREEDOM?

What our ancestors came here to escape was that exact thing, for chrissake!

Trapped and helpless?! You are verily a weak minded human being if you get offended buy them, and i'm not talking about the radicals. It's a constitutional right! I don't care about your opinion because thankfully, the majority of people don't feel the same way as you! It's not a reason to arrest somebody.

My question is separation of church and state kicks in here before the cop even says anything right?

"Then came one and told them, saying, Behold, the men whom ye put in prison are standing in the temple, and teaching the people. Then went the captain with the officers, and brought them without violence: for they feared the people, lest they should have been stoned. And when they had brought them, they set them before the council: and the high priest asked them, Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? and, behold, ye have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us. Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, 'We ought to obey God rather than men.'" -Acts 5:26-29

I may or may not agree with everything the men in the video believe, but I know how difficult it is to put yourself out there. Laws didn't stop Jesus and it didn't stop his apostles, there is nothing more Christian than to peacefully break the law in an effort to talk about the Scriptures.

OK. I give up. I thank your psychotic God I'm not a captive audience, and I can go elsewhere....

Originally posted by shortyboy
My question is separation of church and state kicks in here before the cop even says anything right?

One could argue that there could be some stipulation that because it's on government grounds, if the demonstration took some odd twist it could REMOTELY be grounds to arrest. Yes, there is separation between church and state within the government, but THAT does not supersede individual rights.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
Man arrested for reading the Holy Bible in public,

No, he wasnt.
He was arrested for being an annoying dick.
The same thing would have happened whether it had been the Koran, the Torah, the Bible, the Dictionary, a copy of King Solomons Mines, Moby Dick, the script of Avatar, or postings from ATS.

People waiting in line have the right to not be ranted at.

reply to post by XelNaga

read the bible out loud in church or home, not in public.

Are you nuts? That's a violation of his civil rights. You may not like the message, but at least you could defend his constitutional rights to have that opposite opinion. It's both a freedom of speech and a freedom of religion issue.

Originally posted by alfa1

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
Man arrested for reading the Holy Bible in public,

No, he wasnt.
He was arrested for being an annoying dick.
The same thing would have happened whether it had been the Koran, the Torah, the Bible, the Dictionary, a copy of King Solomons Mines, Moby Dick, the script of Avatar, or postings from ATS.

People waiting in line have the right to not be ranted at.

I'm appalled! There exists no "Freedom from religion" clause the the Bill of Rights. His rights were violated even if you don't agree with anything he had to say. It's not like he yelled "Fire" in a crowded theater or "bomb" on an airplane.

Rights can be violated if it's the "other guy" huh? What happened to this country and our rights our fathers and grandfathers shed their blood to defend?

Shame on you!

Originally posted by CaptainNemo

Originally posted by shortyboy
My question is separation of church and state kicks in here before the cop even says anything right?

One could argue that there could be some stipulation that because it's on government grounds, if the demonstration took some odd twist it could REMOTELY be grounds to arrest. Yes, there is separation between church and state within the government, but THAT does not supersede individual rights.

It makes no difference, his speaking wasn't funded in any way by the government. It's an individuals free expression of religion. it would be no different than a teacher wearing a cross necklace in a public school. The SCOTUS has ruled that doesn't fall under the separation clause. Any kid in school can freely pray in public school if they want and it's not encouraged by any school official.

Originally posted by shortyboy
My question is separation of church and state kicks in here before the cop even says anything right?

Absolutely not. Your rights end where that person's rights begin.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

I'm appalled! There exists no "Freedom from religion" clause the the Bill of Rights.

Oh thats on it's way, stick around and wait another year or so.

What i am appalled at is there's no freedom from anti-religion. Religious people are forced to sit helplessly by while public schools shove evolution down their kids throats, which violates the freedom of religion amendment on the parents' behalf.

In fact, is starting in Canada but you know it will make its way here where parents homeschooling their children will not be able to teach them religious values within the confines of their own homes. Before too long the cops will be ransacking your homes in illegal searches and siezures to confiscate your bibles or cross pendants and burn them in the streets.

Were about to cross the biggest threshold in american history, just wait and see.

Originally posted by GmoS719
Personally I think the guy had good intentions, but that's not how you deal with people these days.
If you want to talk to someone about God you don't start reading random chapters out of the Bible.
Pull someone aside, ask them if they would be interested in hearing what you have to say.
If they say no, then pray for that person, if they say yes then great but forcing someone to listen to you is not the answer!

Amen Amen

You're right there, he should have served those folks, brought them water, asked if anyone needed anything, tried to befriend them. But even if he wanted to do it in a douchebag way, it's his civil rights. He just won't get many people asking him about Christ that way he approached it.