How would Muslims react?

Considering the situation in the Muslim world and their willingness to participate in acts of violence in the name of allah:

How would they react if loose groups of people in the western world began to kidnap their holy men, their wives and their daughters and then execute them?
(executions as a declared political act of free speech and freedom from religious repression)

that would be intresting. thats all i have to say

Since that's what they know and live by (violence), I think they would just get much, much worse. Giveing them a real reason for revenge would be right up their alley.
The whole Muslim world would descend on us. "Good ones" and "bad ones"
And unlike us they don't mind killing themselves along with their enemies in the name of Allah.

Probably not the way you might expect. The western world does not encompass the jihad philosophy, meaning that it is possible that the rights afforded to martyrdom for the extremist muslims, extend to death in captivity.

My question would not be that but, to those westerners seeking work in Iraq knowing of the volatility in the country, do you anticipate that you would be one of the fortunate to escape the violence, one that is tough enough to walk the talk and kill them if they try to kill you, and when you have decided to venture over there knowing the circumstances and is kidnapped, would you beg to be freed or play the martyr?

depends who u ask,

if u asked say fanoose he would manipulate it to say that its so horrible, but cutting off the infidel heads is a normal, practicle deal.

while if u asked a muslim that is actually a peaceful one they would say 2 wrongs dont make a right imho

if u asked a neo con they would say # ISLAM


more then likly that is...

Chuck,

My heart agree's with you.
My head, fortunatly in charge, does not. I understand your eye for an eye mentality.
IMO, the difference is we, the Western World (USA for me) are supposed to be the good guys. The good guys don't do what the bad guys do-that is what makes them the "bad" guys and us the "good" guys. If we did that, we would be no better than they are.

Please understad, this is not a personal attack on u, just a strong disagreement with how to resolve a bad situation.

Probably the same way Christians react when one of thiers kills a doctor performing abortions,

How would they West react if all Muslim nations participated in economic sanctions against the US they way the West imposes sanctions on Cuba, Iraq, Sudan and others?

How would the West react if the military situation were reversed and the most powerful armies in the world were Muslim armies who decided to liberate the US from a leader and a way of life they disagred with?

How would the West view the collateral damage that comes from such a liberation and occupation?

Would they resort to terrorist activities themselves?

Muslims already are reacting to a situation they see as wrong against their own kind. When muslims see their countries invaded and taken over due to the actions of a handful of fanatics using their religion, and with the current invasion being considered illegal by the very group that issued the sanctions that were used as the impetus of the attack, reactionary extremists are the result. Of couse nobody should cut off the heads of other people, but its just as bad, and even worse, that they are subjected to an even larger injustice and violence.

[edit on 22-9-2004 by heelstone]

Originally posted by heelstone
Muslims already are reacting to a situation they see as wrong against their own kind. When muslims see their countries invaded and taken over due to the results of a handful of fanatics using their religion, and with the current invasion being considered illegal by the very group that issued the sanctions that were used as the impetus of the attack, reactionary extremists are the result. Of couse nobody should cut off the heads of other people, but its just as bad, no worse, that they are subjected to an even larger injustice and violence.

That's true.

Being a Christian is not a pre-requisite to being a murderer, whether it be the doctor or the person that kills him. Very disrespectful of you to classify Christians that way. Not all Christians react the same way to every situation.

Like so many others, I believe it would be a Very Bad Idea. Those people would probably die as martyrs (You can twist religious text to mena about anything) and just strengthen their resolve, as well as horrify most of the Western World' populace as much as Jihad beheadings do.

Originally posted by jsobecky
Being a Christian is not a pre-requisite to being a murderer, whether it be the doctor or the person that kills him. Very disrespectful of you to classify Christians that way. Not all Christians react the same way to every situation.

Which, of course, is also true about those in the 'Muslim world'.

They would most likely feel the same as you and myself as well as every one else. But it wouldn't make it right, that would be stooping to their level, and everyone knows if we did that the propaganda machine would go hog wild.

I can see Americans going to the mid east to drive cabs, just to annoy the locals, but any thing violent is out of the question. We should remember what this nation once stood for, and will stand for again.

Violence and war are last resort tactics, such force should be used with the golden rule in mind and discretion. They are getting what they ask for, and deserve. With that said/typed negotiations are a much better way of solving political issues, but when negotiation is not an option that is when force is considered. Reagan negotiated with terrorists, let us not forget the Iran/contra affair, and the repurcussions can still be felt today. Everyone who is over seas fighting the extreamists should do so swiftly and decisively, enough coddling the civilains with the political correctness retoric, is isn't solving anything and only makes the situation more difficult to handle. If the civilians in the war zone are not bright enought to get the hell out of the area, they take responsibility for their own lives. They are aware of the consequences, they have lived in and around a war zone all their lives and so have their ancestors. So all this (in my opinion) crap about collateral damage/civilian casualties is BS, it is WAR not a day in the freaking park!

Get on the same page, the world we live in isn't ran by the "good" guys...

Let it be known, those of us who knew, tried.

Originally posted by AceOfBase
How would they West react if all Muslim nations participated in economic sanctions against the US they way the West imposes sanctions on Cuba, Iraq, Sudan and others?

The Muslim nations haven't got anything that we so desperately need. Oil? An oil reserve has been found off the Louisiana coast capable of sustaining this nation for a good while, not to mention untapped reserves at Point Barrow, Alaska. Like I said, there isn't one thing we need from any Muslim nation.

How would the West react if the military situation were reversed and the most powerful armies in the world were Muslim armies who decided to liberate the US from a leader and a way of life they disagred with?

If you're referring to the overthrowing of Saddam's Regime by the American-led coalition, there were people there that wanted him out, but couldn't speak up. We didn't disagree with their way of life. It's the barbarism that we disagreed with. The violence that is happening there now, is remnants of the Saddam era. It will soon vanish. Building a Democracy is not something that happens over night. In 1776, America declared it's Independence and it took 13 years before our Constitution was written and began to get ratified. In the long run, it will be well worth the effort.

How would the West view the collateral damage that comes from such a liberation and occupation?

The Western views of life are different than thsose of the extremist Muslim nations. We cherish life in ways that the Muslim don't seem to understand. They blow themselves up with explosives in crowded public places. What kind of tactic is that? We on the other hand, would want to live to fight them today and tomorrow.

Would they resort to terrorist activities themselves?

I wouldn't call it terrorist activities. I will call it guerrilla type warfare, the exception being; discriminating between the innocent and the enemy.

Getting back to the topic of the thread, how much worse could they act? It's not like they're choirboys now.

[edit on 23/9/04 by Intelearthling]

To Elaine, Heelstone and Advisor,

Good answers all! The question was posited as a supposition, a "what if", and the answers so far show a common knowledge of the perception in middle-eastern society which most of the west poorly comprehends, that the westerners mere presense is an invasion not to be tolerated.

by Elaine
Since that's what they know and live by (violence), I think they would just get much, much worse. Giveing them a real reason for revenge would be right up their alley. The whole Muslim world would descend on us. "Good ones" and "bad ones" And unlike us they don't mind killing themselves along with their enemies in the name of Allah.

While the actions stated in the original question may cause some fear in western Muslims, the middle-eastern sociological answer would be a welcome verification of the wests 'Satanic' actions, probably resulting in increased violence. This would be inline with the teaching that the best way to go to heaven for a true Muslim is through a holy war action. The victims of the western actions could be considered martyrs and their deaths would be celebrated and then revenged.

by AdvisorViolence and war are last resort tactics, such force should be used with the golden rule in mind and discretion. They are getting what they ask for, and deserve.

by HeelstoneMuslims already are reacting to a situation they see as wrong against their own kind.

In getting what they ask for and deserve, violence toward an invader is legitimatized by Allah as a holy act, even if the action results in the death of the Muslim warrior, again a martyr. There is an issue that becomes very apparent, that within the middle-eastern societies value system physical life has no perceptual value. The western idea of 'discretion' and the western/buddist/hindu idea of a 'golden rule' (Karma/karmic retribution) has no meaning to someone raised in the societal foundations, and a religion created on, the basis of the Bedouin tribal hierarchy.


.

Intelearthling, the last I heard, the ANWR reserves could provide an estimated 1 -1.5 million barrels per day and the ANWR reserve is larger than the reserves in Texas or Lousiana. Nowhere near enough to eliminate dependence on imports.


Here's a statement from 2003:
DOI.gov
"ANWR could produce nearly 1.4 million barrels of oil, while Texas produces just more than one million barrels a day, California just less than one million barrels a day and Louisiana produces slightly more than 200,000 barrels a day."

If the reserves in Louisiana have increased since then, please post a link.


Anyway, resorting to violence against Muslims in the manner suggested in this thread might be done if the US is invaded by Muslim armies.
The thought of doing this to get back at people fighting the occupation in Iraq however, just doesn't seem like the right thing to do.

[edit on 23-9-2004 by AceOfBase]

Yea why dont we kidnap them and execute and then sell their body parts to pig farmers who will feed them to pigs.

The only problem I have with tribalism. Which so happens to be the historic or most common historic down fall of our race. Read it and weep, the truth is as real as the sun every dawn, in history our "conflicts" are preserved. Many books have been published, many that date centuries. It should stop and has everything to do with just about anything. Whether or not one admits it is a matter of personal ignorance.

"How would Muslims react", find one and ask.

[edit on 23-9-2004 by ADVISOR]

Originally posted by curme

Originally posted by jsobecky
Being a Christian is not a pre-requisite to being a murderer, whether it be the doctor or the person that kills him. Very disrespectful of you to classify Christians that way. Not all Christians react the same way to every situation.

Which, of course, is also true about those in the 'Muslim world'.

Sure does seem to be the sign of the times thoug, eh? Excuse me if i'm wrong here, but i don't ever remember hearing about a Christian extremist cowardly beheading abortion doctors on film and morbidly spreading it across the world wide web. Also, when was the last time an abortion doctor was murdered? Four years?

You are using an apples and oranges argument.


[edit on 23-9-2004 by goregrinder]