Did Carl Sagan know something?

Considering plasma balls or whatever you call them, have been photographed, both producung the crop circles, and "scouting out" spots where crop circles later apear(more than once spotted where a crop circle shows up soon afterwards....)
The physicality of the actual crop in an "authentic"is far more complex, than in hoaxed ones....
The stems are bent over just above ground level in such a way thet they are not snapped off or crushed.
The stem apears to have been heated from WITHIN, and it is sort of steamed at thet point.....
The cellular structure is altered.
NO bunch of drunks made the real ones.Electromagnetic and other phenomena are also associated with circles which are made in the foregoing description.
That some outside agency with advanced technological means has created some of these from a distance.....
How far that distance may be remains to be discovered.
How about we just take the contact at face value, and see where it may lead....?
Why get all het up about arguing the validity of form the communication takes?
If we are to get any further with this communication, we must reply, and we must take it seriously, at least until the skeptics come up with something better than a couple of old drunks.Or even a herd of biology majors for petes sake.....
Perhaps it is formed by beings which exist only one dimension away from us, but right here on earth.....
Perhaps we are seeing our first message from another star system.....
Whatever the source, we have to assume it is bona fide till proven otherwise.
The open contact type crop circles bring us cannot be intercepted or censored by TPTB.
The visitors may be pissed that the goodies they gave the Blck ops boys have not been shared ......?
Perhaps they grow weary of awaiting disclosure, and are trying to circumvent the goverments....?
This is precisely what they may do......its subtle for some, but it is undoubtedly gaining traction with me.....
As i have no ability to construct an answer i shall endeavour to make the suggested reply......
perhaps we all could try....
Any farmers out there who could plow or plant the reply in large type?

The next point is Carl Sagan, he had nothing to do with the composing of this message

reply to post by Chadwickus


He had a lot to do with composing the message!!!??? What you talkin' bout Willis?

Where in the world

Dr. Frank Drake, then at Cornell University and creator of the famous Drake equation, wrote the message, with help from Carl Sagan, among others.[1] The message consists of seven parts that encode the following (from the top down):[4] The numbers one (1) through ten (10) The atomic numbers of the elements hydrogen, carbon, nitrogen, oxygen, and phosphorus, which make up deoxyribonucleic acid (DNA) The formulas for the sugars and bases in the nucleotides of DNA The number of nucleotides in DNA, and a graphic of the double helix structure of DNA A graphic figure of a human, the dimension (physical height) of an average man, and the human population of Earth A graphic of the Solar System A graphic of the Arecibo radio telescope and the dimension (the physical diameter) of the transmitting antenna dish

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by MeMyselfI


I don't think that's Jupiter "glowing", rather, i believe it notes Jupiter's moons, which i think makes a lot more sense

Such amazing crop circles in the same area and no videos/pics of them in process. I agree, it IS about crop circles because without them, you have no thread.

The first AND second crop circles were "created" here www.stfc.ac.uk...

Chilbolton Observatory

Welcome to the home page for the Chilbolton Facility for Atmospheric and Radio Research (CFARR)
CFARR is one of the world's most advanced meteorological radar experimental facilities, and is home to the world's largest fully steerable meteorological radar, the Chilbolton Advanced Meteorological Radar (CAMRa). Live data from Chilbolton are showcased on the Chilbolton weather web.

In addition to our ongoing research programmes in meteorology and radio propagation, Chilbolton Observatory frequently hosts visiting experiments and research teams from universities and other research organisations, both from the UK and abroad.

In January 2006 Chilbolton received the first signals from the new GIOVE-A satellite launched for the ESA's Galileo navigation system. Recent developments have added new capability to detect orbiting satellites and space debris.

Chilbolton Observatory is part of the STFC. The facilities at Chilbolton are run by the Chilbolton Group of RAL Space (link opens in a new window) at Rutherford Appleton Laboratory and are funded largely through the Natural Environment Research Council (link opens in a new window) (NERC).

Forms to apply to use CFARR facilities or CFARR data archived by BADC are available from the user information page.

So, it happened right under some the brightest scientist's on earth's noses, with some of the most advanced technology and equipment around??? I'm sure they have some 24 hour staff.

Originally posted by stirling
Considering plasma balls or whatever you call them, have been photographed, both producung the crop circles, and "scouting out" spots where crop circles later apear(more than once spotted where a crop circle shows up soon afterwards....)
The physicality of the actual crop in an "authentic"is far more complex, than in hoaxed ones....
The stems are bent over just above ground level in such a way thet they are not snapped off or crushed.
The stem apears to have been heated from WITHIN, and it is sort of steamed at thet point.....
The cellular structure is altered.
NO bunch of drunks made the real ones.Electromagnetic and other phenomena are also associated with circles which are made in the foregoing description.
That some outside agency with advanced technological means has created some of these from a distance.....
How far that distance may be remains to be discovered.
How about we just take the contact at face value, and see where it may lead....?
Why get all het up about arguing the validity of form the communication takes?
If we are to get any further with this communication, we must reply, and we must take it seriously, at least until the skeptics come up with something better than a couple of old drunks.Or even a herd of biology majors for petes sake.....
Perhaps it is formed by beings which exist only one dimension away from us, but right here on earth.....
Perhaps we are seeing our first message from another star system.....
Whatever the source, we have to assume it is bona fide till proven otherwise.
The open contact type crop circles bring us cannot be intercepted or censored by TPTB.
The visitors may be pissed that the goodies they gave the Blck ops boys have not been shared ......?
Perhaps they grow weary of awaiting disclosure, and are trying to circumvent the goverments....?
This is precisely what they may do......its subtle for some, but it is undoubtedly gaining traction with me.....
As i have no ability to construct an answer i shall endeavour to make the suggested reply......
perhaps we all could try....
Any farmers out there who could plow or plant the reply in large type?

I wanted to quote this again because I believe you are absolutely correct.

I have heard of the lights or balls, if you will, creating some of the crop circles and have read accounts by eye witnesses who have actually seen the light at night and then wake up to see crop circles the next morning.

There is A LOT WE DO NOT KNOW and to think we are alone in the Universe and or dimensions...is naive.

The Chilbolton Observatory also has mega equipment:


Chilbolton's main dish Our main research tool at the Chilbolton Observatory is the 25m fully steerable antenna. The pioneering 3 GHz Doppler-polarisation radar is installed on this antenna, along with the 1275MHz clear air radar. Other facilities at the site include 35 and 94 GHz cloud radar systems, meteorological sensors and a high power UV lidar measuring cloud and water vapour profiles.

We operate a second field site at Sparsholt College, 8km from Chilbolton Observatory. This provides precipitation measurements at a distance where they can be usefully compared with measurements from the 3 GHz rain radar.

3 GHz rain radar - CAMRa
94 GHz cloud radar - Galileo
1275 MHz clear air radar - ACROBAT
35 GHz Doppler cloud radar - Copernicus
UV Raman lidar
IR lidar ceilometer
HALO Photonics Doppler lidar
Water vapour profiling radiometer
Cloud camera
Visible and IR broadband radiometer
Raingauges
Disdrometers (drop size distribution)
Meteorological sensors
Meteorological particle sensor
Present weather detector
5km radio links
Download information leaflets


So their cloud camera completely missed an alien visit?

"The JVC KYF55-BE digital camera is used to collect sky images. Images are stored every 5 minutes. The latest image is updated to the Chilbolton weather web display.
View the pointing parameters.
Images from the cloud camera are a useful tool to assist researchers in analysing data obtained from the other instruments at the Chilbolton Observatory site.
An archive of images is available at the British Atmospheric Data Centre."

Originally posted by samstone11


To your point, wasn't Carl Sagan known to be exceptionally closed minded, or for lack of a better word, stubborn regarding the presence or non-existence of ETs? As I recall, feel free to correct me if I am incorrect, he was a confirmed naysayer with no clear reasoning as to why he worked with the concept of aliens other than to disprove the idea?

It's possible that he felt that if he gave any opinion upon the existance of E.T, he would be immediately discredited and ridiculed. Therefore, he stayed neutral on the subject. Giving no ammunition to would be attackers.

I dont know why people think Professor Sagan didnt believe in extraterrestrials. He frequently talks about his belief that there is life more evolved in our universe then us.

It looks to me like the planetary diagram is indeed our solar system, and it would suggest that the aliens are on Earth, Mars, and 4 moons of Jupiter. But with a population of 21 billion, wouldn't we have seen some really clear evidence of their existence?? It leads me to believe the theories that they are future humans might actually be somewhat believable.

Originally posted by VelvetSplash
These particular crop circles always look waaaaaay too suspect to me.

It just so happens they show "aliens" looking exactly what the popular image of an alien is, i.e. the classic grey.

Nah, I don't buy it.

Yeah, it's a shame the OP had that typical alien face with the binary coded disc. Aside from that, the other face and the DNA message is very interesting.

You don't buy it, it's not for sale. I found enough intrigue in the rest of the post to ignore any discrepencies I have.

One question for you. The same question posed by the OP and the same question he repeatedly asked throughout this thread.

How did whoever it was that created the initial message to be sent from earth know that human DNA actually contained over 4 billion parts instead of the well known and generally accepted throughout the entire scientific community 1 billion?

Recall that the OP mentioned that basically the entire scientific community at the time this message was sent were on the same consensus that there were only 1 billion parts to human DNA.

-Alien

The fact that someone knew that DNA contained 4 billion parts versus 1 Billion back then is irrelevant to the so called Alien response and argument. That is a different conspiracy all together.

The fact is that the original message sent out DID contain 4 Billion (according to the OP) and not 1 billion. Hence, its plausible and makes sense that the so called drunks with time on their hands copied the message then slightly altered it to make it look like a response.
So:
1. Everyone as the OP said had seen the original message which contained 4 Billion DNA parts.
2. The drunks with time on their hands who didn't even know what DNA was simply copied the message with 4 billion parts and slightly altered the number.

Now had the original message that was sent would have contained that the Human DNA composed of 1 Billion parts and they replied back with 4 billion, and we found that out to be true after the fact then you might have something worth considering.


In addition with my problem with crop circles (agriculture graffiti ) is that you not only have to accept that Aliens exist, but you almost have to assume that the crop circles are being done by rebellious teenage Aliens. I can't imagine that we would find another planet with life and then we would have our Scientist and Engineers reply by graffiting their planet?

reply to post by MainLineThis
Wow, a strong reaction from you! No need to take it personal, I was just encouraging the OP to go on with this topic, wich I find very interesting.
Or do you have something at your heart you would want to share?

Why do Aliens do cropcircles? this is a simple answer, cropcircles are easy to do (at least for them), it make an impact on us when we see it (whatever is a true one or think its a hoax). Aliens do cropcircles too for another reason, its a way to communicate between them, many of the cropcircles are communications between different aliens species if you may say it, most of them have nothing to do with humans, just a few of them actually is for us (mesage) to play with it and have fun trying to make a scence of it. Why do aliens choose this medium???, easy they let us know something is up there without saying it loud and clear we are here!, makes our mind open up to the posibility of more intellegent life out there besides us, and at the same time let the status quo intact thinking we humans made it (most of the people think this, our ego in this case). Humans are not ready for open contact, even aliens knows this, thats why they let this little piece of stuff here, some other piece of stuff over there to let people know there are more stuff besides us on this planet, to makes us think and do our first baby steps into space, and why we will never see disclosure of this ?? at this time people dies from hunger, simple viruses and there are poeple living in tribes that have not contact any other human being, do they care about some images on the fields? nope, they care about food, water and dont die !


Do humans do cropcircles, yes of course we do! the simplier ones are made by aficionados, people who like to play games with it trying again to make impact but most of the times this ones are just way to badly done. Blacks OP's do too cropcircles, and i am not saying blacks ops like the ones who kill osama, i mean blacks ops who are way above this guys and they play with big toys (some ufo related toys) and can do cropcircles easy too and play the same games with aliens (play the game, doesnt mean they are on the same league like them).


Do this cropcircle was made by aficionados? I dont think so, this one either made by aliens or this blacks Ops who love to play with the big boys.


By the way aliens like in the picture (greys) are androids (organic androids without a soul), not REAL ALIENS, they are the workforce of the ET's, thats why even in the majic 12 documents are Called EBE's, of course majic 12 documents are hoax so you dont have to worry about it

One of the first things that came to my mind when seeing that one Compact Disc/Grey crop circle was the idea of listening to music by musicians now deceased...

The other was the fact that I am in a band with some people/person that I don't know if they are as honest about some possibly serious B.S.

Originally posted by VoidHawk
We have seen the formations and we know for absolute certain they were not made by any ordinary member of the public. To create formations of this detail, in the dark, overnight, would take military style planning. The scientific content of the formations is not the kind of stuff that us ordinary folk would know about either so who is left?

False. It has been demonstrated many times by those who have confessed to creating these "formations" that it is rather simple to create complex patterns in the fields.

Why do you assume it would take anyone of any more than ordinary intelligence to create what are in fact rather simple designs?

Why people pretend these are so complex is beyond me and very disingenuous to say the least. To then also assume that people are not intelligent enough to create them is also not honest.

This reminds me of those who make up absurd stories about things built or created thousands of years ago knowing full well that humans were just as intelligent and capable then as now.

"Military style planning" Sounds like embellishment to make a point. Perhaps there is not much point to be made beyond hoaxers who are imaginative and creative and such people are common anywhere on the planet.

All I get from this is an attempt to spin a story, to do a dance around the fact that by now everyone should know that the Crop Circles ("formations") are admittedly hoaxes and in fact can and are made overnight easily by people with normal abilities, using a few simple devices and methods that most any High School Kid could devise. People believe the other theories because they want to believe them, not because there is any chance they are true.

All I see are the very earthly hoaxers creating these, while having a good laugh at the expense of those who believe they are more than just the product of some people having fun, pulling our collective legs.

Originally posted by samstone11
First, I'm OK with the thread not being about crop circles, but I have a question that could is pertinent nonetheless. What about those of us who do not think it realistic (notice I did not say "impossible") that the circles are man-made, yet still find it hard to believe that advanced civilization would choose that means of communication? Seems like there would be much easier or more direct ways for such an advanced culture to get a message to us.

To your point, wasn't Carl Sagan known to be exceptionally closed minded, or for lack of a better word, stubborn regarding the presence or non-existence of ETs? As I recall, feel free to correct me if I am incorrect, he was a confirmed naysayer with no clear reasoning as to why he worked with the concept of aliens other than to disprove the idea?

I would be happy to be proven wrong. Still, from what I read, neither side of the debate wants to fully align itself with him or his beliefs or methodology which essentially caused him to be an outsider to all concerned. Again, I hope I am wrong because I personally believe he was one of the finest thinkers we will ever have who also took his opportunity and made the most of it.

Back on point, I have a great deal of difficulty still, reconciling this type of message with the technology that would have to be available to another life form capable of being here in the first place. In other words, its a little like us going to an island with inhabitants who have never seen any technology, but refusing to communicate with them through anything other than drawing pictures in the sand.

I am open minded to be proven wrong, but this is how I see it at the moment.

This is a quote that I hate to hear....."Seems like there would be much easier or more direct ways for such an advanced culture to get a message to us."

Think about that statement now please. If an alien race painted the picture on the ground and explained their existence, signed it by the aliens with details on how to get to their galaxy, put dimentions in of every single detail.....Someone would just say the same thing, or say some pranksters did this.

All of you that have responded to this thread with the close minded response or open minded response need to think about this while typing! Saying pranksters are involved in such intricate detail is the most close minded statement I have ever heard!

Deny Ignorance rings a bell, and to do that, you need to throw away all of your previous dealings with mainstream media and what "they" claim crop circles to be.....They are diverting your attention so everyone will believe that every time something unbelievably awesome like this comes up, that it is faked!!

The OP is correct, I don't care how good someone or a group of people are at making crop circles. With the message that is included in the crop circle and the detail as to which the response was given, no average crop circle Joe Schmo would know this information.....Nobody on the planet could, because it was under belief and standard that there was not that amount of combinations in human DNA.

I like the OP have no clue to DNA, but how would someone know to fake this circle to respond to a question a guy posed years prior?? On top of that, the guy who sent this information out suddenly dies......That is a wide eyed eye opener with what more than likely happened.....Cover up!

Please people open your eyes, not necessarily to any one fact, but to the facts that are included in this post.....This is all more than reasonable for contact with an Alien race and you all are shrugging this off like you always do.....Pranksters and whatever else your simple (closed) mind can come up with to discredit people of contact with another race!!

Great job OP, great detail, great overall job.....Just so you know your work is appreciated from the people who are interested in the truth!!

reply to post by Chadwickus


That crop circle isn't that well done. You can tell EASILY without any confirmation that humans did that.

reply to post by VoidHawk
I like the way you think. Thank yuou for being clear and logical and able to use common sense. We need thinkers like you more here.
You are definetly on to something here. I have also studied a bit of crop circles and wait for you to start other topic with that. Keep going, you rock

I need to read again and look up some material on some things i don't fully understand. Great thread tho S&F op
i will suggest one thing at this time. That is 99% of crop circles are faked as to debunk the genuine ones unwittingly or not. Now it is more and more a trend by joe public to make them. Originally the were faked under orders by TPTB but now they no longer need to because as i stated its a trend and has i life of its own. I am going to look into the first ever crop circle a bit more see what i find.

reply to post by Rigel Kent
[mor

where did you get the idea that carl sagan drowned?? this was posted earlier:

After a long and difficult fight with myelodysplasia, which included three bone marrow transplants, Sagan died of pneumonia at the age of 62 at the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center in Seattle, Washington, on December 20, 1996.[69] He was buried at Lakeview Cemetery in Ithaca, New York.[70]