Women Who Support Ron Paul: What About Your Reproductive Freedom?

Originally posted by Indellkoffer

Originally posted by jackieisinlove
A woman's right to "reproductive freedom"? Women will always have that right. It's called not having sex unless you understand that you might make a baby, and then you'll have to deal with that baby

I take it you haven't been raped and don't know anyone who was pressured into sex or who was raped. Although you're in the majority there, at least 1/4th of the women who read your post will have been raped or know someone who has been raped.

And it isn't a fun time, speaking from experience. If you're female, I hope most sincerely you never find out for yourself and never end up pregnant that way. I knew a girl who killed herself over rape and pregnancy -- many years ago, of course, but it still happens.

I've been raped. And you're right - - it isn't any fun. NO - it was not the reason for my abortion.

Right or Wrong - - - I would have been pissed if I did not have that choice.

Civil Rights need to be National/Federal - and equal for the entire country. Making this a state right is pure insanity.

Originally posted by jackieisinlove
So, I have been faced with that situation. And I'm still pro-life.

NO you weren't. Nature took its course and relieved you of making that decision.

I've been in that situation as well.

It isn't even close to facing the real fact of pregnancy.

Originally posted by xacto
He has explicity stated that he would leave it up to the people of the states to determine by state what to do.

If you lived in Arizona.

You would want someone like Sheriff Arpaio making decisions for your reproduction?

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


I work my ass off for a meager paycheck every week; why should I pay my hard earned money into planned parenthood? People should take responsibility for their actions. I'm obviously not talking about people who are raped or who have complications I'm referring to a system in which you've been brainwashed into thinking your powerful because you disposed of an innocent and completely defenseless life. This is about population control, it's about sterilizing people both physically and mentally.
I also enjoy this illusion of "empowerment" women get from this. This simply was not the purpose of planed parenthood, it's about eliminating weak people from the gene pool. It's the same thing Hitler did. Don't take my word for it go do your own research. As a male and someone that cares immensely about his partner in life I don't see how two rational human beings can be unable to forge some kind of agreement when it comes to sex? If you don't want a kid together than maybe you shouldn't be having sex, it seems rational to me and I'm a kid in college. I fear however this side show won't amount to a hill of beans in this countries immediate future.

Originally posted by barfboy01
reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

 

I work my ass off for a meager paycheck every week; why should I pay my hard earned money into planned parenthood?

What exactly do you think Planned Parenthood does?

reply to post by Annee


I use planned parenthood as a broad sweeping term to describe any state run(Not limited to the federal program) institution advocating or carrying out abortions. The fact is it doesn't really matter all too much, When I get sick because I ate horse # should everyone else pay for it? Or how bout this When I lend people money I don't have and then am unable to pay my own debts who should pay(Wall Street)? Shoot might as well let the state decide who's fit to bear children, wouldn't want anyone with a rational mind reproducing:/

Originally posted by barfboy01
reply to post by Annee

 

I use planned parenthood as a broad sweeping term to describe any state run(Not limited to the federal program) institution advocating or carrying out abortions. The fact is it doesn't really matter all too much, When I get sick because I ate horse # should everyone else pay for it? Or how bout this When I lend people money I don't have and then am unable to pay my own debts who should pay(Wall Street)? Shoot might as well let the state decide who's fit to bear children, wouldn't want anyone with a rational mind reproducing:/

I don't believe the subject of this thread is about paying for Planned Parenthood.

Should people apply to the government to reproduce? That's a thought. Prove you have the means to support and raise a child - - before making one.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


This is one of the only things I disagree with Paul about. Even so, it's not like he wants to make abortion absolutely illigal throughout the whole country, he just wants to give states the power to decide. That's fair enough imo.

However, he does believe life begins at conception, as far as I can tell. But are we talking about any type of biological life, or actual conscious life? There's no easy way to tell when conscious life has developed.

Fertilisation (also known as conception, fecundation and syngamy) is the fusion of gametes to produce a new organism. In animals, the process involves the fusion of an ovum with a sperm, which eventually leads to the development of an embryo.

I highly doubt a conscious human being is spawned with the fusion of ovum and sperm, the structure just isn't there. It takes a while before a fetus develops a recognizable form, and it takes a while before it develops a brain that might be capable of conscious thought.

We kill animals all the time. Are they not a form of life? They are living beings are they not? So why do we kill them without considering the moral implications so much? Because we assume they aren't conscious, thinking beings.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


For him state's rights are supreme.Not the Feds.

Second line

I'm not even going to read this entire thread but I'm going to say this: Anyone who thinks that one can have a definite answer on such ethical issues is pretty dumb.

I'm not a woman and I'm far right but I can say that if I were American, Ron Paul would be the first Pro-Life candidate that I would vote for. This is but one of the many issues, you pick and choose what matters the most, weigh it out and then cast your vote but quit your bickering over ethical issues.

There is no right or wrong; just different opinions.

reply to post by ludwigvonmises003


Leave it to him and using this exact philosophy he can then order the Fed to nullify The Constitution and order the States the authoutiy to usurp and deny the citzenery it.

In this nation the only thing that is Supreme besides SCOTUS obviously is The Constitution as that's the Federal decree and guarantee of rights. BTW, the States do not have the authourity to deny any of it's citizens Federally protected rights via The Constitution. The US Constitution is a Federal tier document as The Declaration Of Independence is the only one that sits above that in the upper echelon of Govt rank!

Tier Federal 1 - Declaration Of Independence, The Constitution, The USA - (NOTHING IS ABOVE THIS TIER)
Tier Federal 2 - The Congress (Legislative), Executive (POTUS), Judicial (SCOTUS), Populous (The People)
Tier Federal 3 - Federal Governmental agencies ie, the Governmental Alphabet Soup!, Federal Reserve (1913 - 2012), US Military and Dept of Defense, DHS, CIA, NSA,
Tier Federal 4 - Federal law enforcement Federal Regulatory arm, Federal oversight arm, Interstate system, Federal central bank (coming 2013)
Tier State 1 - State Government
Tier State 2 - State Constitutions
Tier State 3 - State Assembly/State Senate, State Legislature
Tier State 4 - State law enforcement!
County/Parish and local Governments have no authourity to think independently on this tier!

Originally posted by KrazyJethro
I really do simply mean that I am for life. It's the same reason I am against the death penalty generally.

I understand this position because I share it. I would not choose an abortion and I am against the death penalty AND most war. My whole point is that it's fine for us to have our views on it, but it's no more OK for me to legally dictate what another woman chooses than it is for me to dictate how someone should raise their child, live their lives, practice their religion or the eat their food. It's a PERSONAL issue and no one's business. Not the federal government, not the state government and not the other people in my state! It's MY decision. MY choice.

Where do people get off thinking they have the right to say what goes on in my body??? Where does Ron Paul get off thinking he can turn my uterus over to the PEOPLE of the state? It's insanity!

Originally posted by RSF77
This kind of spitefulness and irresponsibility from females is what really makes me think you should have never gotten any rights in the first place.

Yes, the men should have kept our rights and never given them to us!

Originally posted by blackhillsbrutality
I am not anti-abortion but I say # it. It's worth the direction Paul wants to take our country in.

Thanks for your input. I think it's a matter of each of us weighing what we disagree with and what we agree with and picking the best fit.I am very much against Ron Paul turning so much over to the states. I think it's going to be a mess if that happens.

reply to post by Raelsatu


So, you agree with Paul and I don't. So, who gets to say what happens in MY womb? You and Dr. Paul? Or me?

reply to post by AnIntellectualRedneck


Hi, It's good to see you.

Our rights are federally protected now. The 14th Amendment states that: No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States. And Paul would hand our constitutionally protected rights to the states to decide... He would allow them to make and enforce laws abridging the rights of the citizens, be they female, gay, black or disabled.

It's simply ridiculous to me.

Originally posted by Raelsatu
reply to post by RSF77

 

The morning after pill, which can be taken 3 days (or more) after the act of intercourse, prevents the pregnancy; it does not end it.

It also thins the wall of the uterus, making it hard for a fertilized egg (a "person" according to Dr. Paul) to attach. In this case, although it's not an abortion, it's "murdering a person" according to some.

reply to post by matt47274


Welcome.

Originally posted by matt47274
I guess what I am saying is that society is handling a lot of things wrong and we shouldn't try to legislate morals into the people. We are going to make bad decisions and people will put things into their bodies that give results they don't want. But just like I had to quit smoking pot to get away from the possible negatives, we all must either quit certain habits or face the consequences. I just ask that we not legislate for or against personal issues and not expect or force others to bail us out of the negative results of our own choices...

I actually agree. I think people's bodies belong to THEM. As long as they're not hurting anyone else, they should have autonomy. Our government telling us what we can and cannot put into our bodies is crazy to me! We SHOULD be free to take action and deal with the consequences. There are consequences to sex and choices to make when those consequences arise.

You get cancer from smoking? You have several options.
You break your arm skydiving? You go to the Dr. and discuss your options.
You get pregnant from recreational sex? You have several options. It's between you and your Dr. and family... Not the state government. I don't want ANY government telling me that I can't have surgery to have a foreign body removed from mine. That's not the state's business.

Originally posted by intelligenthoodlum33
Whose going to ultimately pay for all those unwanted and unloved babies...the government.

This was my point when I mentioned Planned Parenthood in the beginning. Paul wants to de-fund PP (giving poor women no option for medical birth control) and then let states make abortion illegal if they want. This will create many more poor and starving babies for society to prop up. More welfare... or maybe he'd just let them die... I mean you have to face the consequences of your actions, right?

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


If your old enough, you know what will come next....back alley abortions, children being dropped off at firestations and police stations. Basically more kids roaming the streets without the benefit of a good, loving home to be raised and guided in. The result of which will be more criminals, drug addicts, young and unfit parents etc. Guess who winds up paying for all those disenfranchised folks?

You guessed it....taxpayers.

In other words, leave planned parenthood and abortion alone and concentrate on things that can actually have a positive impact. I love Paul''s ideas on foriegn policy and the Fed Reserve. All in all, he's a good guy and with a conscientious VP he could do some real good.

reply to post by TupacShakur

Originally posted by TupacShakur
Is that a strawman in your pants or are you happy to see me?

I'm happy to see you.

But let me clear a couple things up. Is it a strawman? Not exactly. It's an example. It's an example of ONE of the several reasons I cannot see clear to support Ron Paul. The reason I used this particular example is that I haven't seen Paul's agenda on it discussed here. The other disagreements I have with him have been discussed and I have participated.

This was an issue that I felt needed to have a light shined on it. Not because it's about abortion, but because of the implications and possibilities of turning civil and constitutional rights over to each state.

Basing who you want to be president not off of their monetary or foreign policy, or just overall ability to follow the Constitution, but instead their position on abortion is just stupid IMO.

Good thing I'm not doing that, then. I'd hate for you to think I'm stupid.

You have to look at the entire spectrum, and consider whether all of the issues as a whole are better than the platform of another candidate. I'd rather have somebody who I don't agree with one one issue but agree with on 90% of other issues than somebody who I don't agree with 50% of the time, like basically every other candidate.

And that's exactly what I'm doing. Seems we firmly agree on that, at least!

so we are really going to judge the direction our nation goes in on this? of ALLLLL the issues around the WORLD today, people are really going to sit here and say 'yeah but he doesnt feel like i do about abortion so hes terrible.' this is completely ridiculous, good job america

reply to post by dacvspecial

Originally posted by dacvspecial
I have no problem with being a harlot if that's your choice, but if your CHOICE brings unwanted pregnancies, why should taxpayers have to foot the bill for you to "deal with it".

I have not once suggested that anyone else foot the bill for abortion. You're making a lot of assumptions based on nothing.

I'm not judging people because i've been a manwhore in my day,

Yes you are! You said you get the idea that I think it's OK to "sleaze around town" with whoever, you call women "skanks". That's a judgment you're making while admitting to being a "Man whore" yourself...

I have made great strides in my life since i decided to stop being a slave to my sexual desires and transmuted the energy into more positive endeavors. Now, don't get me wrong, "I don't see nothin' wrong, with a little bump and griiiinnd" but you have to suffer the potential consequences.

You learned your lesson in life and you don't think anyone else should be free to learn the same lessons the same way you did? Now that you're all enlightened, everyone else should be, too?

If you do get preggers, then that should be the responsibilty of YOU to take care of it, since you exercising your FREEDOM caused it.

I agree 100%. I don't know where people got the idea that I think the gov't should pay for abortion, but I guess they don't read well or something...


reply to post by jackieisinlove

Originally posted by jackieisinlove
I happen to disagree with killing any living thing unless it's threatening the life of someone else

Do you EAT? Do you let spiders and flies live in your house? Come on!

I love my baby so much that now I just can't stand to think of people potentially killing babies. It has very little to do with my faith.

This is the attitude of most pro-life people. THEY experience something and then they think EVERYONE should feel the same way, or if they don't, they should be forced to behave like YOU do... This is the problem with America today! This is why we can't get along. Because people cannot handle the FREEDOM to live and let live.

It's simply none of your business what I do with my body and I don't know why anyone thinks otherwise.

Originally posted by barfboy01
I work my ass off for a meager paycheck every week; why should I pay my hard earned money into planned parenthood?

Perhaps it would help with reading comprehension?