Bush AWOL, Refused Direct Order, Suspended. (UPDATE: Documents may be forged)

It's not a waste of time. Shirking your military service is serious and tells a lot about your character.

I could be wrong but I believe that going AWOL is a crime. Is it a felony? If it were then that would mean Bush cannot run for president. But then again he would have to be prosecuted. And that will NEVER happen. Yeah it was 30 years ago but do you want a man that went AWOL to lead your military?

Originally posted by Johannmon
Valid or not who cares if Bush was Awol for a month or two 30 years or so ago. What difference does that make today. NONE!! Think about it people. What if every thing you did 30 years ago was held under a microscope. Would any little indiscretions appear? For the vast majority of people they would. Do they really affect your character today? NO, except that they are lessons learned. President Bush has not made an issue out of his service back then and therefore it should not be a campaign issue, unless you are simply looking for muck to rake.

Kerry on the other hand has listed his questionable service as one of the reasons we should elect him and it is therefore fair game to go after. The president has actually come in on Kerry's side on this issue by saying that his service in nam was honorable. What more can you ask for.

Can we please get beyond these kind of irrelevant issues and on to the real and pressing issues of this campaign. This is such a waste of time.

While Kerry did make the decision to play up his Vietnam service, it must be remembered that Bush first made the decision to declare a "war" on terror and call himself a "war president." Accordingly, his "real" war record is an important one in determining his fitness for the task he has defined.

-koji K.

Fake documents? You would think that a) CBS would research such a bombshell on the President of the United States. If a bunch of bloggers can determine it to be fake, hours after CBS posts them, CBS really sucks as a news organization. And b) If they were fake, Bush would say, "Hey, that's fake. Get Rove on the phone." and the White House Press Secretary would be on the news today, explaining the wonderful world of fonts, MS Word, and these "fake" documents.

I don't think it was word because word doesn't put the superscript up that high. But based on that one site it doesn't appear to be a Selectric typewriter. I'm just waiting to see a font from a typewriter that could have done it back in 1972.

Originally posted by Indy
I could be wrong but I believe that going AWOL is a crime. Is it a felony? If it were then that would mean Bush cannot run for president. But then again he would have to be prosecuted. And that will NEVER happen. Yeah it was 30 years ago but do you want a man that went AWOL to lead your military?

Give me a break. If he was Awol it was for a very short time, if it happened at all. He was a kid. If you want to diss on him, do it for his previous alcoholism and wild ways which were much more recent than missing a couple of drills to work on a political campaign or go to Harvard.

In perspective I would never want a man who has lied to congress about attrocities that he witnessed or committed while a soldier to be president. I would not want someone who so disrespected his country as to throw away the medals that were given him to be president, especially if he did not regret it.

The foolish ways of youth are to be looked upon with forgiving eyes if the mistakes made have produced lessons learned. Let it lie muck rakers.

Originally posted by koji_K
While Kerry did make the decision to play up his Vietnam service, it must be remembered that Bush first made the decision to declare a "war" on terror and call himself a "war president." Accordingly, his "real" war record is an important one in determining his fitness for the task he has defined.

-koji K.

that is just a bunch of BS. A real war record is how you handle yourself as leader during war time. It has nothing to do with what you did 30 years before as a wet behind the ears spoiled rich kid.

Originally posted by Johannmon

Originally posted by Indy
I could be wrong but I believe that going AWOL is a crime. Is it a felony? If it were then that would mean Bush cannot run for president. But then again he would have to be prosecuted. And that will NEVER happen. Yeah it was 30 years ago but do you want a man that went AWOL to lead your military?

Give me a break. If he was Awol it was for a very short time, if it happened at all. He was a kid.

He was a Leutenant, for Gossake, not a kid. How easily you cut him a break. I remember a few years ago a AF pilot went AWOL for a few days because his girlfriend decided to ditch him and he wanted to talk to her. The guy was court martialled.

Bush getting preferential treatment is wrong.

What I think is amusing is that when Clinton was running for president it was ok to call him a draft dodger. But when it comes to Bush its not fair to do that. Sorry but if you can't handle the heat then don't run for president.

Yep, it's official, Bush has commited a Federal level felony! It is now proven without a doubt he is truly unfit as commander in chief. It does not matter if it was a week ago or 40 years ago, a crime against our nation has been commited. No wonder he wanted to weaken the powers of the supreme court. I feel this is more serious than his drunken coked up history. True, people only learn by making mistakes, therefore making multiple mistakes on a military issue given his position of duty serves only to work against him. He should go an to obscure underfunded brig in the middle of nowhere instead of club fed imho.

[edit on 9-9-2004 by Crysstaafur]

Indy, Selectric II:
www.fact-index.com...

The Selectric II had a lever (above the right platen knob) that would allow the platen to be turned freely but return to the same vertical line (for inserting such symbols as subscripts and superscripts), whereas the Selectric I did not.

I am not American. I must say that politics in America is about as low as anyone can sink. The media and people break down the candidates to the point where it is rather difficult to understand how anybody can have any respect for the President (whether Bush or Clinton). Whats more amazing is how clean everybody's closet must be that they are willing to throw the first stone.

Don't get me wrong I think America is an amazing place but the way politics is fought is petty in the extreme.

Originally posted by Indy
Thanks Trick for posting that. I change my mind about it not being a typewriter. It must be a typewriter. I did a test in Word to see how the superscript would look. Word doesn't raise the superscript that high. Only a typewriter would. But if the most advanced typewriter of the age didn't have superscript then what did? Could it have been an old manual typewriter instead of a modern electric?

Indy your Selectric website is correct, the 88 character type ball does not have room for superscripts, however MS Word is quite capable of elevating a superscript to the degree demonstrated.

MS Word document formatting course.

Scroll to (d) Subscripts and Superscripts, and the example is a "th", how convenient.

I had posted a link with a bunch of Selectric fonts and none of them had the "th" superscript.

Originally posted by Jamuhn
Indy, Selectric II:
www.fact-index.com...

The Selectric II had a lever (above the right platen knob) that would allow the platen to be turned freely but return to the same vertical line (for inserting such symbols as subscripts and superscripts), whereas the Selectric I did not.

Originally posted by Johannmon

Originally posted by koji_K
While Kerry did make the decision to play up his Vietnam service, it must be remembered that Bush first made the decision to declare a "war" on terror and call himself a "war president." Accordingly, his "real" war record is an important one in determining his fitness for the task he has defined.

-koji K.

that is just a bunch of BS. A real war record is how you handle yourself as leader during war time. It has nothing to do with what you did 30 years before as a wet behind the ears spoiled rich kid.

you mean as an officer during war time? not to mention a trained jet pilot.

-koji K.

[edit on 9-9-2004 by koji_K]

Koji - I am posting my question and clarification in both threads.

The CBS site notes that they sent these 4 memos to the WH - who released them to the public without comment. What does this mean?

1. The documents cannot be refuted and it was an attempt to diffuse the situation.

2. They are going to let the Dems hang themselves and have something on this guy.

and something I am curious about:

But previously unseen documents from Killian's PERSONAL (emphasis added) file obtained by 60 Minutes include a memorandum from May 1972, where Killian writes that Lt. Bush called him to talk about "how he can get out of coming to drill from now through November."

Is it SOP for a former CO to keep personal notes on a former member of his unit?

Originally posted by Bleys
Koji - I am posting my question and clarification in both threads.

The CBS site notes that they sent these 4 memos to the WH - who released them to the public without comment. What does this mean?

They commented. The WH said it's impossible to know the mind of a dead man and left his personal notes at that. I think his notes are pretty clear, but that's the WH for ya.

Originally posted by Mynaeris
I am not American. I must say that politics in America is about as low as anyone can sink. The media and people break down the candidates to the point where it is rather difficult to understand how anybody can have any respect for the President (whether Bush or Clinton). Whats more amazing is how clean everybody's closet must be that they are willing to throw the first stone.

Don't get me wrong I think America is an amazing place but the way politics is fought is petty in the extreme.

People With Connections To The Bush Dynasty Who Met With Suspicious And Untimely Deaths



This list examines the corpses left in the wake of the Bush criminal dynasty.

Sid Adger
Mr. Adger, a Houston oil supply company executive and Bush family friend, died in 1996 of unknown causes. Adger was the mysterious businessman who approached General James Rose and asked him to help George W. Bush avoid Vietnam by recommending him for a pilot position with the National Guard.

General James Rose
General Rose recommended George W. Bush for a pilot position with the Texas National Guard. He died of unknown causes in 1993. He was immediately buried and no autopsy was performed.

Lt. Colonel William Harris, Jr.
Lt. Col. William Harris was one of two commanding officers who could not perform George W. Bush's annual evaluation covering the year from May 1, 1972 to April 30, 1973. They stated in their filing that "Lt. Bush has not been observed at this unit during the period of this report." Fortunately for George W. Bush, Lt. Col. Harris is not here to verify his 1973 statement. He's dead.

Lt. Colonel Jerry B. Killian
Lt. Col. Jerry B. Killian was another of George W. Bush's commanding officers. He cannot testify in a court of law as to George W. Bush's dereliction of his sworn duty. Lt. Col. Killian is dead.

James Downing Aalund
Mr. Aalund's name is the first on a long list of young Texans who died in Vietnam. These young men did not have influential fathers to pull the strings necessary to get them into the Texas Air National Guard. If they had been so lucky, they would surely have fulfilled their responsibilities to the ANG, if only out of gratitude that they did not have to die, thousands of miles away in a strange land. They surely would not have disappeared from duty for over a year, as did our fearless leader George W. Bush.

Enron - Bodies

J. Clifford Baxter
Found dead in his car, shot in the head. Mr. Baxter was vice chairman of Enron Corp. when he resigned in May 2001. Enron has been hot copy lately with the revelation that they were the largest campaign contributors for George W. Bush. Was J. Clifford Baxter a potential witness to Bush foreknowledge of their wrongdoings? His death was ruled a suicide.

Charles Dana Rice
He was the senior vice president and treasurer of El Paso Corp., an energy corporation swept up in the recent energy scandal. Two months after the "suicide" of Enron executive Clifford Baxter, in the midst of questions about the accounting practices of El Paso Corp., Charles Rice was found dead of a gunshot wound to the head. His death was ruled a suicide.

James Daniel Watkins
His body was found on December 1, 2001 in the Pike National Forest in Colorado, a gunshot wound to the head. Mr. Watkins was a consultant for Arthur Andersen, the accounting firm for Enron. He disappeared on November 13 after he left work. He was described as a devoted family man who always called home if he were going to be late. Officials initially said that the death was suspicious, but have changed their tune and have ruled his death a suicide.


www.voxfux.com...


Well the list goes on and on that is merely the top few. All are Military,Political, and Industrial. I sure wish they would just stick to killing each other instead of sending our children off to die for them.

TUT


�This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or exercise their revolutionary right to overthrow it.� � Abraham Lincoln






[edit on 9-9-2004 by tututkamen]

I'm certainly no word expert... but I tried to duplicate one of the letters. One that had the address information centered on the top of the page. I could not get my Word to NOT superscript the "th" as it appeared in the header. Can anyone duplicate that page including the extra high raised th?

Try it this way:

111thx fighter squadron

arrow your cursor to the right of the x and backspace - it will stay put. That is the only way I could keep it from changing.