How can Heaven be paradise when Hell exists?

So it's my impression that Heaven is an ultimate paradise. An eternity of peace and happiness. Sounds like a good place to me that's for sure.

Now there's Hell. It's my impression that hell is an eternity of absolute Terror and Torture.

So here's a hypothetical. Let's say that when I die, I go to Heaven. But when I'm in Heaven, I find out that all of my loved ones and friends have sinned and are to be tortured in Hell for all of Eternity. My question is how can Heaven be true Paradise when the souls of loved ones are being burned and tortured for all eternity?

Doesn't make sense to me.

Originally posted by swoopaloop
So it's my impression that Heaven is an ultimate paradise. An eternity of peace and happiness. Sounds like a good place to me that's for sure.

Now there's Hell. It's my impression that hell is an eternity of absolute Terror and Torture.

So here's a hypothetical. Let's say that when I die, I go to Heaven. But when I'm in Heaven, I find out that all of my loved ones and friends have sinned and are to be tortured in Hell for all of Eternity. My question is how can Heaven be true Paradise when the souls of loved ones are being burned and tortured for all eternity?

Doesn't make sense to me.

Because they won't be your loved ones anymore. You won't know anything that happened in your mortal life, you won't know anything about anyone or anything that you've done or accomplished.
Your job for eternity will be to sit at the seat of god and worship.
Also, fishing. God thinks that we all love fishing.

But yeah, neverending worship and nothing else.

You are going with a hypothetical. Who says that you will find out in heaven that your loved ones are being tortured?
It is possible that when in heaven, you will take a great pleasure in knowing that people are being tortured for reasons that make them deserving of such punishment. Take Sandusky for an example.... maybe his wife will go to heaven and find out that he is in hell.

Originally posted by swoopaloop
So it's my impression that Heaven is an ultimate paradise. An eternity of peace and happiness. Sounds like a good place to me that's for sure.

Now there's Hell. It's my impression that hell is an eternity of absolute Terror and Torture.

So here's a hypothetical. Let's say that when I die, I go to Heaven. But when I'm in Heaven, I find out that all of my loved ones and friends have sinned and are to be tortured in Hell for all of Eternity. My question is how can Heaven be true Paradise when the souls of loved ones are being burned and tortured for all eternity?

Doesn't make sense to me.

Heaven may very well be void of any emotion to connect to the suffering of the sinners in hell , so you wouldn't have any worries . Paradise to some , apathy does have rewards for those living in their own world of heaven on earth currently .

reply to post by butcherguy


In my opinion there is nothing that someone can do in life that will justify them being tortured for eternity. Take a lighter, light it, put your hand over it, remove your hand when it hurts. Now imagine feeling that pain all over your body for eternity. Now think of your life. It's been long and isn't even over. Now think of eternity. Eternity is VAST and never ends. Does anyone really deserve to be burned for such a long time? I really don't think so.

reply to post by swoopaloop



Yeah, you don't remember anything from your mortal life.

Those memories are stored in your brain. Your soul is separate from the physical.

Hell is not eternal in duration, but in consequence.

I've written two very extensive essays on the this very topic after performing painstaking exegesis on the matter (which involved a Concordance). I subsequently presented them to the pastors at a church I used to attend. I never received a reply let alone a rebuttal. I'd be happy to share.

reply to post by watchdog8110


So basically if I die, and go to heaven, I won't have any recollection of my life? Where does it say that in the Bible?

I don't know how to explain this properly, but black, white, and gray all exist on their own. it's your choice to choose where you will be.

Personally, I believe heaven is a spirit trap for believers.
When I die, I'm not going to heaven or hell. There is so much more to learn about the universes.

I'm not subjective enough on earth to be a pawn, a sheep and to be limited by others. (other then limitation of money)

I don't think someone or something will decide for me where I go when I will die, I will decide for myself because God gave me free will and this also counts after my physical life.

I believe heaven and hell exists only for those who want it to exist.

So the Consensus seems to be that when you die and go to heaven or hell you don't remember your life.
also I'd like to add that If God is so loving, why would he allow his creation to go to a place where they are tortured for all eternity?

What about all the near death experiences where people claim to see loved ones?

reply to post by swoopaloop

So it's my impression that Heaven is an ultimate paradise.

I don't think their is one, clear, definitive explanation for what Heaven is, exactly.
I would agree, that whatever Heaven is, it would be an oxymoron if there was also a Medieval type Hell.
My general solution to the problem is to say that such a thing does not exist, with torture and punishment, other than would result just from not being in as good a place as one might imagine they properly should be.

Originally posted by followtheevidence
Hell is not eternal in duration, but in consequence.

I've written two very extensive essays on the this very topic after performing painstaking exegesis on the matter (which involved a Concordance). I subsequently presented them to the pastors at a church I used to attend. I never received a reply let alone a rebuttal. I'd be happy to share.

edit on 1-12-2011 by followtheevidence because: (no reason given)

Please do. I would be interested in reading that. You can pm it if you don't want to publish it. Thanks.

Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by followtheevidence
Hell is not eternal in duration, but in consequence.

I've written two very extensive essays on the this very topic after performing painstaking exegesis on the matter (which involved a Concordance). I subsequently presented them to the pastors at a church I used to attend. I never received a reply let alone a rebuttal. I'd be happy to share.

edit on 1-12-2011 by followtheevidence because: (no reason given)

Please do. I would be interested in reading that. You can pm it if you don't want to publish it. Thanks.

Done and done. If there's an interest for me to publish it, I will. Otherwise, I hope you enjoy and feel free to pm me with further thoughts/questions.

I don't believe heaven or hell exist...

Theres only an afterlife, which is where we all return to when we pass...

Hell doesn't exist according to the bible...

And heaven is just a selling point for religious conversion...

reply to post by swoopaloop


If you are unaware of Jubilee laws, then you will consider hell an eternal punishment with no way out. Consider this link. LINK The laws have no loopholes when a debt is owed. To have a place to return, you must not be in debt to the owner of the land. Ultimately, God is the owner of all land.

Creation will be in enmity against God until the Jubilee laws are fulfilled.

1Corinthians 15:22-28,

22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all shall be
made alive. 23 But each in his own order . . . .

27 For He has put all things in subjection under His feet. But
when He says, "All things are put in subjection," it is
evident that He is excepted who put all things in
subjection to Him.

28 And when all things are subjected
to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to
the One who subjected all things to Him, that God may
be all in all.

Even as in Adam all mankind died, so also in Christ, the Second
Adam, all mankind will be made alive--but not all at once. Some will
come into life in the first resurrection, others at the general
resurrection, but all others at the great Jubilee of creation. Paul speaks
of this day also in Colossians 1:16-20,

16 For by Him all things were created, both in the
heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether
thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-- all
things have been created by Him and for Him. . .

19 For it was the Father's good pleasure for all the fullness to
dwell in Him,

20 and through Him to reconcile all things
to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His
cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or
things in heaven.

Through the Logos, the Word, Jesus Christ, all things were created
(John 1:3), and through Him, all things will be reconciled to Himself.
There will be nothing left outside of His dominion in the end, as we
read in Hebrews 2:8 and 9,

8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet.
"For in subjecting all things to him, He left nothing that
is not subject to him. But now we do not yet see all
things subjected to him. 9 But we do see Him who has
been made for a little while lower than the angels,
namely, Jesus, because of the suffering of death
crowned with glory and honor, that by the grace of God
He might taste death for everyone.

2 Corinthians 5,
17
Therefore if any man is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things
passed away; behold, new things have come.
18
Now all these things are
from God, who reconciled us to Himself through Christ, and gave us the
ministry of reconciliation,
19
namely, that God was in Christ reconciling
the world to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them [the
world], and He has committed to us [Christians] the word of reconciliation.
20
Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God were
entreating through us; we beg you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to
God.
21 He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, that we
might become the righteousness of God in Him.

Originally posted by swoopaloop
reply to post by watchdog8110

 

So basically if I die, and go to heaven, I won't have any recollection of my life? Where does it say that in the Bible?

Hypothetically speaking you can have all the recollection involved but the emotional ties may not be there to worry you . If you were looking for the bible as the cure all to end all , good luck with that one .

Petty religious differences have taken us from peace to war so many times . We all have eyes to see and ears to hear , yet we are still blind and deaf .

Just don't believe in either and the problem takes care of itself. Do your best here and now and be content that you're alive. And if anybody comes at you with a wall of religious text, keep in mind if they really believed what they were saying, they could say it in their own words and not copy+paste from their cheat sheet.

Originally posted by followtheevidence
Hell is not eternal in duration, but in consequence.

I've written two very extensive essays on the this very topic after performing painstaking exegesis on the matter (which involved a Concordance). I subsequently presented them to the pastors at a church I used to attend. I never received a reply let alone a rebuttal. I'd be happy to share.

edit on 1-12-2011 by followtheevidence because: (no reason given)

After reading the Bible, I too discovered that what was being taught from the pulpit (not only in regards to Hell), was drastically different then what is found in God's word.

There's a somewhat similar thread on this topic in Conspiracies in Religions, - I learned that Hell was invented by Christian Translations, where I posted this link to a video on what the Bible says concerning Hell...