Death Highlights Problems with Drugs and Group Sex at Occupy Vancouver

Originally posted by AtticusRye

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

To simply ignore or to attempt to discredit means you are working against your own interests and will continue to vote against your own interests time and time again!

You're a bunch of rebels working to overturn the system to bring us blind serfs a better tomorrow, hon - go get 'em!

And this is the issue, isn't it.
You got one political party that is giving the thumbs up and stating they believe in something, then you dig and realize they are actually making backroom deals with the "enemy".
Then you got the other political party that is basically giving kisses to the "enemy".

So, who do you choose? the whole system is corrupt, from the face to face stab, to the stab in the back...choose where you want the knife to go.

And there really is no viable alternative...

So you put up some randomness about Pelosi and how connected she is with the ones that destroy...do you then vote in the people whom are overtly working with them and making no qualms about their ties with the destroyers? its a no win situation that the people (the 99%ers..well, really about 74ish% actively) choose from.

Cry out Ron Paul all you want...he is an illusion. the corporate media controls all, and will make sure it is choosing between the devil waving a flag, and the devil wearing a mask...

Feeling a bit down about the reality of the situation actually...when you truely become reasonable and realistic about it...it will not change. Some soft spoken words, some minor bill passed with no teeth or funding to even implement it, and everyone goes home to deal with more corporate slavery.

in 100 years, things may be different, but in 2016, I suspect it will be exactly the same, or perhaps a little bit worse...this is pure realism and not ideological blinding and wishing.

reply to post by AtticusRye


THE OFFICIAL STANCE OF THE #OOCUPYEVERYTHING - OCCUPY TOGETHER - #OCCUPYWALLSTREET MOVEMENTS AND ALL ASSOCIATED MARCHES & OCCUPATIONS THROUGHOUT THE PLANET CURRENTLY :

This group wants absolutely nothing to do with the corrupt 2 party oligarchy as both have been bought and paid by the banks, The Federal Reserve and Wall Street and does not need nor require money from 1%'rs and to say anything otherwise is a major dis service to this group and movement as a whole as we see people like Soros as being apart of the problem and does not endorse millionaires or billionaires. No corporate dollars are welcomed and if one were to attempt to finance this movement it would be rejected and returned with a note saying "No sale!"!

To believe anything else means you are being seriously deceived and tricked and said source should not be trusted or taken seriously and if it does not come from the aforementioned it is not to be taken as the official stance. No General Assembly in any group throughout the planet will amend this ever!

STRONG EMPHASIS UPON THE FOLLOWING AND CANNOT BE EXPRESSED ENOUGH :
Unless it comes from Occupy Together, Occupy Everything, #Occupy Wall Street, NYC General Assembly or any of the countless official "Occupy" family of sites it does not speak for this movement and the movement will not endorse any site outside of our family of sites. Adbusters does not speak for us, Tides does not speak for us, no union speaks for us, The American Socialist Party does not speak for us, The Communist Party does not speak for us, Nancy Pelosi, Obama, Biden, The Democratic National Committee, The Republican Nation Committee, The Tea Party, Libertarian movement or any other political party or figurehead does not speak for us and neither do they represent us! neither does any group that has decided to join us under their own free will and volition but even those groups and our partner firms do not speak for us! We speak for ourselves!

All are welcomed from all faiths, ethnic groups, political persuasions, LBGTI, animal and kid friendly as we will not discriminate, we will be friendly to all. Illicit narcotics (marijuana to meth while all scrips prescribed to a fellow protester are obviously allowed) and liquor (all forms) use are banned and will get someone expelled and turned over to law enforcement. Come as you are! Remember, there is no member of the 1% that is on this website which means we are all The 99%!

reply to post by AtticusRye


Their drugs and group sex and even this death though sad

does not affect me nearly as much


as what the banks are doing in collusion with our government.


It does not affect me AT ALL compared to how much it affects me that the Supreme Court is ruling at the behest of the more despicable players in corporate America and legalizing corporate person-hood.

It does not affect me AT ALL compared to my fourth amendment right being swindled away under false pretenses and misreading the forefathers meaning and intention of protecting our right to illegal search and seizure. This might affect my life dramatically everyday if I am a traveler. These folks sex and drug use is the least of my concerns and in fact no concern to me at all.

Let them do what they want as long as they are consenting adults and not harming anyone other than themselves - which we may discourage and dissuade but do not out law. That is what liberty is.

Only if they have some control over me, or if their actions AFFECT ME, do I care what they are doing to themselves and even then - not so much.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

So, who do you choose? the whole system is corrupt, from the face to face stab, to the stab in the back...choose where you want the knife to go.

You don't choose. You empower a vanguard to force the decision. I'll be intentionally vague on that point so I don't violate ATS TOS. But, this is something "Occupy" won't got anywhere near because there's nothing revolutionary about them; they're 70% fringe and outcasts and 30% a run-of-the-mill Obama 2012 campaign rally.

Just like the Tea Party, OWS is an institutionally-backed movement designed as a "safety valve" - an initiative to manage a few weeks of controlled dissent so more spontaneous dissent doesn't materialize. The Tea Party was co-opted by corporate-backed Republicans on Day 5, OWS was co-opted by corporate-backed Democrats on Day 3. Neither of these things occurred by accident.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
reply to post by AtticusRye

 

THE OFFICIAL STANCE OF THE #OOCUPYEVERYTHING - OCCUPY TOGETHER - #OCCUPYWALLSTREET MOVEMENTS AND ALL ASSOCIATED MARCHES & OCCUPATIONS THROUGHOUT THE PLANET CURRENTLY

Is this something you pounded out just now? If not, where can I read the "official stance"?

And being against your group being co-opted does not mean your group is not co-opted. And yours is the very definition of co-option.

Anyway, gotta run some errands. I have to pass by the drug/prostitution zone called "Occupy Vancouver" [an occupation of 80 people in a city of 3 million] so I'll check back later if I haven't been mugged.

reply to post by newcovenant


The policies this movement is fighting are against us all!

OWS protests against their own interests. They believe what they're told and don't have inquisitive enough minds to unearth the subtle bonds of their manipulation. They're puppets - props in a political stageplay. Nothing more.

I've been to two Occupy events to check them out first-hand: San Diego and Vancouver. Both were nothing like they were presented in the news. The news presented highly sanitized throngs that made them look like mainstream gatherings. What I saw was a small (in both cases less than 100) group of chronic homeless, drug users, hookers and the fringes and margins of society. What I saw was the Bottom 1%.

As someone with a critical mind I then asked myself, "why would the corporate media make this out to be something it's clearly not?" I also asked "why is a man (Obama) whose top 5 campaign donors include Goldman Sachs and Citi-Chase endorse Occupy?"

reply to post by AtticusRye


The policies this OWS movement are protesting are dangerous and anti-human, anti-freedom policies that affect us in every area of our lives. If you do not support them you cannot complain about being enslaved by your government or your institutions any longer. This movement is an attempt to level the playing field for all, not just here in America but for all peoples facing injustice, inequality and oppression at the hands of the elite and unscrupulous power brokers that up until now have ruled the world.

As to the stance issue it is official as it decree stance and who and what we will support!

I judge people by the company they keep. The 80-90 deluded activists and homeless people protesting against their own self-interests isn't a party I want to attend ---

In an interview that will be aired tonight on ABC News, President Obama continues to express his commitment to the Occupy Wall Street protesters.

www.weeklystandard.com...

Top 10 Obama Contributors, 2003-2008 cycle:
#2 - Goldman Sachs - $1,035,095
#4 - Microsoft - $809,000
#5 - Google - $796,000
#6 - JP Morgan Chase - $700,080
#7 - Citigroup - $681,000

(data from Open Secrets)

I'd join a movement that has the oligarchy in hysterics. Not one that has them making toasts and politely applauding.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
As to the stance issue it is official as it decree stance and who and what we will support!

lolwut?!

Is this English?

reply to post by AtticusRye


We are not a party, nor a place to party. We are a movement who is grounded in reality, logic and common sense. If you want to go somewhere to party go to a nightclub and do not bother coming to an action event to party.

More donor lists for POTUS elections :
2008 McCain - www.opensecrets.org...
2004 Bush - www.opensecrets.org...

All 3 are a mirror of one another and you will see on all elections that banks and conglomerates dominate the campaign spectrum.

Fine, lets go through this list of coherent demands then as a person whom actually supports the -theme- of the movement.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

They have taken our houses through an illegal foreclosure process, despite not having the original mortgage.

This is far more complex than just "they foreclosed on us". There is a 20+ year issue going on with deregulation of banking procedures that allowed for a housing boom to begin with that had people jump into things and make bad decisions. This is a gray issue...and although a concern, simply pointing out something that sucks is not an actual demand.

They have taken bailouts from taxpayers with impunity, and continue to give Executives exorbitant bonuses.

I agree with this. the too big to fail stuff is retarded. I am not opposed to a case by case basis of companys borrowing a bit of money, especially when they impact the economy dramatically, but in its place, a total spending freeze and all above a certain pay grade have no bonuses until the money is paid back. Again, solutions are required for a list of demands...this is just again pointing out something that sucks.

They have perpetuated inequality and discrimination in the workplace based on age, the color of one’s skin, sex, gender identity and sexual orientation.

I have not seen this, I dispute it. this is a red herring though...

They have poisoned the food supply through negligence, and undermined the farming system through monopolization.

Yes and no. define poisoned. Do I personally have to pay more because some hippy is convinced that having gmo foods is bad for us without any peer reviewed data but rather their yoga guru said it gives bad chi? ok, bit of an extreme exaggeration the other way, but I, being a man of hard science, wants...the science.

They have profited off of the torture, confinement, and cruel treatment of countless animals, and actively hide these practices.

Animal testing is outlawed
if its secret...then how do you know about it? if its exposed, then law enforcement is in place for this. What is the complaint?
However, I am not opposed to animal testing for heavy stuff, like cancer research...cosmetics, yes..thats bad, but if its something that could save a human life and can progress it going to human trials fast...then go for it.

They have continuously sought to strip employees of the right to negotiate for better pay and safer working conditions.

Agreed here 100%.

They have held students hostage with tens of thousands of dollars of debt on education, which is itself a human right.

Fact of life in a capitalist society. And education is not a human right.
I agree in a utopian society, it is, but this is not that..I think a better scholarship program should be released

They have consistently outsourced labor and used that outsourcing as leverage to cut workers’ healthcare and pay.

Agreed again 100%, and I believe this is the biggest issue. should be the single focused message for this movement actually..the rest is tripe

They have influenced the courts to achieve the same rights as people, with none of the culpability or responsibility.

Yep, that is just more of the same...corporatist purchasing the gov.
(snipping nonsense gripes for space..already been answered and will address only the ones with depth from here on out)

They have sold our privacy as a commodity.

Gray area here. if I sign up for free movies, and then upset of spam, thats not a real gripe, thats me being an idiot. But I don't disagree fully

They determine economic policy, despite the catastrophic failures their policies have produced and continue to produce.
They have donated large sums of money to politicians, who are responsible for regulating them.

These two are the same..and agreed

They continue to block alternate forms of energy to keep us dependent on oil.
They continue to block generic forms of medicine that could save people’s lives or provide relief in order to protect investments that have already turned a substantial profit.

Ultimately nonsense (with asterisk)

They purposefully keep people misinformed and fearful through their control of the media.

Bingo

They have accepted private contracts to murder prisoners even when presented with serious doubts about their guilt.

Proof?

They have perpetuated colonialism at home and abroad.

Opinion/perspective

They have participated in the torture and murder of innocent civilians overseas.

So does everyone whom buys diamonds, gold, drugs, etc.


See, this is a list of perspectives and gripes.
The one actual message (corporations purchasing politicians and outsourcing) is lost in an array of utter crap and opinions (of which I agree with, but still).

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
reply to post by AtticusRye

 

We are not a party, nor a place to party. We are a movement who is grounded in reality, logic and common sense. If you want to go somewhere to party go to a nightclub and do not bother coming to an action event to party.

No, you're a silly little camp-out that is tacitly helping politicians paid-for by Goldman Sachs. A gaggle of puppets and props deluded about your own import. A throng of naked emperors ruling over an imaginary kingdom.

reply to post by AtticusRye


Find me proof that Goldman Sachs is behind this movement? That's right, you can't!

Originally posted by AtticusRye

Originally posted by SaturnFX

So, who do you choose? the whole system is corrupt, from the face to face stab, to the stab in the back...choose where you want the knife to go.

You don't choose. You empower a vanguard to force the decision.

So, there is no real answer (real answer meaning answers based in viable reality verses pie eyed dreams.

Why not just say "we will have alien supermen come down after we erect a giant cake". Just as likely to happen...

So yep...as someone whom occasionally visits the real world, it is not about employing a vangaard council or anything...its, hmm...obama or romney...which one...which one...thats it...no councils, no federations, none of that.

Hearing the movement is seeking...whatever...means the movement is full of fail. Sorry, I mean, I love the idea, but I also love the idea of a race of super intelligent beneviolent angels coming to lead us out of our feces tossing stage and into space travel...I do however recognise a daydream of nonsense when I see it.

maybe 100 years...or not...but today/tomorrow? no chance in hell

-playing the part of a pessimist today-

reply to post by AtticusRye


The difference between me and this book is I am that smart!

reply to post by TheImmaculateD1


Anyhow, in summation, I applaud your passion and efforts...the ideal is a good one, and hopefully I demonstrated the current shortcomings enough to be considered.

I think that list you posted needs to be trimmed down to just the absolute minimum and most important...in my opinion, that is the corporate outsourcing and purchasing of the political system. The rest needs to go away and become its own movement down the road, not associated with the ows thing. If your one that is constantly rubbing sholders with these groups and speaking in the ranks, then I would recommend you push that angle...you can change some things with focus, but that bigarsed list only ensures nothing changes..might as well toss in global warming and saving the whales also...

inch by inch is a cinch. Yard by yard is hard.
so, decide which inch you want to gain and go with that...stop going for the yard by yard approach

reply to post by SaturnFX


The list will not be trimmed down as that is forcing this movement into compromising for which the 99% are sick and tired of being sick and tired of being the only group that has to compromise, it is time for Wall Street, the banks and the corporations to compromise. No more. Enough!

Thank you for the confidence and support and do trust is that if you see something bring it up at your local event to it's General Assembly!

reply to post by AtticusRye


I've been to occupy Vancouver, and although the protest has been subverted by the homeless and addicted street people, there are still a lot of people there who do not share needles or engage in group sex. It would be dangerous and ludicrous to paint a whole group of people with that brush.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

The list will not be trimmed down as that is forcing this movement into compromising for which the 99% are sick and tired of being sick and tired of being the only group that has to compromise, it is time for Wall Street, the banks and the corporations to compromise. No more. Enough!

Thank you for the confidence and support and do trust is that if you see something bring it up at your local event to it's General Assembly!

What I read:

The list is to ensure this movement is ineffective
We know the game, yet refuse to play it properly...we will throw hail mary passes from the beginning and hopefully magic happens...but gaining ground until we are at the goal post is beyond our desire or comprehension...We want nothing to happen, so we are demanding everything at once.

We are dumb

Thanks for the confidence and support and do trust that if you see something, you will be overruled due to our desire to accomplish nothing. At least you get some fresh air.

See, once you get past a certain age, you see the game, you see the moves, and the only way to beat the game is to understand how the pieces move until you win..ignoring them, or circumventing them does not make you some sort of rebel that will win..it will make you disqualified and lose badly...but ok...meh, skyrim is coming out, will put focus on that verses a movement that demand both feet get shot out of pride. pride is the biggest issue.

Actually, I take that back. I may attend one of these meetings and try to demonstrate the opposite. I will give a list of valid greviences so damn long they will need a 4000 page report to discuss them all...then demand the "movement" adopt the entire thing...by the end, I expect a utopian technocracy and nothing less...the hope is, someone somewhere will eventually understand less is best.

Where is the issue with corporations circumventing environmental regulations to destroy our land?
Where is the issue with corporations blocking access to environmental resources owned by all?
Where is the issue with corporations being insensitive to indiginous people in developing areas of the world?
Where is...etc. many good issues, and the more you toss on the camels back, the more you risk breaking it and losing any possible ground gained through individual focus.