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Why I debunk the chemtrail myth

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posted on Nov, 6 2011 @ 02:47 PM
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reply to post by MrUncreated
 


Huh?


I'm pretty sure the government already said they were real.


Which "government" ?? Of what nation? Is it one of those imaginary countries that ends in '-stan'??



.... it's a substitute for the ozone layer.


Double "huh"? Ozone is not visible. It is not in need of a "substitute".




posted on Nov, 6 2011 @ 04:10 PM
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Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

So it is my contention that if there was "something going on" then I would know about it.




That is an abusrd assumption. How many people knew of the SR71 during its years of development? How many people knew anything about any of the stealth projects during development? I and others are supposed to believe someone in the civilian aviation industry would somehow know something is going on when cleary the vast majority in the militarry had no idea?


The contention that chemtrails are being sprayed by civilian airliners requires that they are no longer in development and not lmiited to the military.

As I said before - if you have a particular chemtrail theory that limits it to the military then yep - I accept I would not know about it and would not be being slandered.

But that's not what is usually being suggested.



Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
You need to learn more before you falsely condem millions of people in the aviation industry.


So some yahoo claims pilots are poisioning us and you take it to heart and think the whole industry is being condemed.


When it's applied to any airliner that makes a persistent contrail then that is exactly what is happening.


I didn't think you took the opinion of yahoo's and the people who support them that seriously but I guess I was wrong.


Clearly you are. It is now entering popular mythology too - chemtrail believers like to "go public", to get letters in papers, write to their elected representatives, hold public displays, etc.

it is unfortunate that it doesn't go away just because it is ignored - that WOULD be preferable, but it ain't happening as far as I can see - chemmies that don't get noticed get more strident, not less!
edit on 6-11-2011 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 6 2011 @ 04:35 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul


I didn't think you took the opinion of yahoo's and the people who support them that seriously but I guess I was wrong.


Clearly you are. It is now entering popular mythology too - chemtrail believers like to "go public", to get letters in papers, write to their elected representatives, hold public displays, etc.

it is unfortunate that it doesn't go away just because it is ignored - that WOULD be preferable, but it ain't happening as far as I can see - chemmies that don't get noticed get more strident, not less!


Who cares if people believe contrails are chemtrails? People believe in bigfoot and elves and vampires and werewolves. All are popular myth with no science to back them up but people still believe. I think I would seem pretty foolish if I went into the Crypto forum and start attacking everyone with the tenacity you do on this subject. With no science or evidence to prove a contrail is anything more than a contrail, chemtrailers will never be taken seriously by anyone or any organization that matters. So why the need to debunk obvious bunk? Part of me feels if some of you would just laugh this off and not get soo carried away debating contrails this topic and forum would die.

edit on 6-11-2011 by FreeSpeaker because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 6 2011 @ 04:41 PM
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reply to post by FreeSpeaker
 


Clearly you care.

Why can't I be allowed to care as well??



posted on Nov, 6 2011 @ 05:02 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by FreeSpeaker
 


Clearly you care.

Why can't I be allowed to care as well??


Oh, thats a good one Gaul.


Yes, you can find evidence of my fanaticism all over this forum. I post soo much and vehemently people think i'm a shill or work for the government as a paid disinfo agent. Sound familiar?


I don't care about chemtrails but when people make absurd assumptions, I do care.

Carry on your great crusade against those with no proof.



posted on Nov, 6 2011 @ 05:30 PM
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reply to post by FreeSpeaker
 


I didn't mention fanaticism, nor was I thinking it.

But clearly you have a CARE - which is what you initially wrote - or you would not have bothered with posting to this thread.



posted on Nov, 6 2011 @ 07:24 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by FreeSpeaker
 


I didn't mention fanaticism, nor was I thinking it.


Maybe not, but the time and energy you spend debunking a myth could certainly be seen as fanaticisim to some observers. It is a myth right? Why debunk something not based on fact or proof? Just what threat to the aviation industry, and by extension your life, do people who think contrails are chemtrails pose?



Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
But clearly you have a CARE - which is what you initially wrote - or you would not have bothered with posting to this thread.


I should be more specific. I do not believe in chemtrails and certainly don't care to spend any time on the matter. Some here, you included, quickly debunked the matter for me. Some more eloquently than others I might add. I might still habour suspicions of what the military may be doing but I am quite sure by the time we learn of it the event will be history and beyond redress.

I posted becuase this thread is about why you spend soo much time debunking a myth and I happend to have a problem with your contention.


Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
So it is my contention that if there was "something going on" then I would know about it.


As I said, thats a absurd boast.

Then we had this next one.


Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by FissionSurplus
 

You need to learn more before you falsely condem millions of people in the aviation industry.


I simply could not reply after reading that. Where is this condemnation against millions of avaition employee's that fire's your desire to so vehemently debunk this myth? A dvd and some conspiracy forums are a threat to millions of people? Please explain this threat to millions for us all.



posted on Nov, 6 2011 @ 07:35 PM
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Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by FreeSpeaker
 


I didn't mention fanaticism, nor was I thinking it.


Maybe not, but the time and energy you spend debunking a myth could certainly be seen as fanaticisim to some observers.


that's their problem.


It is a myth right? Why debunk something not based on fact or proof?


Because people keep presenting it as if it were a fact - if they presented it as speculation I would have less issue with it.


Just what threat to the aviation industry, and by extension your life, do people who think contrails are chemtrails pose?


I dont think I mentioned a threat to the aviation industry - I said it was slander - the 2 are quite different - you seem intelligent enough so I will assume you know that or can find out if you are not familiar with the term.


I should be more specific. I do not believe in chemtrails and certainly don't care to spend any time on the matter. Some here, you included, quickly debunked the matter for me. Some more eloquently than others I might add. I might still habour suspicions of what the military may be doing but I am quite sure by the time we learn of it the event will be history and beyond redress.

I posted becuase this thread is about why you spend soo much time debunking a myth and I happend to have a problem with your contention.


One of the reasons is that, jsut occasionally, somone gets the messge - thank you for the validation!


Appart from that you have my reasons in the OP.



Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
So it is my contention that if there was "something going on" then I would know about it.


As I said, thats a absurd boast.


How do you know that?





Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by FissionSurplus
 

You need to learn more before you falsely condem millions of people in the aviation industry.


I simply could not reply after reading that. Where is this condemnation against millions of avaition employee's that fire's your desire to so vehemently debunk this myth? A dvd and some conspiracy forums are a threat to millions of people? Please explain this threat to millions for us all.


As above, I didn't say it was a threat - I said it was a slander - problem solved



posted on Nov, 6 2011 @ 07:57 PM
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reply to post by MathiasAndrew
 


I don't think I agree with the theory of chemtrails. I can see what people are saying about it, but the premise is too bizarre, although I think it is quite remarkable that the theory is so persistent if there was truly *nothing* to it.

I picked up a Science News magazine today and was shocked at how relevant it is to this thread. The article states that there are more aerosols in the atmosphere than scientists had anticipated, and that this phenomenon has leveled off the effects of global warming since about 2001 (9-11 anybody?). They explain that it has to do with volcanic eruptions one in 1991 and two in 2006, but I don't see how a volcanic eruption in 2006 would stop global warming 5 years earlier. (you should see the graph, it is quite anomolous how it plateaus at 2000 after steady warming from beginning of century.

The article actually admits that the scientists do not understand where the aerosols are coming from (whoa :wow
. It says that some of the extra aerosols came from dirty coal burning plants in China, but some of them *had to have come* from volcanoes, which is deductive evidence, not empirical evidence.

the link:

www.sciencenews.org...

It is just a little too strange for me to pass up, and it is also an opportunity for me to demonstrate that, unlike many people, I argue upon convictions and evidence, not dogma or a desire to be correct.



posted on Nov, 6 2011 @ 08:27 PM
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Originally posted by Corruption Exposed

Originally posted by CaDreamer
reply to post by Corruption Exposed
 


please reread my post you apparently didn't understand what "worldwide" meant. cherry picking single nations to debunk a worldwide statistic is disingenuous and naughty troll behavior.

can someone say strawman?



Thanks, never been called a troll before


I clearly said that it was an Australian link. And I still stand correct when I say that for you to claim chemtrails are fake because of world wide life expectancy may rise is ridiculous. Nice deflection though, good troll tactic

i actually never made any such claim... i posed a question, if chemtrails are "making us sick" how do you explain longevity statistics worldwide, where life expectancy has been steadily increasing in the last 100 years?
you attempted to refute that with a single nation statistic...
edit on 6-11-2011 by CaDreamer because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 8 2011 @ 04:17 PM
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Aloysius, I take it that you have conceded and you accept that you do not know what you are talking about. You did not respond back or even attempt to explain. You decided to avoid and ignore. Your usual tactic when you are wrong.



His postings on Vandenberg when he states that we should have persistent contrails please explain why he was right. Explain why above Vandenberg we should have persistent contrails, not LA. Otherwise kick rocks.



posted on Nov, 8 2011 @ 04:34 PM
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reply to post by BillfromCovina
 


Not at all Bill - you said people should go to the thread - I think that is good advice.

Phage used data from Vandenberg - 130 miles from where you were in LA AFAIK - if you were as serious about science as you claim you would have pointed out that the discrepancy made VB pretty useless to justify/disprove contrails at LA.

Instead you decided to use the data yourself to make your case. You didn't have to - no-one forced you to - you could have pointed out the obvious problems but instead chose to use VB data to support your case.

In this post you used data from VB to support your claim: www.abovetopsecret.com...

And in this post you said data from VB presented by Phage supported your claim:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Ergo you were using data from VB in support of your claim.

Sorry about having to point that out again.



posted on Nov, 8 2011 @ 04:41 PM
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Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by FreeSpeaker
 


I didn't mention fanaticism, nor was I thinking it.


Maybe not, but the time and energy you spend debunking a myth could certainly be seen as fanaticisim to some observers. It is a myth right? Why debunk something not based on fact or proof? Just what threat to the aviation industry, and by extension your life, do people who think contrails are chemtrails pose?




Oh threats to shoot down aircraft, on numerous occasions. The FBI recently had to get involved, against an individual who called up a company that does seasonal cloud seeding with small planes, because he threated to shoot down their aircraft. Other chemtrailers have talked about a desire to get ahold of surface to air missiles to shoot down planes.

On Aircrap, they even bring up the option of executing pilots.



posted on Nov, 8 2011 @ 04:51 PM
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post removed because the user has no concept of manners

Click here for more information.



posted on Nov, 8 2011 @ 08:26 PM
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reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
 


Again you do not have a clue. I asked you to justify why directly where the soundings took place, not in LA, persistent contrails would exist. You do not know and you do not understand the charts. If there were soundings at LAX, you would not accept these unless they were directly in a planes flight path. Yet you still want me to look at unconnected pictures from WW2 with no data. You set impossible goals for people on the chemtrail side and keep moving those goal posts for your assertions.

In other words, no matter what evidence is presented you will not accept it.



posted on Nov, 8 2011 @ 08:50 PM
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So that's why you debunk chemtrails?? Wow, I always thought it was because you're an attention whore with a huge ego.



posted on Nov, 8 2011 @ 08:58 PM
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reply to post by BillfromCovina
 


Well Bill if that's what you think then you telling me that I won't accept any evidence is quite ironic!!


I have said several times in this forum what sort of evidence I could accept proving, or at least strongly suggesting, the existence of some nefarious programme along he lines of the chemtrail myth - but soundings from 130 miles away ain't it.

And hypothetical data that doesn't exist isn't it either.

Sorry you are incapable of deriving any useful information from all those photos and videos I linked you to - I told you the sorts of info you CAN get from them - you have persistently declined to actually use that info and tell me that it is all my fault too?? Yeah....right!


Pilot - glad to have cleared that up for you
edit on 8-11-2011 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 9 2011 @ 10:42 AM
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Originally posted by firepilot

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by FreeSpeaker
 


I didn't mention fanaticism, nor was I thinking it.


Maybe not, but the time and energy you spend debunking a myth could certainly be seen as fanaticisim to some observers. It is a myth right? Why debunk something not based on fact or proof? Just what threat to the aviation industry, and by extension your life, do people who think contrails are chemtrails pose?




Oh threats to shoot down aircraft, on numerous occasions. The FBI recently had to get involved, against an individual who called up a company that does seasonal cloud seeding with small planes, because he threated to shoot down their aircraft. Other chemtrailers have talked about a desire to get ahold of surface to air missiles to shoot down planes.

On Aircrap, they even bring up the option of executing pilots.


Looney's being looney. They will never go away and neither will they ever get SAM's. I personally feel no threat from those kinds of people. Anyone who would advocate shooting down a civilian aircraft is just an idiot and should be ignored.



posted on Nov, 9 2011 @ 10:50 AM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

As above, I didn't say it was a threat - I said it was a slander - problem solved


So its just about slander. OK. Just let me say that one must have a very large ego to care about being slandered while posting under a pseudonym. Of anyone who debunks on this forum only Uncius can really say he has been slandered becuase while he does use a pseudonym here, he also has no problem telling people his real name.
edit on 9-11-2011 by FreeSpeaker because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 9 2011 @ 11:33 AM
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Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by firepilot

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by FreeSpeaker
 


I didn't mention fanaticism, nor was I thinking it.


Maybe not, but the time and energy you spend debunking a myth could certainly be seen as fanaticisim to some observers. It is a myth right? Why debunk something not based on fact or proof? Just what threat to the aviation industry, and by extension your life, do people who think contrails are chemtrails pose?




Oh threats to shoot down aircraft, on numerous occasions. The FBI recently had to get involved, against an individual who called up a company that does seasonal cloud seeding with small planes, because he threated to shoot down their aircraft. Other chemtrailers have talked about a desire to get ahold of surface to air missiles to shoot down planes.

On Aircrap, they even bring up the option of executing pilots.


Looney's being looney. They will never go away and neither will they ever get SAM's. I personally feel no threat from those kinds of people. Anyone who would advocate shooting down a civilian aircraft is just an idiot and should be ignored.


However, it is still a federal offense, and the FBI gets involved anytime threats against aircraft and aircrew are made. Just because someone is looney, does not mean they are harmless. There have actually been more than one chemtrail believer who went on shooting sprees too. Not involving aircraft, but multiple murder shootings.









 
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