In Memory of the late Col. Muammar Gaddafi - What History Books will NEVER tell your kids about

Was he a saint? No...but then again who is these days?

The U.S. media makes it seem as if the rebels were extremely popular...which is not the case. Without the assistance of NATO they would have been shut down by the Libyan military within weeks.

And on another note...do not forget that over 500 AQ terrorists were set free by the REBELS. Also do not forget that the rebels went from door to door slaughtering anyone who was brave enough to to say that they liked/supported Gaddafi. They raped and cut off the breasts of some women. One of the threads here led us to a picture of their corpses. They also were known to lock people inside their homes...which are built like mini fortresses and they would starve.

Ya the rebels are real saints as well. Definitely not better than Gaddafi and honestly will be worse for the Libyan people (better for the West though)

Originally posted by jamsession

Originally posted by jerico65
Elites? Yeah, they are. They aren't the shining examples of America, but comparing them to Saddam, Hitler and Stalin is complete and utter BS that people who's only form of exercise is jumping to conclusions love to do.

yeah definitely BS since they are far worse than saddam, stalin and hitler.

Right. Clinton and the Bush Family are worse than Hitler, Stalin and Saddam???

I'm sorry....troll much??

Hitler invade how many European countries during WW2, his armies killing thousands in battle and millions in death camps.

Stalin had entire regions deliberately starved, killing millions. Not to mention his Gulag system and his cute habit of executing anyone that might challenge his authority. And their families.

Saddam killed his opposition in multiple fun-filled ways, like having them thrown off buildings and fed to woodchippers. His sons hobbies were writing poetry, long walks on the beach, and the rape, torture and murder of countless citizens.

Yet, according to you, these men don't hold a candle to Bush and Clinton.

So much for "Deny Ignorance". ATS is a breeding ground for it.

Damn, this makes me sick to my stomach. If this is true, the world is even worse than I'd thought it was. I'm going to read more about this.

Originally posted by ALF88

Originally posted by FlyingSpaghettiMonster
Just because Gadaffi was an enemy of Western democracies doesn't make him a hero or even a good leader. It certainly doesn't negate the things he's done to his own people.

Prove it! Don't talk, prove it! The pro Gaddafi arguments where listed in all threads regarding Libya including sources.

No. This is a theory you subscribe to, you're the one challenging an established worldview with a new 'hypothesis' (even if that's awarding your views a degree of grandeur they don't deserve). if you had any confidence in it you should be ready and willing to test it to destruction. That's what a scientist or a good journalist would do. And a few third-hand, partisan youtube links won't be enough. Stop being so lazy.

This is what makes me laugh about conspiracy fantasists - the staggering ignorance and baseless kite-flying that's passed off as 'free thought'. And to cap it all, not only are we expected to prove our own theories, we have to prove yours too!

Originally posted by voodmon
I cry for you, You were a wonderful human being!!!

edit on 24-10-2011 by voodmon because: misspelled a word

You love Gadaffi and you quote the Dalai Lama in your sig. Is that some kind of sick joke?

Originally posted by FlyingSpaghettiMonster
No. This is a theory you subscribe to, you're the one challenging an established worldview

What is an established worldview? That Gaddafi is evil? LOL! Statements coming out of the mouths of PROVEN liars. So you must be a gullible fool IF you believe that stuff without questioning it. It is obvious that you didn't do any research.

Originally posted by FlyingSpaghettiMonster
with a new 'hypothesis' (even if that's awarding your views a degree of grandeur they don't deserve). if you had any confidence in it you should be ready and willing to test it to destruction. That's what a scientist or a good journalist would do. And a few third-hand, partisan youtube links won't be enough.

There are numerous threads on ATS alone, that have listed proven facts on what Gaddafi has done for Libya. That includes official numbers and sources.

The problem on this board is, that guys like you make bold claims without being able to prove them. Time and time again users post things like Gaddafi was evil, Gaddafi was a dictator, yada, yada, yada, and when you challenge them, simply by asking for proof, they disappear never to be heard of again.

Originally posted by ALF88

Originally posted by FlyingSpaghettiMonster
No. This is a theory you subscribe to, you're the one challenging an established worldview

What is an established worldview? That Gaddafi is evil? LOL! Statements coming out of the mouths of PROVEN liars. So you must be a gullible fool IF you believe that stuff without questioning it. It is obvious that you didn't do any research.

Originally posted by FlyingSpaghettiMonster
with a new 'hypothesis' (even if that's awarding your views a degree of grandeur they don't deserve). if you had any confidence in it you should be ready and willing to test it to destruction. That's what a scientist or a good journalist would do. And a few third-hand, partisan youtube links won't be enough.

There are numerous threads on ATS alone, that have listed proven facts on what Gaddafi has done for Libya. That includes official numbers and sources.

The problem on this board is, that guys like you make bold claims without being able to prove them. Time and time again users post things like Gaddafi was evil, Gaddafi was a dictator, yada, yada, yada, and when you challenge them, simply by asking for proof, they disappear never to be heard of again.

I'm sure if I came here and said 'the sky is blue, lettuce contains iron, dragons don't exist', you'd still say 'prove it!'. You want me to provide 'proof' - which you won't accept anyway - why does that excuse you doing the same? There's forty years of proof out in the real world, away from the padded cell of the internet. Stop telling others to do your job for you and go and look for it yourself.

Originally posted by FlyingSpaghettiMonster
I'm sure if I came here and said 'the sky is blue, lettuce contains iron, dragons don't exist', you'd still say 'prove it!'. You want me to provide 'proof' - which you won't accept anyway - why does that excuse you doing the same? There's forty years of proof out in the real world, away from the padded cell of the internet. Stop telling others to do your job for you and go and look for it yourself.

Like I said still no proof from the Gaddafi bashers. You know, we are used to deal with ignorant people like yourself for 9 months now. That's why we opened dozens of threads on the topic with official data / proof. I am sure you are clever enough to use the ATS search function.

The "established worldview" or what I would call it, "a fools world", is still not showing any HARD EVIDENCE to prove their BS claims.


The estblished worlview:

Gaddafi is responsible for the Lockerbie Bombing.


The real world:

www.globalresearch.ca...

www.yahoo.com... Keywords: CIA Lockerbie evidence

This month I've notice that important human being who wanted, could have or changed the face of World died :

Steve Jobs - 5/10/2011
Dennis Ritchie - 12/10/2011
Muammar Gaddafi - 20/10/2011
John McCarthy - 24/10/2011

Is it just coicidence or something is happening ?
I don't want to BS or make illogical link between them but I'm just wondering...

reply to post by ALF88


You could not of put that much better.

People need to actually do a bit of back digging themselves, before they make ignorant opinions about something they obviously know nothing about. Of course Gaddafi done bad things, but also with that, I seen a person who loved his people and over the last 8-10 years really tried to make a difference for not only the African continent, but the people of Libya aswell.

When I had a look at the living standards in Libya, I was quiet shocked. I was one of the people when the war first began hoping they would capture, kill, what ever need to be done to get him out of power. But now looking back at what he may of done decades ago, what he has done over the past 8-10 years, I actually see a person who did try to make a difference, and I guess maybe he tried to do it for himself aswell, I do not know.

Gaddafi did makes some good points in his public videos, I'm finding it hard to find evidence he was a bloodthirsty dictator. Apart from the obvious incidents that he has been blamed for, what else has he done apart from a bloodless coup in 1969, if he even orchestrated that?

reply to post by FlyingSpaghettiMonster


I'm sorry Mr Spaghetti Monster, but there is sufficient evidence in this thread alone to prove that maybe something is fishy about the entire Libya situation. I will say, yes maybe or it is fact that Gaddafi may of killed innocents, but until someone can give me 100% proof of this happening then it is pure speculation.

Most of the evidence pointed out in this thread is undeniable proof, which makes it one of the best threads I have seen almost since I first started using ATS. Can anyone find proof, apart from the obvious incidents, eg: Lockerbie bombing, (umm yeah are there any others), that Gaddafi was a bloodthirsty dictator, hell bent on murdering/killing, whilst giving up WMD production in 2003, giving Libya one of the highest standards of living in the world until the war began.

Some of the punishments in the country are questionable, yes, I do not agree that people should have limbs etc severed for breaking the law, but once again, we are not a muslim country and I'm sure crimes against humanity very similar to this are happening in other parts of the middle east or Africa, yet the U.S.A or nato/Europe will not touch them, or they are getting prepared too .

So please if you have any other evidence that will contribute to how Gaddafi was a very bad man who did not care about his people and the rest of Africa, please enlighten me with what you know. I'm sure anything you do provide, will be no different to what western countries have done for the past 60 years, maybe worse then Gaddafi. There is always two sides to a story, and the evidence for Gaddafi is being provided in this thread. Not just to you Mr Spaghetti Monster, but all the Gaddafi haters, Bring some facts to the table.

People like myself are not sitting here wearing my keyboard down for the fun of it. I do dig a bit, not saying I'm the best researcher, but I like to see different points from either side. I'm finding it hard to find anything which would say Gaddafi is a Dictator. In my eyes, he is no different to the Royals in England or any other country.

I'm confused. Hasn't America supplied factions with weaponry which THEY then went and used for nefarious purposes? Why is everyone boo-hooing over some Semtex? I'm still on the fence about this issue, just pointing out something I noticed.

I do not know if this thread has been linked up to this one aswell, but if it has, here it is again... More evidence that NATO are compulsive liars.....

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by LiberLegit


It is known that the USA and other countries of course do supply the so-called enemies of the west with money and weapons throughout modern history.

- Saddam is a perfect example, until I guess he decided to go solo, but this guy also did commit mass murders, whilst invading Kuwait aswell, but there is an allegation that the Kuwaitis were stealing oil aswell from Iraq. Saddam did have to go in my point of view though.

- Another is the Taliban or Al-Queda (which ever you want to call them), when the USA funded them in the Afghan war back in the 1980's against the Red Army(russia). We all know what happened in the early 2000's, so once again, this is another example of a Western country funding the so-called terrorists, until they turned there focus to the west.

- It has been speculated that the Libyan rebels have ties with the terrorists, and I'm sure there is a link in this thread with a confession with one of the rebels. Once again, NATO have funded these people, who over the past 10+ years have been our worst and even the worlds worst enemy. What are these countries playing at. Are we going to see these rebels down the track turn on Europe?

I cannot link anything atm, because I am on a pre-paid internet connection. When I get the chance I will link my sources as evidence. I do not understand why those leaders say one thing, and then do another... It is becoming clear that this is not a conspiracy, just a another crime against humanity from the people we least expected it from. Very sad times for the west.

Originally posted by LiberLegit
I'm confused. Hasn't America supplied factions with weaponry which THEY then went and used for nefarious purposes? Why is everyone boo-hooing over some Semtex?

That depends whether you'd be 'boo-hooing' if someone you know died because some of that semtex exploded and killed them. As someone above said, 'by their deeds shall ye know them'.

Originally posted by Redevilfan09
reply to post by FlyingSpaghettiMonster

 

I'm sorry Mr Spaghetti Monster, but there is sufficient evidence in this thread alone to prove that maybe something is fishy about the entire Libya situation. I will say, yes maybe or it is fact that Gaddafi may of killed innocents, but until someone can give me 100% proof of this happening then it is pure speculation.

If I sit in my room and keep the curtains closed, I've no 'proof' that the sun shines in the morning, have I? I'm offering a golden opportunity for those who suddenly believe Gadaffi to be the modern equivalent of Ghandi to prove beyond all doubt that I'm wrong and a fool into the bargain. If it's as easy as you say, why on earth are you so reticent about deluging me in reams of detailed evidence to support your case?

I'm not going to do your job for you, and you should be rubbing your hands in anticipation at the prospect of presenting evidence that Gadaffi wasn't an unelected leader of an undemocratic state that squandered its resources on personal wealth and brutalised its own people - go on, Woodward and Bernstein me! I'll be fair and allow you a month to assemble a case.

Of course, if you go out and research diligently, only to find that the evidence does not support your case, I expect you to be honest and present that evidence too.

reply to post by jerico65


well, there may be a great deal of trolls out there, but i'm definitely not one of them.



there's no single bit of hope left in me now that i've seen a secretary of state acting this way. be afraid people. be very afraid.

And yet another person speaks out about the REAL situation in Libya. This woman is someone who has actually been in Libya in the past 6 months and speaks about what she has SEEN with her own eyes and she is an actual Journalist, a REAL journalist. She becomes emotionally moved at one point describing a specific day she states "Was a very hard day" These people are being bombed and killed in their homeland and the ones doing it? NATO, not Gadaffi, not his government leaders, not his military. How is it ok for NATO to bomb and murder civilians, destroy their homeland and all the work that has been done their for the past 40 years, I would like to see this on MSM and would like for NATO to answer for the actions it has taken,and our president as well to explain how he supports such actions.
PLEASE WATCH THIS VIDEO!!!

I just posted this on another thread, but its seems to fit this topic very much so im posting it here now...


Ghaddafi did a lot of bad things, but so does everyone else with power out there....
BUT.... He also did a lot of good things not only for himself, but also for his people and continent.

I've done a lot of traveling and seen most parts of the world and I get across a great deal of information and footage through my work and one thing that always came to mind when I saw footage of cities and villages in Libya is how organized and calm everything seemed to be.

Not many old buildings falling apart and other signs of a so called enslaved and oppressed place where violence rules.
I see good roads, schools, hospitals everything in neat condition wether it was a big city or a small one on the country side, something you don't see while visiting countries that have been under rape hmmm I mean guidance of the western world.

It looked better than most parts of Africa, middle east, Mexico and even Portugal where I have some relatives.
This so called god of evil and power hungry guy, had some great ideas which helped other countries in Africa evolve, many countries got back on their feet because of help from Lybia, investments by the Lybian government which resulted and hundred of thousand of jobs for the the people in those countries.

He was the reason Africa and the middle east stopped being robbed of it's oil, he told everybody that the westerners specially the US were taking their oil in exchange for nothing while getting rich selling it to the rest of the world, everybody started charging real money and that's when your gas prices starting going up and these wars became a seasonal thing like sports.

A long time ago once Gadhafi summoned all African leaders and said that it was time they broke free from these "masters", the great nations that went to Africa colonized them, took everying of value including people and made them slaves.

He wanted the African to unite and help each other, become brothers with common goals, share resources, technology, experiences, money, intelligence and so on. Everyone would win, one continent, one currency, one dream, one goal.

The world media called him crazy, without mentioning the good positive thing, they just said that he wanted to make Africa his kingdom and rule it as a leader.. That such an idea was absurd and would only come from a power hungry dictator. Those were the headlines then.

Well, about a decade or so later.. Europe goes and forms such an alliance.. The #ing EU, doing the same thing Ghaddafi proposed that Africa should in order to stand on it's own feet.... And they even have one currency, euro. Some countries are in great turmoil and financial debt in this so called Union and they regret joining it in the first place, Greece, Ireland to name a few.

...guess what, this club of theirs has leaders too.

Anyways, Now we see this man portraited as the devil himself, the man whom most of the worlds strongest nations have had close relationships with until he started charging for his countries resources oil and even told others to do the same.

The media has done a fantastic job minimizing matos role in this, they even keep the camera down when there are us army soldiers in some footage that must be shown, anyone can tell the uniforms though.

Lybia has now been destroyed, those great roads, schools, factories, hospitals look like ruins today.... Becaue the UN, Nato bombed the crap of it and let those toy rebels run loose on the remaining soldiers of the lybian army so they could take pictures of them to show the world takes it Ghaddafis own people fighting agaisnt him, they all look the same right?


All that restoration of the country will cost the Lybians a lot, they will pay with only the secure source of income the nation had, to the same people that destroyed it in the first place.

People around the world look at China and Russia and point fingers at the way things are there... Well it's the same everywhere, do you guys think American media isn't censured?

They might tell the truth too BUT only the truth they want people to know about and that's because the same corporations that own the media outlets basically own everything else and fund the weapons that they use on the wars that make the country rich.

reply to post by Cassius666


I think our government and our president flaunt a lot of wealth while the people struggle, and while there are homeless and hungry. A LOT of people here are unhappy with the leadership and the leaders and there are protests an uprising of some sort you could say. If there were martial law declared and the civilians were abused and mistreated do you think Nato would come in and bomb and fight to help free us from an oppresive government that would harm anyone that stands up against it? No simple as that