I had been deceived - My visit to an OWS protest

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus


I noted that it is possible the protesters here in my city are quite different from elsewhere, that is why I do not support the movement even know entirely but am sympathetic to it and do not view the participants as a hive of hippie communists.

reply to post by Southern Guardian


It is already becoming violent. It is definitely departing from the peaceful rallies of the Tea Party type. This group has revolution on its wings and will bring Roman and Egyptian style protests here. Mark my word. Some have already predicted this even before this protest was announced.

reply to post by Misoir


I don't view them all as a hive of hippy communists. But I do see them, after all I have learned, as useful idiots for people like Van Jones, George Soros, CPUSA/SPUSA and other far left organizations whose goal is REVOLUTION. And not a peaceful one if polls here show anything about the attitude toward violence.

Originally posted by projectvxn

This whole protest stinks of leftist ideology and I will have nothing to do with it.

Are you certain that is all you smell here?

Amazing how effective "the plan" (real plan) has been.

Better invest in an odor free mask, because the stench is going to get a hell of a lot worse before it's over.

Originally posted by Misoir
reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

 

I noted that it is possible the protesters here in my city are quite different from elsewhere, that is why I do not support the movement even know entirely but am sympathetic to it and do not view the participants as a hive of hippie communists.

Yes, I know. I will give you credit for viewing people as individuals. Everyone has their own perceptions of life even when being fed propaganda from the media. I don't disagree with the protest entirely either. I disagree with the organizers and their agenda. I disagree with their focus on anti capitalism and anti corporation and their desire to bring a socialist Utopia. This type of thing couldnt catch on in such a big way if people were really happy and well fed. Many people know something is wrong, and are being told Capitalism is the problem, and that "democracy" (read socialism) will solve all this.

reply to post by projectvxn


Just can't get over the left/right thing huh??

"This whole protest stinks of leftist ideology and I will have nothing to do with it."

the day that you can actually see we are all just humans or americans trying to get along, is the day you may truly be on the path to being a part of change or betterment, as opposed to being a part of the problem........continuing to be a part of the derviness that keeps us apart, and not trying to make a change says that you are either very happy with the state of affairs, or you just like to disagree.

Can you find no good in these protests, not even one thing??? I bet you could if you tried............So, take that one good thing, add you vast experience to it, and help make a change.

Remember, anyone can sit back and complain, and spew whats wrong with everything, but, only those who can get up off the chair, couch, put away the computer, the toys, th TV, and actually go out and do something...............will truly create change.

Create change, not confusion.

Parker
MTUBY

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux

 

People even in the ATS forum are starting to call people fascist when they don't support the OWS protest. I asked for a definition of fascism and provided one myself but all I got in response was whining about how much I protest socialism. I guess more people read my stuff than I thought.

I've been called a bank shill, inhuman, and an whole host of other things simply for not agreeing to follow OWS to where I believe they are headed. Never mind my track record of promoting and advocating real solutions to these problems.

I understand the need to be part of something. I understand the need to want to defend it from attacks from the outside. I really do. But unlike many people, I don't want to be standing next to someone who wants to foment revolution and to burn the house down for the sake of some fruity revolution that will end with all of us under the thumb of a government that cannot be controlled.

reply to post by ParkerCramer


When these people are being used by communists and Socialists and big government advocates the answer is NO.

I am very careful about who I stand next to and why.

And no I DO NOT ACCEPT NOTIONS OF LEFTIST COLLECTIVIST IDEOLOGY. It seems everyone who is for leftism and collectivism hide behind the moniker of being "against the left/right paradigm" all while supporting leftist ideology.

No thanks.

You all talk about change...Change, change change...What change?

What do you actually want? Change is as meaningless when Obama spoke it as it is now coming from your typing fingers.

Define it. So we can all know where you stand.

reply to post by Misoir


Actually it is more likely that people in your city are just like the ones everywhere else. What you described sounds just like the three cities/protests i've been too. I did see one drum circle but it was mostly people letting their kids play with drums or people that had been there camping for days and bored. I personally think they are totally cheesy and lame, but I don't know why people hate on drum circles like they are something other than a few hippies banging on drums.

The protest I went to had an older woman and her 19 year old (very cute I might add, but I'm 25 so i can get away with it) daughter with her and I thought it was funny and kind of defining of the protest when she told her daughter to go home and sleep because she had school the next day and then after the girl left the mom protested for another three hours.

reply to post by projectvxn


So there are no people in existence that are capable of being useful for themselves? Is it possible to be proactive for any cause and not benefit someone powerful somewhere?

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
What does it matter what sort of clothes the protestors are wearing? What does it matter if all the guitar player at the protest are wearing shoes, and the face painters didn't bother to come? How does this legitimize pouty petulance?

I cannot say this often enough: Protest is really just a limp wristed way of admitting helplessness. The most annoying thing about this protest is the large number of people (claiming to represent 99% of the population) insisting they are really mad as hell with the 1% and then expecting...nay, demanding, the 1% do something about it. Pffffffft. What childishness is this?

"Oh the powers that be (not us damn it) are really evil meanies! You evil meanies need to stop being evil meanies and do something good for us, damn it! Where are my milk and cookies, damn it? Where is my free "health care", damn it? Where is my free stuff? I want free stuff, damn it! Where's my job? Job's, job's job's! That's our mantra, jobs! You evil meanie powers that be need to understand that you need us and that labor is the means of production, so get off yer arses and give us jobs, damn it!"

"What? Start my own business? Pfffffft! And become another one of the evil meanie powers that be? I don't think so. I don't want to be rich, just middle class, so let's get rid of the rich so we can get rid of the poor, and only have a middle class!"

"What? What do you mean eliminating the rich and poor will also eliminate the middle class? What are you, a fascist pig?"

Why act in meaningful ways when you can just protest, right? Why act responsibly and do what is necessary to reign in out of control government when you can just protest, right? Why do anything when all we have to do is demand the 1% do it for us?

JPZ...............wow. I usually agree with your writings, you have such a command of the english language, you seem to be the protector of the constitution, the braveheart of the little people.

And, yet, you cannot see...........they may not be getting it right, but they are calling attention to the state of affairs in todays society.

you seem to be more comfortable with being the individual who screams there are not enough life jackets, we are all going to die, its our own fault, instead of the person who would suggest maybe two people can share a life vest so that no one has to go without.


what is your suggestion, yhat will draw this many participants, and garner this kind of attention that will help "us do what is necessary to reign in our out of control government"

As always its a pleasure speaking with you.

Parker
MTUBY

Originally posted by Misoir
There were no orgies

No orgies? Pssh they have lost all my support and respect!!!.

OT: I figured as much, I hope they keep it up!

reply to post by projectvxn

I understand the need to be part of something. I understand the need to want to defend it from attacks from the outside. I really do. But unlike many people, I don't want to be standing next to someone who wants to foment revolution and to burn the house down for the sake of some fruity revolution that will end with all of us under the thumb of a government that cannot be controlled.

Yeah, good thing we're not under the thumb of a government we cannot control! Whew.

Respectfully, my good friend, we are most assuredly under the thumb of an out of control government and the only real practical thing we can do is refuse to acquiesce to their tyranny. Non acquiescence is, in my mind, the best bet for the velvet revolution that must happen.

Ronald Regan is absurdly given credit for bringing down the Soviet Union. The reality is that Russians brought down the Soviet Union, and did so through non acquiescence. I live in a community here in Los Angeles filled with Russian immigrants. Their practiced non acquiescence is readily apparent. They will smile at their oppressors and even thank them, then the moment that oppressor turn their back, they will flip them the bird and just keep doing what it is they're doing, and this is what brought down the Soviet Union, not some retired mediocre actor who paid impressive lip service to limited government, all the while expanding government.

Seems OWS has been hijacked by decent folks, but since the Op said he went in the morning, it's obvious the hippies were still fast asleep.
I'm sure those on the other side would also be pleasantly surprised if they attended a Tea Party.
If the two groups can meet somewhere in the middle that would be a force to be reckoned with.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


Yes, but imagine being under the thumb of a communist dictatorship with the power of the US military.

We may be under the thumb of government as far as regulation, taxation and expenditure are concerned. But dictatorship of that caliber does not yet exist here.

All the more reason to shrink government.

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by ParkerCramer

 

When these people are being used by communists and Socialists and big government advocates the answer is NO.

I am very careful about who I stand next to and why.

And no I DO NOT ACCEPT NOTIONS OF LEFTIST COLLECTIVIST IDEOLOGY. It seems everyone who is for leftism and collectivism hide behind the moniker of being "against the left/right paradigm" all while supporting leftist ideology.

No thanks.

You all talk about change...Change, change change...What change?

What do you actually want? Change is as meaningless when Obama spoke it as it is now coming from your typing fingers.

Define it. So we can all know where you stand.

edit on 15-10-2011 by projectvxn because: (no reason given)

Please read your post, and tell me that I have it wrong.........that you dont see things in left or right???

I could discuss this with your for days, and still never make as solid a case as you just did for me.

And, if you have the time please enlighten me as to how all these leftys got these crazy hippies, and communists and socialist together and spread this around the world, I mean it surely could not be because ot the sterling coverage by the MSM or your raving reviews.

Parker MTUBY

I took the liberty of posting this to my facebook

I hope that's okay but I thank you for going and reporting honestly and I think it needs to be shared

reply to post by ParkerCramer


No really. Tell everyone here where you stand as you preach to me about denying the "left/right paradigm". No really.

I'm sure it'll be a laundry list of leftist "Change".

You use the terms left/right paradigm as a way to make yourself seem morally superior while you support it with your words and actions.

I call your hypocrisy and raise you some honesty.

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by ParkerCramer

 

No really. Tell everyone here where you stand as you preach to me about denying the "left/right paradigm". No really.

I'm sure it'll be a laundry list of leftist "Change".

You use the terms left/right paradigm as a way to make yourself seem morally superior while you support it with your words and actions.

I call your hypocrisy and raise you some honesty.

see, thats the difference between you and I.................I see you as someone who is also fed up, but has been led to believe that it must be the other sides fault.

I am neither left or right................if I dont agree with someone it is because "I don't agree" not because they are left or right, pro choice/pro life, black/white, gay/straight.

do you see the difference, dont throw away the gift just because its wrapped in blue wrapping paper as opposed to red paper.

And, if you wouldn't mind pointing out even once where I have ever blamed everything on the left or the right.


We are all to blame for this sad state of affairs.

Parker
MTUBY

reply to post by ParkerCramer

JPZ...............wow. I usually agree with your writings, you have such a command of the english language, you seem to be the protector of the constitution, the braveheart of the little people. And, yet, you cannot see...........they may not be getting it right, but they are calling attention to the state of affairs in todays society.

I humbly thank you for your kind words. I would, however, like to see myself as the Braveheart of all people, not just Lilliputians.

A barking dog will call attention to their barking, but unless you understand that dog's needs, all that you will hear is a whole lot of barking.

The state of affairs in today's societies is not so because people cannot recognize it as so, it is so because they feel helpless and scared.

In my tireless efforts to protect and defend the natural rights of people, I do what I can to make clear to any individual that will listen that as an individual your power is infinitely more powerful than most can even imagine. Gandhi did not Protest, he refused to acquiesce. He amassed a following that did the same. This was not helplessness, it was power. Real power. Undeniable, undisputed power that brought one of the most powerful empires history has ever known to its knees. Gandhi did not protest, and only the narrow minded would imagine he was not afraid, but in spite of his fear, Gandhi did what was necessary to bring rightful sovereignty to his nation, and to the people who reside there.

you seem to be more comfortable with being the individual who screams there are not enough life jackets, we are all going to die, its our own fault, instead of the person who would suggest maybe two people can share a life vest so that no one has to go without.

Fortunately, things are rarely what they seem. I am more comfortable with advocating personal power than I am with advocating helplessness. Is this such a bad thing in your estimation?

what is your suggestion, yhat will draw this many participants, and garner this kind of attention that will help "us do what is necessary to reign in our out of control government"

In 1846, Henry David Thoreau wound up spending a night in jail because of his refusal to pay a poll tax. This refusal may be seen as "protest" if you like, but far beyond protest, it was the resolute action of one man. Did he protest? Sure, when he was released from jail because some son of a bitch went and paid his tax behind his back, Thoreau protested. Then he got busy and went about the business of writing Civil Disobediance. Years later Mahatma Gandhi would read this book, and it inspired him to action. This is the phenomenal power of just one individual who did far more than protest, but who acted, and how that personal power was felt many years after he died, and indeed, that power is palpable to this day.

As always its a pleasure speaking with you.

The pleasure is mine, brother.