Where's your Head at?

Hi folks...

It's been a while since I was seriously into ATS in terms of regular contributions. Hope this thread finds you well, and that you're enjoying life as much as possible in whichever circumstances you find yourself..

I've been in a somewhat philosophic state of mind over the past few months, which is in part the reason I've not been on the boards so much. I've had my worldview turned upside down approximately seven to the power three times since my last real thread, so this latest written escapade might seem a little different from my normal style (a good thing in many ways..)

I wanted to share a couple of observations I've made, and to invite comments on the same, and of course corrections/ additions too. Some of you will know a little about my Noospherical meanderings with others such as Timewalker, MisterMonculous, Frater 210, Jinglelord et al (sorry if I missed you off, brevity and time constraints apply here in no small measure..) I look forward to getting back into the swing of things with all concerned, plus as many new friends as possible in this virtual world of ours.

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This thread will hopefully serve as a place for me to put to rest the issues on my heart, many of which have troubled me immensely in recent times..

So - without further ado. Observation number 1...

The closer we observe the philosophical realities of Life, the Universe and Everything, the more prone to the risk of error in our perceptions we become.

Much like quantum physics, the observer has a crucial role in determining the outcome of the experiment. This will be 'old hat' to many of you, but to a relative youngster like myself, this came as a bolt from the blue after a chillaxing soak in the bath this evening.

The smaller the detail (eg - the position of a particle - or a point of theological doctrine), the more likely that our observation will result in a (possibly true, yet nonetheless) misleading conclusion. We may place too much emphasis on one aspect of a system of belief, and not enough on another. We may become obsessed with one particular way of looking at things (one way of 'conducting the experiment'), or we may lose contact with reality as we doggedly pursue 'our Truth'. I'm thinking of the stereotypical mad scientist, such as the dude in Lawnmower Man.

In quantum physics, the fact that all particles are in a sense superpositional, is a reality that I roughly grasp (without the math). In religion/ philosophy, issues of contrast between viewpoints - such as the perceived incompatibility of the Bible and Bhagavad Gita - can be rubbed out by the understanding that all paths hold some form of Truth, and in some divine sense have equal standing in the grand scheme of things.

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The above sounds a bit lame to my tired ears (if I had more time I could have brought a better analogy to the table) but the Truth seems to be that there is no division on the Path.

I suppose that Life could be described as our voyage across the cosmic oceans, traversing the dimensions of Space, navigating the dimensions of Time, making the most of the choices set before us at each moment (each moment itself is like an infinity when you get down to the 'nuts and bolts'....)

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CS Lewis had much to say about the similitude of various religions and philosophical viewpoints, and tomorrow I'll come back with a few quotes to bolster my attempt at trying to explain what it is that I'm actually trying to say. For now, please feel free to chime in with any thoughts or recent observations of your own. Look forward to hearing from you..

And it is impossible to live in the moment.

reply to post by FlyInTheOintment


Well now. The "nuts and bolts" of it.
I think there is much to add to, and little if any to subtract from, this perspective. It seems another ancient truth is stated once again, in a fresh and contemplative manner.

Welcome back from where ever it was you were.

...some nice thoughts there.
I particularly like the realisation that in any given experiment, the observer is in fact inside the experimental process, rather than objectively observing from the outside. That's significant, and important whenever we read anything, anywhere. When it comes to religion, it's one of the reasons why the Bible constantly reiterates the need to "test the spirits", to "test everything", and to subject everything to God's Word... in order to, as wholeheartedly and honestly as possible, eliminate that variable.

On the topic of all religions containing an element of truth... again, I have some agreement (though as you'll no doubt have noted above, I'm one of those scary fundamentalist people who believes in the inerrancy of the Bible)...

My feeling is that there is both, at once, a fundamental, objective Truth (capital T) and a whole series of relative observations of that Truth, which mankind has recorded in various scriptures, teachings and so on. Like a giant intercontinental game of Chinese Whispers, though, that Truth has become obfuscated, which is why we find mere elements of it in the majority of Scriptures, rather than the whole Truth.

My personal belief is that the Bible represents the whole counsel of God; that Christ, in both His divinity and manhood, is both the figure and the full representation of His Being; Truth made flesh. Call that an "element of truth" if you wish, place it alongside other scriptures and other religions... but I believe that this Christ, whom we as a people rejected, is the very incarnation of the Truth which always was, always is, and always will be; the Alpha and the Omega. And He who first spoke Truth in the beginning will close the book on it at the end...

and that time is very near.

Thanks for posting - there's some really great, really interesting concepts in there. And it certainly provoked my own thought processes!

reply to post by Stormdancer777


You say it is impossible to live in the moment, have you found a time machine then? Are you the only person on the planet to beable to achieve living any other time but now?

reply to post by Awen24


Thanks for the excellent additions - and for clarifying some of my core beliefs too!

I am also a Christian, but err on the side of caution in stating my principle beliefs - at least when introducing myself to others on th'interweb... I guess I must sound like I'm floating along believing everything and nothing at the same time ? I was quite tired when writing out the OP...


When I get kerfuddled in my daily walk, there's only one way I can turn, and that's ''to the Cross''.. However, I also believe that God reveals himself in a vast myriad of ways to those who don't follow that path.

One thing I remember coming back to in the past few months, time and again, is that we as individuals - or in our groupings - simply cannot attempt to put limitations on the grace of God. We literally cannot fathom the immense love of the Almighty, and all that we have (consciousness included) comes from Him, so in some way or other we serve. If we did not, the rocks would cry out, so to speak...


NB - Please don't think I'm attempting a preachy thing here; just felt like it might be worth typing out for someone else to read at some point..


PS - I believe the phrasing you chose re: obfuscation is most enlightened.

reply to post by Stormdancer777


I think if we were able to truly 'live in the moment', we would transcend time itself.

reply to post by FlyInTheOintment


You say that all paths hold some form of Truth...... that's not lame at all for me at least
As I see it, there isn't only one "truth", like a theory of everything, which they will never find simply because there are many truths or correct answers for the same problem.
Sound crazy?.... maybe today.... but tomorrow?..... we will see.
Hence, as you say, we can become too obsessed with one few point, when there are many valid view points that can differ greatly.
Well, I believe we are on some sort of cosmic voyage but........ in space..........which way is up?

reply to post by FlyInTheOintment


To transend time all that is needed is to realize the truth.
The head is in time, the mind, the thoughts. The body is here in the present moment always. The spirit is the present moment, presence.
It is thought that makes time, it can only imagine another time. It is always now really.
When another time is imagined all sorts of stories are then believed in.
The head is juggling the past and the future stories but always in the present moment.

Originally posted by FlyInTheOintment
The above sounds a bit lame to my tired ears (if I had more time I could have brought a better analogy to the table) but the Truth seems to be that there is no division on the Path.

As far as analogies go:

Say not, "I have found the path of the soul." Say rather, "I have met the soul walking upon my path." For the soul walks upon all paths. The soul walks not upon a line, neither does it grow like a reed. The soul unfolds itself like a lotus of countless petals.
- Kahlil Gibran

It doesn't matter how pretty you say it... the truth is still there

Great thread. I really enjoyed reading it and I unfortunately don't have much to add, but I do look forward to reading more of your posts in the future. S&F

reply to post by dyllels


I read something related to the Celestine Prophecy a few days after your comments (just this minute saw your post) suggesting that the soul's journey is not 'walking a path' so much, but rather is more like a 'meandering' upon many interconnected pathways. I suppose we also have a tendency to drift off and tread the myriad 'fields of dreams' that arise in between the established routes..

Thank you for the wisdom and kind words.. Funny how these coincidences in thoughts and words arise, even in a virtual approximation of our global habitat..!! Equally, I look forward to hearing more from your good self.