IHOP Shooting: Multiple People Reportedly Shot In Carson City, Nevada

Originally posted by IlluminatusOculus33
Gives a new meaning to the name I-Hop am I right?

In all seriousness though they should ban guns. No guns = no gun violence. Keeps the crazies from owning weapons.

edit on 6-9-2011 by IlluminatusOculus33 because: (no reason given)

Yeah, right. Then the only ones with guns will be the criminals, who do not register guns anyway. What will you do when an armed man breaks into your home and holds a gun on you and your family? Besides, guns do not kill people! People kill people.

I am really suprised that ATS is not all over this story.

Where did the guy get a fully automatic AK-47?

Why did he target people in military uniforms?

Is he an illegal immigrant?

These are the kind of questions ATS members usually ask and find the answers for, but today members seem to be slow or distracted by garbage. Maybe it will pick up tommorow hopefully.

Agreed entirely Mike, I myself am very curious to know if he is an illegal.

One of my possible theories is that he targeted the Nevada National Guard troops because the Nevada National Guard had sent troops to assist the Arizona National Guard along the border in 2006. National Guard troops from 40 states and territories served along the Mexican border between 2006 and 2008.
www.8newsnow.com...
news article about the Nevada National Guard on the border.

Why does this crap have to happen in my backyard!?

I just heard about this a day or so ago and ha not had the chance to get any details. My wife has family in Carson City, and i have many friends in the NNG.. This is certainly a sad story.

On the note of banning guns, don't try that crap in Nevada, we like our freedom here.

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
Where did the guy get a fully automatic AK-47?

Why did he target people in military uniforms?

Is he an illegal immigrant?

At the time of the last press conference, they were still trying to determine if the AK-47 variant he had was semi, or fully, auto according to the FBI's supervisory special agent. He had multiple 30 round clips, and there was also another "assault rifle" and handgun in the mini-van he arrived in, which was registered to his brother.

He was born in Mexico, and was here under a U.S. Passport.

While some live reports I saw indicated that he went to the back of the IHOP where the guardsmen were sitting before he started firing, they were being very careful in their wording during the press conference.

No "outside sources" had yet indicated that he specifically entered with them "targeted", and they basically need to establish "motive" before they can say anything of the sort.

[snip]

reply to post by lernmore


The local authorities had indicated it was automatic and so did eye witnesses. The owner of a BBQ place next door confirmed the guy burnt through an entire magazine in about 12 seconds.

I'm betting its not an actual AK-47, but some cheap Norinco, Czech or Romanian copy.

Regardless of the type of weapon, a big question is where did he get it. The guy was unemployed and bankrupt, how did he pay for the weapons. Were they even his, considering the van belonged to a relative.

Lots of unanswered questions.

Your video answered one question:

He was not an American citizen, he was supposedly in the US on a passport according to the Sheriff.

Why is the media not making a bigger deal of that? A foreign citizen killed multiple US citizens, including uniformed military personnel, on US soil.

The MSM is completely full of crap.

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
The local authorities had indicated it was automatic and so did eye witnesses. The owner of a BBQ place next door confirmed the guy burnt through an entire magazine in about 12 seconds.

I'm betting its not an actual AK-47, but some cheap Norinco, Czech or Romanian copy.

I hear ya...

Hand me the weapon and a full clip, and I can tell you for certain in about 1 second, but for now I can only parrot what I heard straight from the FBI agent's mouth... which is that they were still trying to determine whether it was auto or not (according to him). I'm sure that info will come to light soon enough.

Without any way in the world to be certain, I, like you, have no way of knowing for sure yet.

I uploaded the video trying to answer a couple specific questions you had, so keep asking, it's the only way we get answers. I couldn't really supply a "link" because there isn't one.

Remember also, that earlier rumors were flying around that he was dating a woman who worked at the IHOP, right here in this very thread even. That turned out to be untrue, and also supposedly came from an "eyewitness" who was on the scene after the shooting had taken place. I first heard that one on the local news.

Of course, the question of money doesn't really seem that relevant to me because many people, like myself, have had guns and ammo around the house for years and years. It's not like he pulled out a wad of cash at the "assault-mart" on his way to the pancake house.

Unfortunately, when crap like this happens, many times the answers never do come. For us, it's one thing, but for the families of the victims it's multiplied by millions I'm sure.

Anything else comes across the feeds and I'll be sure to post it.

Edit to add:

Even the authorities had the numbers all wrong when they held the first press conference. My first post in the thread, I basically repeated verbatim what the guy behind the microphones was saying. That has since changed from 9 victims and the shooter to 11 victims and the shooter for a total of 12.

The number of NNG also went from 2, to 4, to 5 etc... and that came from the sheriff, not the newscasters.

Eduardo Sencion, 32 and a local resident, has been ID'ed as the shooter.

news.yahoo.com...
Carson City Sheriff Kenny Furlong says the man was 32-year-old Eduardo Sencion of Carson City. He says Sencion worked at a family business in South Lake Tahoe, was not in the military, and had no known affiliations with anyone inside the restaurant.

An empty 30-round gun magazine and two other gun magazines were recovered. (So it appears about 30 rounds total were fired.)

Two of the dead and five of the wounded were wearing national guard uniforms, raising the question of whether hw as targeting military.

www.foxnews.com...
Aside from the AK-47 rifle used in the attack, authorities say they found a pistol and another rifle in the minivan Sencion left in the parking lot. ...Family members say Sencion had mental issues. ...Local and state police and FBI agents descended on the scene

www.dailymail.co.uk...
Sheriff Furlong said there were concerns at the outset that the gunman was not working alone
(What information did they have to that effect?)
At least 11 agencies, both federal and state, are working the scene.....
(When the feds rush to get involved, it's a red flag for a possible covert op.)


Court documents from a bankruptcy filing from 2009 shows he was getting $923 a month in disability income, mostly from Social Security.

My profile of the perp:

--He probably lived alone or had become estranged from his family.

--He was suffering extreme financial stress at the time, possibly having been separated from the service within the last two years.

--Friends may notice abrupt changes in mood in the days and weeks before the shooting.  He may have complained that lately he has experienced strange and vivid dreams of a violent nature.

--He will be dressed in all black and/or camoflage. 

--Eyewitnesses at the scene will say the shooter was 'like a robot,' or that there were a totally blank expression on his face.

--The media will paint him as a loner, but he will in fact have a circle of friends or be part of a clique.

--Extra ammo/guns/bombs will be found at his home and in his auto(this to 'close the circle' of guilt in the public's mind).  The guns will have been legally acquired by the shooter or a close relative/neighbor.   He will have brought an excessive quantity of ammunition to the scene. 

--He will be computer-savvy, and likely left an online presence.   He may have left some kind of manifesto, though it will be incomprehensible/nonsensical for the most part.  He will have hinted at what he had planned, but the name of the target itself will not be mentioned. 

--He will probably have been a player of violent video games, and will have been a fan of violence-themed movies.  He will have produced his own videos in which he is seen with his weapons or expressing his hatred and/or violence.

--He will have a strong interest in weapons--guns, knives, swords, bombs--or the military. 

--He will have had contact with a military recruiter or he will have spent some time in the military before being seperated under murky circumstances.

--He will have been mentally "treated" at some point by a counselor, psychologist, or a psychiatrist. 

--He will have a history of taking SSRIs(selective seritonin reuptake inhibitors).

--There is some likelihood that he was institutionalized or hospitalized at some point before the attack.  At any rate there will gaps in the timeline where police cannot account for his whereabouts.

--He probably had some contact with the police/law enforcement before the shooting.

--If he survived the assault, he will be unable to explain why he did what he did.  He may claim that 'voices' in his head told him to do it.  Or he may not even remember the act at all.   But whether the shooter lives or dies, motive will always remain a mystery.

Wow, description of half of US citizens.

somthing about this really has me on edge... who knows this could be the beginning of a major false flag attack? idk but i am gonna be cautious for little bit.

hair is standing up
doesn't sit right w/me

www.rgj.com...|breaking|text|FRONTPAGE
They said the van and the AK-47 rifle used in the shootings were registered to Sencion’s brother.
Furlong also says after the gunman exited the IHOP, he got into a vehicle and drove around in circles, shooting at nearby businesses.
(photos of the scene show bullet holes in the rear window of the van, possibly indicating it was the police that shot him to death,) ...
The suspect was wearing a red shirt and long black pants

from comments section:
"what about the shooter and i heard on the scanner there were possibly more than one"

Originally posted by IlluminatusOculus33
Gives a new meaning to the name I-Hop am I right?

In all seriousness though they should ban guns. No guns = no gun violence. Keeps the crazies from owning weapons.

edit on 6-9-2011 by IlluminatusOculus33 because: (no reason given)

Yeah like banning drugs has kept the druggies from getting drugs, and banning alcohol kept people from drinking.... Oh wait...

If you live in a society where someone can legally own an assault rifle, like the AK-47, then don't be surprised when people with personal problems - or who are just pissed off in general - go on a rampage shooting people indiscriminately.

These spree killings and rampage killings are hardly a rarity in the US, so I'm surprised they even still make the news over there. I'm sure the penny will eventually drop...

reply to post by starviego


Thanks for that link, the article had tons of new info.

His brother lied to authorities at first, as did other members of his business. There seems to be a number of mysteries about this brothers business. He also doesn't seem that upset by the shooting.

I would like to know why he had a fully automatic AK-47 and why he lied at first to the police about his identity and his business.

Something stinks here.

The wording that the sheriff used in the video I posted earlier was a bit confusing, and didn't exactly make it clear that he was a U.S. citizen. That wording was something to the effect of "He was born in Mexico, and is here under a U.S. passport.", which almost made it sound as if he's merely visiting.

I started wondering how he could be here "under a U.S. passport", so I looked a little closer and the following external text clears it up a bit. He is a U.S. citizen, who has a U.S. passport, and also a valid drivers license with an address out of Carson City.

MikeboydUS may want to go update the thread he created to reflect the facts. I also haven't come across any official confirmation yet that the AK-47 variant was indeed fully automatic. It may be the case, certainly, and I'm sure that info will emerge sometime this morning. Until then, however, it's probably best not to state, as fact, that it is.

I didn't spend 45 minutes converting and uploading the video of the press conference so we could all get it wrong. (He was also asked in the video about the auto,semi-auto issue and the results weren't in yet)

Carson City officials said the Mexican native held a U.S. passport, which means he was a citizen. He had been issued a Nevada commercial driver’s license 14 months ago, but he held a Nevada state identification card since 1998, state records show.

Tex t is from page 6 of this link

Agreed, something doesent add up here.

1) never mind this part. He was a US citizen of Mexican descent (born in Mexico, immigrated to the US in the late 1990s).

2) How did he get his rifle? Now I don't know how things work out in Nevada but here in New York one can purchase a rifle or shotgun without a permit but they DO need a background check. Also no reputable seller will sell to someone who looks like the elevator does not go all the way to the top. Was it brought at a legitimate gun store or did he get it off the black market?

3) What gave the Carson City Sheriff's Office the impression that there were multiple shooters?

4) Last but not least, why did he target the Nevada National Guard troops?

These are all questions that the media seem to be ignoring, and it just makes me suspicious.

Such an incident is indeed sad to read about and while other ATS threads are focusing on the fact that the shooter was a Mexican on a passport, that does not bother me as much as the postings and reply's about if no one had guns, no violence would occur.

This last point bothers me because it shows me that the poster to such a remark does not understand in anyway what we should be concerned with instead of Guns for the sake of just Gun talk and how bad and evil guns are.

To add to this discussion I am going to relate a short story about guns that I feel explains why I am so angered by some of the more callous remarks regarding gun ownership.

About 8 yrs ago I worked in a large fortune 500 company that I will not name. I worked in security and worked in a communications control center with about 12 other employees. Some of those workers were very senior and older adults. Some had been in WWII and while at times the room would be about wars and combat, there was on older employee that was Jewish and very proud of it.

This Jewish employee would always interject his dislike for any guns and stated if he had his way, all guns would be banned because of course he had to mention to solidify his remarks that his entire family was killed by guns at the hands of the Nazi's during WWII. While he was much younger than his parents who were killed along with his brothers, this man eventually ended up in a concentration camp for Jews.

While I never would argue or berate anyone for their opinion about guns, one day I found this type of logic to be too much to ignore, so I had to confront this elderly man and engage in a conversation about all he was concerned about and why he hated guns so much.

When he emotionally informed me that he hated guns because the Nazi's had used guns to kill his family members I stopped him and asked him a question.

I asked how did he eventually get released from the Nazi concentration camp? He quickly stated that once the American military and others finally invaded France and made their way into Europe and finally Germany, he stated so casually that one day, the American military freed them from their prison environment.

I then asked him did they have guns? He looked at me and said yes they did. Then I asked him did not those military forces fight the Nazi's with guns and did not those American forces not use guns to free the Jewish prisoners? He stated yes.

This is when I stated that it was not guns that he should be afraid of, but those that use guns to do evil things.

I reminded him that guns and lots of them were used to liberate Europe and the Jews in camps.

Well at this point of the conversation I politely stated that his rationale for being opposed to guns was flawed, because by his own admission, he admitted that American forces using guns liberated him and many other Jews and that it was because of those guns used by the military that he today was still alive to complain about guns in the indiscriminate way he spoke about guns being so evil and that no one should be allowed to own them.

While I knew I had touched a nerve when he got belligerent with me was when he immediately resorted to calling me anti-Semitic.

I was stunned but I said OK, you want to play that game, here is what I will do if you do something for me.

I stated to him that if he will prove his is Semitic that I would consider apologizing to him for whatever he thought I said that was anti-Semitic. He stared at me with a hateful look and walked off.

From that day forth he never proved he was Semitic and I never apologized for being anti-Semitic because well, I didn't think what I stated regarding guns had anything to do with antisemitism.

I mention this story from my personal life to make a point.

No gun is evil just because it is a gun. The evil is in the person that uses such a gun to do evil things.

I guess my logic over the Armed forces using guns to liberate Germany and those in camps did not sit well with this elder Jewish man, but from that day forth he never argued guns while I was in the room and many other employees knew that the only time he got razzed about guns and said so was when I was not at work.

I had made my point and had thrown a challenge to someone who resorted to claims of antisemitism when he knew he could no longer support his premise in the manner that he could before I got hired and pointed out to him the error of his emotionally impaired logic.

Instead of admitting that guns don't kill people and that People kill people, he instead clung to his faulty logic and continued to berate guns and would always say that the world would be better without guns. Then I would remind him as I would always that Guns don't kill people. People kill people.

Thanks for the thread and lets hope that all the "ban the guns" jargon gets understood for what it is. Faulty logic, because as I have stated, guns don't kill people, people kill people.

Thanks for the thread.

reply to post by IlluminatusOculus33


I don't buy that, true in the beginning all the idiots will pretty much eliminate themselves, but afterword do you think that anyone would want to start a fight knowing that everyone around them has a gun? An armed society is a polite society.

There is a rather impressive amount of control going into this story. More information came out about the shooting ON a military base than this one.

The deceased victims have been identified:


Florence Donovan-Gunderson, 67

Major Heath Kelly, 35

Sgt. 1st Class Miranda McElhiney, 31

Sgt. 1st Class Christian Riege, 38

in addition to the alleged shooter Eduardo Sencion, 32


The names of the wounded have not yet been released.