Tea Party the cause of debt default.

reply to post by MrXYZ


Bravo!

One of my favorite George Carlin truisms. Simply TRUE. Amerika, home of the slaves, land of TPTB.

Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by Russh50

 

Try being in your twenties in this day and age and see how easy it is to find a good job you can go and make a living in. It's not easy, even with an education.

Just do some damn homework and research and study WHAT happened and why and then you will see the answer to it all!!

discharge-debt.com...

Privileges granted by the sovereign (governments) in their capacity to license (condone) what might otherwise be illegal are always taxable and regulatable. Rights such as those envisioned by the founding fathers are not taxable or regulatable because they are exercises of the common right that could be completely destroyed by government through taxation and/or regulation. These are maxims of law so well established that they are irrefutable. For example, look to Frost & Frost Trucking v. Railroad Commission of California, 271 U.S. 583, 70 L.Ed. 1101 (1925).

AND...

The privileges and immunities [civil rights] of the 14th Amendment citizens were derived [taken] from....the Constitution, but are not identical to those referred to in Article IV, sect. 2 of the Constitution [which recognizes the existence of state Citizens who were not citizens of the United States because there was no such animal in 1787]. Plainly spoken, RIGHTS considered to be grants from our creator are clearly different from the "civil rights" that were granted by Congress to its own brand of franchised citizen in the 14th Amendment.

How state Citizens were converted into federal citizens;
In order for the federal government to tax a Citizen of one of the several states, it had to create some sort of contractual nexus. This contractual nexus is the Social Security Number (SSN).
In 1935, the federal government instituted Social Security. The Social Security Board then created 10 Social Security "Districts." The combination of these "Districts" resulted in a "Federal Area", a fictional jurisdiction, which covered all of the several states like a clear plastic overlay.
In 1939, the federal government instituted the "Public Salary Tax Act of 1939." This Act is a municipal law of the District of Columbia for taxing all federal government employees and those who live and work in any "Federal Area." Now the government knows it cannot tax those state Citizens who live and work outside the territorial jurisdiction of Article 1, Section 8, Clause 2 in the Constitution for the United States of America; also known as the ten square miles of the District of Columbia and territories and enclaves. So, in 1940, Congress passed the "Buck Act" now found in 4 U.S.C. Sections 105-113. In Section 110(e), this Act authorized any department of the federal government to create a "Federal Area" for imposition of the "Public Salary Tax Act of 1939." This tax is imposed at 4 U.S.C. Section 111. The rest of the taxing law is found in the Internal Revenue Code. The Social Security Board had already created a "Federal Area" overlay. U.S.C. Title 4 is as follows:
Sec. 110(d): The term "State" includes any territory or possession of the United States.
Sec. 110(e): The term "Federal Area" means any lands or premises held or acquired by or for the use of the United states or any department, establishment, or agency of the United states; and any federal area, or any part thereof, which is located within the exterior boundaries of any State, shall be deemed to be a federal area located within such State.

Read the entire paper and get it, then you will know what to do!!

TPTB's are falling all over the world, and I see no reason why it can't happen here, it's time to clean house, by any means nesessary ..... I believe thats how Malcom X said it!

Originally posted by shtf2012
Yes thats right the Tea Party is to blame for all this mess.
Or....is that what they want you to believe.
After enduring the sanity depriving media blitz.
Thinking right, then left, sitting on the fence then falling off.
I am beginning to believe that the good old boys are in fact scared to death of the Tea Party.
That in fact if we do default, it is a false flag event to discredit the Tea Party.
You see the Tea Party while being under the guise of the Republican party.
Could become a third independent party unto it self very easily.
This is what has them shaking in their boots.
We have seen a number of mainstream Republicans latch on to the Tea Party.
I think in an attempt to corrupt it.
But it's not working.
While for me the Tea Party leans a little too far to the right.
I have been trying to think objectively about this.
Thinking of the debt crisis in this way is the only way it makes sense.
What do you think?

We had no deficit, for the first time american history, thanks to Bill Clinton -and the right hated him for it. I didn't get why at the time. They villainzied him for getting oral sex in the oval office. If anyone could eliminate our deficit now, *I'D* give them oral sex. As far as I'm concerned, the man earned it.

Bush came into office and suddenly whined that we were a "surplus economy" and mailed millions of people checks. Then the day before 9/11, Rumsfeld got on tv and explained that 1.3 trillion dollars had suddenly vanaished overnight at the pentagon and gosh they were really sorry. The next day, an invisible plane smashed into the very wing of the pentagon wherein the financial records were maintained. After 9/11, Bush poured hundreds of billions every other week into the war. After a few months, we heard that haliburton had "misplaced" billions earmarked for the military and kept no records because all that 'red tape" mumbo jumbo would just get in the way of helping the money quickly to our troops. Some time after that, we heard our troops had serious ammo and body armor supply issues. The billions kept going out. Bush announced that too many hardworkin' 'mericans couldn't get home loans cuzza all that fine print! The banks obliged, and we had the housing crash.

Then Obama came into Office.

Day one, republican-backed corporations like chase, bank of america and gm arrived, via private jet, with hands outstretched claiming poverty. They were the pillars of our financial society, they said, too big to be allowed to fail. Republicans screamed, "what's he going to do about it!!" So, he gave them the money. then the republcians screamed, "oh noes, he bailed them out!" The right wing media blitzed us for weeks and months about the bailouts. Then more companies said, "we're going to fail." So now, harped on by the media, he let them fail. That's when the republicans cried, "Oh noes, he let them fail!" He was a socialist. Then a terrorist. He became a communist, a kenyan and illiterate fool who didn't know the consitution (albeit he taught constitutional law and those accusing him couldn't properly cite the constitution during midterm debates). Worst of all, he tried to make sure poor people could get healthcare and non-poor people could be allowed to pay for their own health insurance despite loopholes like pre-existing conditions. That's when the Tea Party suddenly manifested.

The TEA party, standing for Taxed Enough Already, was to stand up for the common man, demanding "jobs, jobs, jobs," and the reduction and elimination of much of our wasteful taxes. Democrats were labelled "tax and spend" liberals. however, under GOP and TEA plans, it seems the republicans are "Tax and keep for themselves" conservatives. You see, you pay taxes and you get it back in the form of services, roads, programs and protections. But these are now considered an "unfair sense of entitlement." Those taxes, it seems, also go in large multi-billion dollar packages to billionaire and trillionaire oil companies and their ilk. They, it would seem, are perfectly entitled to it. The GOP and TEA have no trouble at all with YOUR taxes being SPENT so long as its on their rich buddies, and every shred of their legislation up to and including their spending cap bills, have reflected just that. Oh they don't say it. Boner cries and Ryan sighs and someone plays glory glory hallelujah in the background, but what they DO is quite another thing. We won't even get into defense spending, which rivals social security, which the republicans haven't yet deemed worthy of cuts despite the "oh my god we're gonna all die" dire situation we are in (thanks to them). After all, not a penny of that gets wasted. Like the news article a few months back explaining how the entire Naval fleet is being outfitted with LASER weapons to shoot down nuclear missiles, even though we're in 2 wars with desert countries that hdie madeshift bombs under soda cans. Yep, not a bit going to waste.

Are the dems angels? of course not. But I haven't seen the extreme depth of corruption and insidious plans that the republicans so gleefully push every day, and have since Bush day 1. The average American is not politically savvy, they get whatever little political info they get from a smattering of tv news, sadly FOX news much of the time. I've asked many people how they feel about Obama. many say, "disappointed." I know the media has hammered that idea into their heads, on every channel. So, I aks them, WHAT specifically disappointed you? They don't know. God's honest truth, they look at me blanky. They just don't have an opinion of their own. I'm sure some of you know. I myself am disappointed now and then with him. I'd like him to fight back harder, I disagree with certain things he's let slide, approved or outright authored. But I also liked many of the things he's done. And frankly, I KNOW what I like and dislike, and so do you. TV news does not gift me with an opinion. I have my own. But I don't seem to see much of that in the rank and file american. the tv said so, that's good enough for them. Are they reading between the lines when the republicans make promises of personal freedoms and then try to have the government tell you who you can marry? Or when they say spending must be cut and ONLY seem to want to cut what's spent on YOU? Can they see that the great movement of privatization is really a way to profit off all of your taxes and ensure you get little in return? Do they realize that waterboarding someone 700 times, terrorizing them with attack dogs while naked in the middle of the night, running them into captivity with black hoods on, are all brainwashing techniques and not interrogation techniques? I don't even think they realize that foods they buy with "soluble fiber" in the ingredient list contain 'wood pulp," honestly. The dumbing down of education is complete, and we have a society of fat fools who get their opinion from tv.

Are the GOP afraid of the TEA party? Not a bit. They're hard to control all the time, but they still give them the seats they need for control -which is all they were ever after in the first place.

You asked what I thought. Now you know

Originally posted by EmVeeFF
reply to post by shtf2012

 

A third party is really the only conformist hope we have to change the govt. direction, but I'm not really sure how that would play out considering how elections have been run the last few decades...

Very bloody good question.

In order for a 'Tea Party' political party to emerge, the Republican party would have to be dissolved. Its a conundrum. 50% to 60% of the population does not vote in any elections.

Optimistic Estimates Only
22.5% of the voters would vote for a Republican Candidate. (Republican Voters)
22.5% of the voters would vote for a Tea-Party Candidate. (Republican Voters)
45% of the voters would reelect Pres. Obama. (Democrat Voters)
10% of the voters would vote for Independent Candidate. (Independent Voters)

Obama wins automatically by a Republican split.

'Tea Party' would never be able to emerge. Unless they can magically swing Democrat, Independents, Republicans, and new voters, the 'Tea Party' would never make it into the system.

Link: This Man Caused The Republicans to Lose in 1992

The Tea Party is full of NaziConservatives pretending to be real Americans. Along the way it has sopped up like stale bread dipped in soup, Americans who REALLY don't know any better. I mean, if you really think the Tea Party is all about Gov spending you really must be nuts! I'd be in the Tea Party if it really was all about the founding principles of the U.S. But what you have is a Ultra-Conservative offshoot of the Republican party who were sick of them not being as far right as as can be! Why do think Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity and all of the other talk radio wackos claim to Tea Partier "real Americans"?

reply to post by shtf2012
I suppose it is to be expected that dweebs, clerks and immoral trash would sling every lie and slur at people who stand loyal to our Constitution, to their faith in God and conviction that evil can't stand the light of day. However, contrary to all your fears, nothing the Tea Party or the Silent Majority who won't step forward until the conflicts come up close and personal...nothing is going to stop what has begun and if you think raising the debt limit is going to save your tattoos and lives built upon the Boob-Tube and Self Indulgence...well, just wait a little while longer as the worst has yet begun.

reply to post by Jigore

They are pissed off about a lot of things just like America is they have not sold out yet like the other reps and dems they are for less taxes smaller gov and less entitlements mostly

Both hands are controlled by the same head, both hands are to be blamed, even the tea they hold in the hands.

The Tea Party along with the right winger conservatives are funded by the wealthy to do their bidding.

They and the right wing conservatives are doing the battle for the wealthy of this country at the expense of the working class Americans, the soldiers, our teachers, public schools, the disabled, and the retired.

They wish to eliminate EVERYTHING from the middle class and put it all into the POCKETS of the WEALTHY, PERIOD.

The BUMS must be stopped before we have NOTHING LEFT PEOPLE!!!!

Originally posted by shtf2012
Yes thats right the Tea Party is to blame for all this mess.
Or....is that what they want you to believe.

uh... not sure of the reasoning behind this thread... but here's the facts about what is happening:


Democrats wanted to balance the budget and start reducing the deficit, however, they wanted tax increases on the rich and corporations to be part of the plan to pay it off.

Republicans also wanted to balance the budget and start reducing the deficit, however, they wanted only spending reductions and no taxes increases to pay it off. Both sides also had some different ideas about what should be cut.


Because of the realization of how terrible the outcome would be for the American economy if a compromise on the debt was not reached in time, many congressional members, including democrats and republicans, recently decided on a compromise on a budget that would make trillions dollars in cuts, while raising the debt ceiling by that amount or less.

This would begin to balance the budget to begin paying off the debt, and it would raise the debt ceiling enough to give us enough money to cover our current bills until there is a surplus in the budget to do so. It would be an important step in the right direction and allow America to maintain its AAA credit rating. Furthermore, now that it has been brought into the public forum, discussions on how to further decrease the debt could continue in a non-crisis atmosphere.

However, there is one thing keeping this from happening.


This is where the tea party comes in.


First of all, the tea party represents a small percentage of total Americans, however, because of their passionate state of mind compared to most American citizens, they made up a very large portion of the total amount of voters in the last election. This is why so many congressional members are afraid of them. Proportionally, They have a very large political voice.

For this reason, many Republicans, who would otherwise have compromised with the democrats on the deficit by now, are siding with the tea partiers. This is because they are afraid of angering that voter base, and costing themselves the congressional election in 2014.

What the tea partiers want, rather than a reasonable budget that begins to pay off the debt, are drastic and sudden changes in the way the American government functions economically. They want the US government to not engage in any debt spending at all, as well as decrease its size substantially. This is exemplified by their demand of a constitutional amendment that would not allow the government to engage in any debt spending at all. In a world where credit cards, mortgages, and other forms of credit are a vital part of how the world works, this could effectively cripple the united states government.


Now to the conclusion: why the tea party is being accused of holding the American economy hostage.

They tea party knows that they do not have even close to a majority in the house or senate, and the majority of Americans do not support their views, and thus in a normal situation, they would never have enough political power to make their budget ideas a reality. However, they do know that they have enough political power to keep someone else's budget ideas from going through. Currently the financial crisis cannot be averted until a budget agreement occurs. So the tea party is capitalizing on their ability to allow financial Armageddon to happen in order to get their way.

So yes, the tea party is holding the American economy hostage.


There are now three ways that the budget crisis could get resolved:

One: All of the members of Congress who are not members of the tea party get together and decide (in spite of the tea party) to pass a sensible budget bill that begins the process of paying back the debt. This would stave off an economic emergency and the US would likely maintain its AAA credit rating. Furthermore, this would allow for more discussion about responsible spending in Washington to continue into the future without the looming threat of economic collapse. The problem with this, however, is that assuming the tea party continues to have as much power as they did in the last election, most of the non teaparty Republican members of Congress would lose their jobs in their next election.

Two: The tea party, instead of continuing to threaten to allow an economic collapse to happen if they don't get their way, agree to come to the negotiating table and compromise in order to pass a bill to save the US economy. Because of the fact that a default would in fact give them much of what they were asking for in the first place, which is the greatly diminished role of the US government, this scenario is very slim. One reason that they might decide to come to the negotiating table at the last minute is because the detrimental state of the US economy that would negatively affect them as well. Another reason that they would compromise is if more and more people realize what the tea party is doing and they are forced to compromise due to public backlash against them.

Three: the tea party refuses to compromise, and the rest of the members of Congress have no choice but to side with the tea party and pass their budget ideas in order to stave of economic crisis. Many of the results of this would be unknown, as many new budget regulations and cuts would go in to place that are impossible to predict the outcome of. For example, the constitutional amendment that does not allow debt spending by the government would mean that every year, if the government did not have enough money from taxes to pay its bills, rather than temporarily borrow money in order to do so, some things would just not be paid for. One definite result of this scenario would be a hugely diminished role of the US government, both nationally and internationally, effectively creating a nation ruled much more by private corporate interests rather than government. This scenario would also be unethical, as the majority of Americans do not agree with the tea party's views.

The alternative is that none of the parties come to any compromise, and the United States of America is proven to be unable to function adequately enough to even pay its bills. The consequences of this would be catastrophic.

In conclusion, if it wasn't for the tea party, all of this would not be happening right now, and a budget would have already been decided on days ago. So yeah, the tea party is holding the US economy hostage, despite the wishes of the American people, who overwhelmingly support a compromise on the budget before financial armageddon.


On a lighter note, the tea party did accomplish one one good thing, which was to publicly point out the fact that the government was spending way too much. They have now, however, taken it way too far.

No one side is guilty.

ALL of them are guilty. They have failed our Country and should ALL be voted out. EVERY SINGLE ONE.
Government FAIL to the nth degree.

All sides look pathetic and truly selfish. All they want is to 'look good'. And they will cause the default
because of one thing. EGO.

Pathetic.

reply to post by sevensheeps

Corporations OWN the USA and they OWN the congress and the presidency..the TeaBaggers are OWNED by these same people who want to crush the middle class into submission,we have only ourselves to blame for this.

Give it a year or 2 and there will be a bounty on TeaBaggers I hope.

There is a difference between the Right and the "Religious Right". The Tea Party is not religious. They simply feel the need to reign in government spending. I for one applaud their effort. I do not believe they are trying to create a third party, simply trying to get Republicans to do what is fiscally sound.

Food Stamps

Medicaid

Welfare

Illegal Immigrants


Expenses none of us can afford, nor should we. Cut these expenses, make it illegal for ILLEGALS (not undocumented, unauthorized or any other liberal term for it) - Yes, ILLEGALS from receiving government benefits and that will be a start. Arrest them, send them home. They are in fact criminals according to US law.

Next strip congress of all powers to provide themselves the lifelong benefits they have so kindly voted for themselves.

The Tea Party only wants to cut government spending/over spending. What is so wrong with that???????

We don't need to raise the debt limit, start cutting spending. That is their message. No new taxes, cut spending! Again, what is wrong with that?

I don't think the Tea Party needs to be vilified - they are only trying to reduce the size of government, the execssive spending, and lifelong "beneifts (ha)" for those that are not deserving.

This is not some grand plan - nor is it some way to take over the republican party. The Tea Party simply wants to cut unnecessary liberal government programs. And by doing that they hope to balance the budget and slowly bring us out of the abyss the liberals have put us all in. They are in a struggle with long serving Republican members because those Republican members are serving their own interests, not those of the people.

Personally, I don't care what it takes - just reduce the size of government. If a third party accomplishes that - I'm all for it.

reply to post by MikeNitro94


I didn't realize that the padded rooms had internet access. Thanks - learn something new everyday.

reply to post by Lurkers


I'm curious - do you own your business - or do you work for the "evil corporation"

"Evil Corporations" are what is paying the taxes in the country, from the top down to the employee.

You want to get rid of the "evil corporation" - then people will have no jobs (yes, even less than now) and there will be no tax money to pay for all the welfare benefits.

Unless you would like to take care of that for all of us.

reply to post by shtf2012


I am an independent but lean heavily conservative.

that being said, I really have to wonder about the repubs when Ron Paul wont give it a green light.

That (to me) is a red flag.

They are all in it together.

Dutch guy, I agree with you. From top to bottom, too many have used too much credit.

My wife and I were given clearance for 160k loan on a house about 8 years ago. We went and saw some REALLY nice digs!

Then we thought, "hey, if something goes tits up, what then?". We found a 80k house that was older but nice.

damn good thing we did. Things DID go tits up. Damn near lost it all. Foresight saved us.

We knew we could keep thing afloat with one check and we did (barely).

If everyone lived like this, 3/4 of the BS going on (DC included) wouldnt be happening.

live within your means and "dont get above your raisin' "

Originally posted by shtf2012
Yes thats right the Tea Party is to blame for all this mess.
Or....is that what they want you to believe.
After enduring the sanity depriving media blitz.
Thinking right, then left, sitting on the fence then falling off.
I am beginning to believe that the good old boys are in fact scared to death of the Tea Party.
That in fact if we do default, it is a false flag event to discredit the Tea Party.
You see the Tea Party while being under the guise of the Republican party.
Could become a third independent party unto it self very easily.
This is what has them shaking in their boots.
We have seen a number of mainstream Republicans latch on to the Tea Party.
I think in an attempt to corrupt it.
But it's not working.
While for me the Tea Party leans a little too far to the right.
I have been trying to think objectively about this.
Thinking of the debt crisis in this way is the only way it makes sense.
What do you think?

Lmao. Any sense of economic stability is an illusion purchased with America's nuclear, chemical and biological weapon stockpiles. Our currency is worthless, we no longer have the direct means to supply ourselves with the items needed to survive. By continuing with the debt all we are doing is getting through another week. It is no different than being addicted to a "payday loan" type place.

Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by shtf2012

 

Nah it's to blame obama. The majority of American people won't see this as the Tea Party's doing they will see it is Obama because they won't recall what the cause of the direct effects were they will just see the effects and see who is sitting as president.

That is what this whole thing has been about. It is why republicans raised the debt ceiling 19 times with the last president but not now. They are doing it because they know it's terrible but it will make people want the dems out.

You know at first that's what i thought.
But i started looking at the big picture.
I consider Obama to be part of the Washington crowd.
They have him right where they want him.
He is no threat.
But the Tea Party is a different story.
They are working hard to paint a picture of the Tea Party as extreme.
Even some of the Republicans are now speaking out against them.
This is an operation by TPTB to castrate the Tea Party.
In my honest opinion.