The Undebunkable Video: Eliminate The Impossible

Originally posted by kro32
The odds of this actually happening with no one getting caught are astronomical. But as I said I won't argue your guy's proof so i'll just have to leave it at that.

And how have You calculated those odds? Let's start with how many people were involved. How many did You use in Your calculations? Let's add media involvement. What involvement did You calculate these odds on?

Frankly... If I had three in the military - high on the rungs, five in security - high on the rungs, ten in demolition - well-trained and well paid, and twenty in the media... Well, I bet I could pull it off.

reply to post by hooper

I'm sorry but the respondents question is the first and only hurdle that needs to be cleared before any further discussion can even be considered.

You may present the most elaborate, detailed forensic study - repleat with Youtube videos galore, quotes of incredulity from persons with initials after their names and plenty of photos with arrows, circles and markings but they don't amount to a hill of beans if you can't explain why you think your neighbor burnt down your house in order to get his cat out a tree.

I would like to point out ot the members of this website that hooper's posting has been limited to the 9/11 conspiracies forum, and he passionately defends the official story despite being pounded with evidence.

The same goes for GoodOlDave, another strong supported of the official story, both of them have been restricted to 9/11 threads in which they bash the truth movement. See for yourself, look at their posts in their profile, and scroll down the list of the most recent 800 posts. They are all related to 9/11.

I'll just come right out and say it: Hooper, I think you are a dis-info agent who comes here to muddy the waters of the truth movement. Same goes for GoodOlDave.

Originally posted by heineken
reply to post by hooper

 

my point is quiet simple man...

youtube videos are pointless..

you have been attacked by your government..attack back cowards

thats my point

Cowards? Really? You calling Americans cowards? We may be a lot of things but Americans do not have a shared history of cowardice. We have fouhgt to protect ourselves, we have fought to protect others, we have even fought ourselves on more than one occasion so we have no fear of fighting. So you may want to rethink your position if you believe the only reason we are not attacking the "government" is because we are cowards.

Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by dubiousone

 

I agree with the OP that your post is off-topic and a deflection of the real issue being presented by the OP.

I'm sorry but the respondents question is the first and only hurdle that needs to be cleared before any further discussion can even be considered.

You may present the most elaborate, detailed forensic study - repleat with Youtube videos galore, quotes of incredulity from persons with initials after their names and plenty of photos with arrows, circles and markings but they don't amount to a hill of beans if you can't explain why you think your neighbor burnt down your house in order to get his cat out a tree.

I don't hear anyone asking for what you describe. You're still stuck in the stage of this that existed many years ago.

Your post highlights one of the earliest tricks played by the OS orchestrators, which was to (a) immediately point the finger of accusation at a desired target, (b) regardless of any credible evidence of the target's guilt, (c) to do so before anyone has an oportunity to question what happened or conduct even a cursory investigation, (d) insist they have it handled and already know conclusively who did it and how, and (e) proclaim publicly from the highest seat of authority in the land that anyone who disagrees is a traitor and a Looney who must be dismissed out of hand for engaging in "outrageous conspiracy theories" (aka George Bush the Jr.)

The OP explains eloquently why he believes that our neighbors (suspected but as yet not clearly identified fellow Americans and their foreign affiliates pursuing their special private agendas) burnt down our house (the twin towers, building 7, the Pentagon explosion, the crater at Shanksvillle, embroiled us further in foreign adventurism with the resultant injury, maiming and death of thousands of soldiers, foreign combatants, and countless civilians, destruction of trillions of dollars of other people's property, and the extensive economic waste and chaos we continue to experience) to get their cat out of the tree (Ah, the cat. More likely it was done to get their cat as high into the tree as possible with a view toward making the tree itself crash to the ground).

Their methodology (which you seem to wholeheartedly endorse) has so far worked quite well and is very resistant to attack, thanks to its many supporters such as yourself.

Anyone who claims to know the answer before they ask the questions and conduct an inquiry is a fool or a deceiver. Anyone who believs such a person is a fool's fool.

OP thank you! This information supplements the work of A&E for 911 Truth. Now, it is up to the People and true patriots of our country to never let this go, or history will indeed repeat itself again with another false flag attack to allow TPTB to advance their agenda of corrupt unconstitutional control over us for our own protection.
www.ae911truth.org...

Many people enjoy watching TV series like CSI and other detective shows where it is demonstrated that critical thinking skills coupled with the scientific method and empirical evidence prove a hypothesis. It is sad to see the number of people in society who are so ignorant on this thread and others like it, that refuse to understand basic physics. I guess many of them didn't do too well in school learning the subject. The "normalcy bias" is also perpetuated with ignorance.

The normalcy bias occurs when people underestimate both the possibility of a disaster occurring and its possible effects. This often results in situations in which people fail to adequately prepare for a disaster and, on a larger scale, the failure of the government to include the populace in its disaster preparations. The assumption made in the case of the normalcy bias is that since a catastrophe never has occurred, it never will. People judge their future according to how things have been in the past.

www.bibleprophecyblog.com...

This is an example of Normalcy Bias, a survival mechanism our brains are equipped with that can place us in grave danger when we’re faced with something traumatic. Simply put, it causes our brains to insist that all is okay. Everything will return to normal.

thesurvivalmom.com...

I hope one day people like us "truthers", will be rewarded and see a formal congressional investigation that includes all of the factual evidence discovered to date. We must never forget.

Originally posted by Cross8712

You can see events like this happen all of the time. It's called a movie. Everyday on tv shows criminals do stuff that never get pieced together, or maintain the secrecy until the end of the show. Go watch Lucky Number Sleven for one good example. It's a movie involving a HUGE detailed plot that doesn't clear up until the end, and only involves 2 key players.

It happened in a movie? Oh well, that's proved it then.

Many people enjoy watching TV series like CSI and other detective shows where it is demonstrated that critical thinking skills coupled with the scientific method and empirical evidence prove a hypothesis.

Yeah, we should all act more like we're on TV. That'll help us solve these complex real-world problems.

reply to post by dubiousone

I don't hear anyone asking for what you describe. You're still stuck in the stage of this that existed many years ago.

Yep, that "stage" is also often refred to as reality. The matter of the fact is, it is ten years on now and still not one person has come up to bat with a reasonable explanation of why the government would concoct and implement such a complex, Rube Goldberg scheme, chocked full off so many potential land mines and leaks just to go to war with a country that we already had a technical conflict with (Iraq) and another country where our interests were so limited if any (Afghanistan).

A question, and sorry if this is sort of unrelated, did any of you personally know any of the victims i.e., firefighters, police, medics who were on the scene and survived? or didn't survive?

Well put together OP, loads of work Im sure. I dont post in many 9/11 debates due to the fact that the for`s and against`s wont ever change their mind for whatever reason. Im also starting to think like others that its convenient to keep our thoughts and research focused on something that is long gone.

The time for dealing with the atrocity was years ago and even if it was absolutly proven that the US government played a part in killing 3,000 of its own, I dont think anyone would do anything about it. Its safer and more comfortable to research than take on the murderers.

To end, in my own opinion what we witnessed that dreadful day was the use of a weapon unknown to us. A weapon used from above that turned all in its path to dust. The pentagon explosion was merely a diversion to what was and probably still is something that is unsurpassed in creating destruction.

Respects to you all, enjoy your debate.

reply to post by TrickoftheShade

Yeah, we should all act more like we're on TV. That'll help us solve these complex real-world problems.

Are you saying that actors/actresses emulating scientists using the scientific method to find truth is wrong?

reply to post by TupacShakur


I watched the video and I believe you did a good job. I was watching TV the day that building 7 was destroyed and a man was interviewed who supposedly owned the building and he said that it was being brought down intentionally because with all the adjacent damage and debris this would be the best time to do it. I don’t remember this being presented ever again.

In your video I witnessed the thermite reaction that destroyed the steel beams as evidence that steel beams could be destroyed thus causing the building to fall. This and other evidence seemed to prove that the official investigation was wrong.

My reaction is, “Ok, now what?” The government investigators are wrong and you may not have proof of what actually happened, but you have evidence that they are wrong. It is an extremely long stretch from proving their conclusions are wrong to a government conspiracy. I haven’t seen any proof of that. It seems plausible that the officials that produced the original conclusions would be as adamant of their results as you are about yours. Does this mean you are heading up a conspiracy to prove them wrong? Or is you conspiracy more devious?

I saw a video where the explosive material could have been painted onto the steel beams. It dried as paint and since the support beams would have been exposed during painting then a detonator could have easily been attached. This thermite reaction could have been put in place years before 9/11. How do we know that the Moslem Radicals didn’t do this?

I do agree with you that America’s choice of Iraq and Afghanistan to retaliate for 9/11 is bizarre at best.
Could the reason have been war? Could the reason been retaliation for threats against George Bush senior? Who knows? This constant investigation is good, but it never is conclusive enough to generate a reaction that would cause another investigation. This will happen, because if that investigation didn’t match your conclusions then the process would go on and on and on.

My conclusion is we will never know conclusively what happened.

reply to post by kro32


So you just ignore all the evidence, f**k you are ignorant and deserve everything that will happen to you. Of course they could have done 1000 different things, does that make it true that Al Qaeda must of done this? or that all the evidence you choose to ignore makes you right? No, it makes you a blatently ignorant idiot. Go spread your fact less bs elsewhere becasue we deny ignorance here. Or atleast i still do. Thats seriously the best you could come up with against all the evidence to help you sleep at night? that because they could have done it differently that they must not have done it. You are an idiot. Period.

Originally posted by wulff
The government couldn't keep all the people needed in your scenario quiet. It's as outrageous as the people that think we never went to the moon!
I remember we didn't need such an elaborate "hoax" to get into the Korean or 'Nam, the government simply said "we are going to war to stop the spread of communism" and that was that, next I knew I was 1-A and getting ready to go to a war I didn't understand, no... the government will never have to stoop to such an elaborate hoax to go to war, they don't need to!
Experts at building demolition has stated when they wire charges to bring a building down there are wires and charges all over the place, they laugh at the suggestion that you could charge and wire a building being used in secret!
Besides, if all they wanted to do was retaliate why bring the buildings down? Simply crashing airliners into the buildings would have been enough.
Also, what about the 1st Gulf war? Bush Sr. sent troops to Iraq to prevent Kuwait from falling to Saddam, and the government (and rightly so) even said it was also to protect our 'interests' in other words, our necessary oil.
If you are going to use so much time (in your case an enormous amount of non-scientific 'tests') why don't you put your time to better use?

It wasn't so much to convince the people of this country that we need to go over there (Afghanistan), but other governments of the world. I don't think it would look so great if we just went into Afghanistan and started blowing stuff up for no reason. We needed a compelling reason (and 9/11 was as compelling as you can get) to get involved militarily in that region. And why we were over there "hey WMDs in Iraq". How convenient. Of course we didn't need a hoax to get into Nam and Korea. We had the flood of communism and we needed to stop it. Every war we have been involved in had some catalyst that marched us into war.

I want one demolition "expert" to explain to me how WTC 7 fell like that. How office fires were able to buckle steel support beams and cause the building to drop like a controlled demolition. I will bet the clothes off my back that the average skyscraper could burn for a week and not fall like that. To me WTC 7 is the smoking gun and is overlooked by the vast majority of the population because it didn't get hardly any media attention. I got into a discussion about 9/11 with my father-in-law a couple months ago and he didn't even realize WTC 7 fell. I had to show him a video of it falling. Almost 10 years later some people don't even know about it.

reply to post by hooper


You know how much money private party organizations are making in Afghanistan? Billions... War is about the most profitable enterprise one can enter. Of course its profit made from the blood, sweat, and tears of the ones fighting.

From my engineering experience, though not demolition specific, I'd have to say that this was one of the most complex and technically challenging demolitions ever performed. It would mean having access to all the buildings critical components for months to set up. Whoever it was that planned and executed the operation were extremely competent. But, even if you could convince the public that it was an inside job, the question reamains, what you going to do about it? They control the legal system, the courts, the lawyers, it would take decades to ever have a chance to convict anyone. Hate to say it, but they got away with murder.

reply to post by TupacShakur


I saw this video a long time ago. This may be some sort of re-mixed version, but I saw the originals that the guy doing the tests posted. It's one of the major reasons I believe people in our government (Cheney, Rumsfeld, etc.) were responsible for the attacks. And not just by negligence. I mean they played an integral part in the planning of the event. Thermite had to be placed in the buildings. This wasn't done by a handful of terrorist. This was done by a team of specialist. And they were allowed to do this by the WTC Security. But, in order to use the thermite, they had to have an attack.

There was a butt load of planning that went into this event. And only a fraction of it was done by the terrorist cells that actually hi-jacked the planes. The real planning was done by insiders who wanted a "New Pearl Harbor" in order to boost their Military Contracting. The only problem was ... they underestimated the power of the internet. They thought they could depend on the main stream media to cover their asses on the whole "cover-up" portion. And in the years directly after 9/11 (when the country was still in emotional turmoil) it worked. But, once people REALLY started to look at the cold, hard facts ... their sorry excuses just couldn't hold up.

Honestly, I don't see how anyone with a full mental capacity can't connect the dots. It's all right there in front of them. They just refuse to believe it.

Originally posted by hooper

Originally posted by heineken
reply to post by hooper

 

my point is quiet simple man...

youtube videos are pointless..

you have been attacked by your government..attack back cowards

thats my point

Cowards? Really? You calling Americans cowards? We may be a lot of things but Americans do not have a shared history of cowardice. We have fouhgt to protect ourselves, we have fought to protect others, we have even fought ourselves on more than one occasion so we have no fear of fighting. So you may want to rethink your position if you believe the only reason we are not attacking the "government" is because we are cowards.

what u r mentioning is the past...the wars you fight today are way too unbalanced


the real enemy is whom attacked you on your soil...and most of you agree it was your government...

edit on 20-7-2011 by heineken because: (no reason given)

reply to post by GaryN


It's my belief that if the public knew beyond a doubt that it really was an inside job ... we wouldn't be using the legal system to exact justice.

Originally posted by tyranny22
reply to post by TupacShakur

 

Honestly, I don't see how anyone with a full mental capacity can't connect the dots. It's all right there in front of them. They just refuse to believe it.

That's it right there. People refuse to believe that the government, who truly has all our best interests at heart, would do something like this.

I for one think this attack was instigated and completed by the shadow government that really runs everything from behind the scenes. I doubt any official that you see publicly was privy to the plan. They were just told what to do.

Star & Flag OP

And to you OS sheep dont twist facts to shoot theories, instead of theories to shoot facts. just like NIST.
peace