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THE USA will abandon all of its 600 military bases immediately! The Benefits of ISOLATIONISM!!!

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posted on Jun, 29 2011 @ 11:05 PM
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Originally posted by CodexSinaiticus
Food? Aren't we the "breadbasket" of the planet?


Er.. no.

You've got to face the facts: the USA has had a Chinese takeaway because of its obsession with unregulated, free-market capitalism.

You are pining for a self-sufficient and isolationist US. It's far too late for that.




posted on Jun, 29 2011 @ 11:16 PM
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reply to post by CodexSinaiticus
 


NO star and flag for your mis leading tilte :/
and can you really not think of the consequences of the us going all pre ww2?



posted on Jun, 29 2011 @ 11:30 PM
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I love how the argument is always, but it will make us less safe...

HOW WOULD BRINGING HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF TROOPS TO DEFEND THE HOMELAND BACK HOME MAKE IT LESS SAFE?

Places like Germany and Japan feel occupied still by our bases and protest against them.



posted on Jun, 29 2011 @ 11:30 PM
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Originally posted by Sherlock Holmes

Originally posted by CodexSinaiticus
Food? Aren't we the "breadbasket" of the planet?


Er.. no.

You've got to face the facts: the USA has had a Chinese takeaway because of its obsession with unregulated, free-market capitalism.

You are pining for a self-sufficient and isolationist US. It's far too late for that.









www.foreignpolicy.com...


As the new year begins, the price of wheat is setting an all-time high in the United Kingdom. Food riots are spreading across Algeria. Russia is importing grain to sustain its cattle herds until spring grazing begins. India is wrestling with an 18-percent annual food inflation rate, sparking protests.

China is looking abroad for potentially massive quantities of wheat and corn. The Mexican government is buying corn futures to avoid unmanageable tortilla price rises. And on January 5, the U.N. Food and Agricultural organization announced that its food price index for December hit an all-time high. COMMENTS (19) SHARE: Twitter Reddit Buzz More... But whereas in years past, it's been weather that has caused a spike in commodities prices, now it's trends on both sides of the food supply/demand equation that are driving up prices. On the demand side, the culprits are population growth, rising affluence, and the use of grain to fuel cars. On the supply side: soil erosion, aquifer depletion, the loss of cropland to nonfarm uses, the diversion of irrigation water to cities, the plateauing of crop yields in agriculturally advanced countries, and -- due to climate change -- crop-withering heat waves and melting mountain glaciers and ice sheets. These climate-related trends seem destined to take a far greater toll in the future. There's at least a glimmer of good news on the demand side: World population growth, which peaked at 2 percent per year around 1970, dropped below 1.2 percent per year in 2010. But because the world population has nearly doubled since 1970, we are still adding 80 million people each year. Tonight, there will be 219,000 additional mouths to feed at the dinner table, and many of them will be greeted with empty plates. Another 219,000 will join us tomorrow night. At some point, this relentless growth begins to tax both the skills of farmers and the limits of the earth's land and water resources.

Beyond population growth, there are now some 3 billion people moving up the food chain, eating greater quantities of grain-intensive livestock and poultry products. The rise in meat, milk, and egg consumption in fast-growing developing countries has no precedent. Total meat consumption in China today is already nearly double that in the United States.

The third major source of demand growth is the use of crops to produce fuel for cars. In the United States, which harvested 416 million tons of grain in 2009, 119 million tons went to ethanol distilleries to produce fuel for cars. That's enough to feed 350 million people for a year. The massive U.S. investment in ethanol distilleries sets the stage for direct competition between cars and people for the world grain harvest. In Europe, where much of the auto fleet runs on diesel fuel, there is growing demand for plant-based diesel oil, principally from rapeseed and palm oil. This demand for oil-bearing crops is not only reducing the land available to produce food crops in Europe, it is also driving the clearing of rainforests in Indonesia and Malaysia for palm oil plantations.


Is this not enough to feed the whole of the USA?



posted on Jun, 29 2011 @ 11:43 PM
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Here are some words that describe the USA pulling out of the 600 military bases:
1. Friendly
2. Neighborly
3. Cooperative
4. Polite
5. Receptive
6. Collaborative
7. Harmonious
8. Synergistic
9. Accommodating
10. Hospitable

Here is a word that describes the exact opposite of the act of pulling out of 600 overseas bases: ISOLATIONIST. Pulling out of the 600 bases (actually its more like 1,000 total) is completely collaborative, cooperative, and receptive towards the rest of the world.



posted on Jun, 29 2011 @ 11:49 PM
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Originally posted by civilchallenger
Here are some words that describe the USA pulling out of the 600 military bases:
1. Friendly
2. Neighborly
3. Cooperative
4. Polite
5. Receptive
6. Collaborative
7. Harmonious
8. Synergistic
9. Accommodating
10. Hospitable

Here is a word that describes the exact opposite of the act of pulling out of 600 overseas bases: ISOLATIONIST. Pulling out of the 600 bases (actually its more like 1,000 total) is completely collaborative, cooperative, and receptive towards the rest of the world.


Ahh, I disagree.

Although, it could be argued that all 11 items are true. And, it's more like 600.
edit on 29-6-2011 by CodexSinaiticus because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-6-2011 by CodexSinaiticus because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 12:19 AM
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Originally posted by CodexSinaiticus

Originally posted by civilchallenger
Here are some words that describe the USA pulling out of the 600 military bases:
1. Friendly
2. Neighborly
3. Cooperative
4. Polite
5. Receptive
6. Collaborative
7. Harmonious
8. Synergistic
9. Accommodating
10. Hospitable

Here is a word that describes the exact opposite of the act of pulling out of 600 overseas bases: ISOLATIONIST. Pulling out of the 600 bases (actually its more like 1,000 total) is completely collaborative, cooperative, and receptive towards the rest of the world.


Ahh, I disagree.

Although, it could be argued that all 11 items are true. And, it's more like 600.
edit on 29-6-2011 by CodexSinaiticus because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-6-2011 by CodexSinaiticus because: (no reason given)


Does creating enemies increase isolation or decrease isolation? Creating enemies increases isolation. Creating overseas military bases creates enemies. Creating enemies increases isolation. Therefore, abandoning overseas military bases reduces our number of the USA enemies and therefore does the exact opposite of isolationism. Cooperation, collaboration, and receptiveness are the exact opposite of isolationism.

Free trade and easy traveling are good. Overseas bases are bad and they create enemies causing the USA to be increasingly isolated. So, the USA need the opposite of isolationism for the best possible economy.

Look at this at a personal level. If you go around shoving a gun in people's faces left and right are you going to become known as a collaborative neighbor, or as an anti-social isolationist? You'll be known as someone who is burning their bridges and thereby increasing their isolation within the community.



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 01:51 AM
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Originally posted by babybunnies
You're dreaming if you think USA can survive as an isolated nation.


China - Which ones?

Saudi Arabia - Sure we can. We just dont drill for it because of the laws set against it. I always thought that we held onto all of the resources to suck everyone else dry before needing to use our own. Believe it or not.. Comming FROM the oilfield and seeing what we have, what we know, and what we simply dont drill... We have plenty. Dont believe the hype!


Canada - Pipelines. The same thing we do across Alaska. Underwater pipelines can work just as well. We dont need to go cross country.

Canada / South Africa - I dont think you fully understand the oilfield my friend. There are diamond bits. If we dont have them, it doesnt mean that we cant drill. Those special coated bits are for drilling specific types of earth... Faster. Without them, the drilling process would be slower, but not as slow as you might imagine. Those bits are also helpful to eat through casing as well, but again... not necissary. I would also like to add.. We can make our own synthetic diamonds. We also have created material that is just as hard and harder than natural diamonds. I would have to dig around for that example, as I just seen a news article on it last week. I think it was a top 20 list of really cool man made stuff. (shrugs)


Sure, we rely on other countries, but I do believe it is in most part, from ripping it out of our own country. We take from other countries because we can get it cheaper than doing it ourselves. If the US had to close it's doors, as Japan did so many, many years ago... We would do just fine. Perhaps we would fall behind just like Japan did in tech, but we could still survive just fine. Need and want are two diffrent things. Much of what we get from other countries are superficial things.. things we dont need.. we just want them because we're that kind of people.. sad isnt it?



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 07:24 AM
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Originally posted by civilchallenger

Originally posted by CodexSinaiticus

Originally posted by civilchallenger
Here are some words that describe the USA pulling out of the 600 military bases:
1. Friendly
2. Neighborly
3. Cooperative
4. Polite
5. Receptive
6. Collaborative
7. Harmonious
8. Synergistic
9. Accommodating
10. Hospitable

Here is a word that describes the exact opposite of the act of pulling out of 600 overseas bases: ISOLATIONIST. Pulling out of the 600 bases (actually its more like 1,000 total) is completely collaborative, cooperative, and receptive towards the rest of the world.


Ahh, I disagree.

Although, it could be argued that all 11 items are true. And, it's more like 600.
edit on 29-6-2011 by CodexSinaiticus because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-6-2011 by CodexSinaiticus because: (no reason given)


Does creating enemies increase isolation or decrease isolation? Creating enemies increases isolation. Creating overseas military bases creates enemies. Creating enemies increases isolation. Therefore, abandoning overseas military bases reduces our number of the USA enemies and therefore does the exact opposite of isolationism. Cooperation, collaboration, and receptiveness are the exact opposite of isolationism.

Free trade and easy traveling are good. Overseas bases are bad and they create enemies causing the USA to be increasingly isolated. So, the USA need the opposite of isolationism for the best possible economy.

Look at this at a personal level. If you go around shoving a gun in people's faces left and right are you going to become known as a collaborative neighbor, or as an anti-social isolationist? You'll be known as someone who is burning their bridges and thereby increasing their isolation within the community.


If I use this "logic", we would already be consider isolationist. Everyone does hate us!



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 07:40 AM
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Originally posted by theRhenn

Originally posted by babybunnies
You're dreaming if you think USA can survive as an isolated nation.


China - Which ones?

Saudi Arabia - Sure we can. We just dont drill for it because of the laws set against it. I always thought that we held onto all of the resources to suck everyone else dry before needing to use our own. Believe it or not.. Comming FROM the oilfield and seeing what we have, what we know, and what we simply dont drill... We have plenty. Dont believe the hype!


Canada - Pipelines. The same thing we do across Alaska. Underwater pipelines can work just as well. We dont need to go cross country.

Canada / South Africa - I dont think you fully understand the oilfield my friend. There are diamond bits. If we dont have them, it doesnt mean that we cant drill. Those special coated bits are for drilling specific types of earth... Faster. Without them, the drilling process would be slower, but not as slow as you might imagine. Those bits are also helpful to eat through casing as well, but again... not necissary. I would also like to add.. We can make our own synthetic diamonds. We also have created material that is just as hard and harder than natural diamonds. I would have to dig around for that example, as I just seen a news article on it last week. I think it was a top 20 list of really cool man made stuff. (shrugs)


Sure, we rely on other countries, but I do believe it is in most part, from ripping it out of our own country. We take from other countries because we can get it cheaper than doing it ourselves. If the US had to close it's doors, as Japan did so many, many years ago... We would do just fine. Perhaps we would fall behind just like Japan did in tech, but we could still survive just fine. Need and want are two diffrent things. Much of what we get from other countries are superficial things.. things we dont need.. we just want them because we're that kind of people.. sad isnt it?


Very nice post from someone with real life experience relative to the subject matter, thank you! *

You know, a lot of people bash the USA because of its international politics, or because of a crazy agenda supported by a few imperialist elites at the top of government and banking, controlling the direction of policy.

I understand their view, and there are things that I would change if I could.

What amazes me is that as soon as I put forward a very basic (maybe too basic) framework supporting withdrawal from outside obligations, everyone gets really excited saying what a bad idea it is.

Maybe it is a bad idea and maybe not, but if we were to withdraw our role as the village policeman/bully would we really be worse off?



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 07:44 AM
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I know this is going to sound a little bit AntiAmerican but here goes.
Just suppose your country did as the OP suggests what would be
the results.
Would the world go insane NO.
Would we be worse off NO.
The rest of the world would adapt and survive..
It will never happen..
Show me one case when you have kept your big noses out..
Oh you cant didnt think so..
I love your people but your government stinks.
Shame you let the oil barons,Big pharms distort the worlds view
of yourselves.
PS the British Government is no better
Peace to all
Respect
Plazmuh



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 09:52 AM
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Originally posted by babybunnies
You're dreaming if you think USA can survive as an isolated nation.

China - Many rare minerals only produced in China drive USA industry, especially in the high tech sector and exotic military research.

I will give you this point, but we have a lot of rare minnerals here state side that have already been proven to be the next best thing to what the China man has.

Saudi Arabia - The USA cannot possibly survive with it's own domestic oil production. If it could, why does it import more than 70% of the oil it uses?

This is the biggest false flag that has been pimped to the US people when it comes to our domestic oil production. There are litterally 1000's of oil fields sitting capped, in the Dakotas, Wyoming, Montana, Kansas, Nebraska, PA, TX, LA, New Mexico. There is enough here to supply the world for a long time, but for now, Im content with buring another country's oil.

Canada - Without access across Canada, how will that oil flow from Alaska? You want to bring the whole lot to the lower 48 using tankers? Good Luck.

We wont isolate ourselves from our little brothers to north, just wont happen.

Canada / South Africa - Diamonds. The oil industry depends on them. USA has hardly any of their own diamond production facilities, most diamonds used in the oil industry are from South Africa and Canada. Without them, you can't drill, period.

They use industrial grade diamonds for construction. This technology has been around since the late 80's and the biggest point you are missing is that 98% of all industrial grade diamonds used in the WORLD, are created in a lab....Yes, they actually create diamonds, just like they create pearls, rubys, emeralds and just about all other precious stones that are an exact copy of their natural brethern. So, drill baby drill. diamonds wont be an issue.

These are just a few of the countries that America relies on every single day.

All of the Above - It all comes down to the oil industry. Without enough oil, America cannot survive, at all. Without exotic metals from China, diamonds from South Africa and Canada, pipelines across Canada, and oil imports from Saudi Arabia, the "world's bread basket" would fail to function. Crops would rot in the fields as combines run out of fuel. All other industry would collapse as oil dries up without enough imports. As food supplies collapse, there will be riots in the streets.

Enjoy your isolationism. I give you three months before you have anarchy in the streets.

edit on 29-6-2011 by babybunnies because: (no reason given)


The only country that the US truly has to rely on is China for our cheap goods. We dont HAVE to rely on anyone else but good ole America for EVERYTHING else we need, but the FEDs lead us to believe that we NEED these other countries to better than what they are so that we can all be better off.



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 12:04 PM
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Well at least Canada could do it, we have everything we need.



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 12:23 PM
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Originally posted by CodexSinaiticus
Perceived weaknesses: people will say that certain goods will be too expensive because US labor costs more, which may appear to be true but it is really not true at all.





I like the premise of your argument, but without getting into everything you wrote, I'll just comment on this snippet. I think you have been misled into believing that there is some conspiracy here. If you don't believe that US labor cost more, look down at what's happening in Georgia right now. They passed a law to prevent employers from hiring illegal immigrants, and now no one is willing to work those laborous farm jobs for minimum wage.

If you've EVER bought anything where US markets and Chinese markets directly competed, you'll see the difference. I used to sell pots and pans as a teenager, and even the same name brand (such as Calphalon) has prices that vary greatly in price based on whether they were made in China or the US. If I had to take a guess as to why there is such a large discrepency, I'd say it had to do with Unions (I believe the pans are manufactured in Ohio-ish, or were at the time atleast).

I'd like to think the US products are safer due to regulations and are better made, plus you're supporting local jobs and economies. I used to push the US made products for these reasons.



There is this misconception that US consumers have that they didn't used to have - my Mom who shops every weekend is probably one of the most guilty of it. Quantity over quality. If we can change that mindset back to how it was 50 years ago, I wouldn't consider your point a weakness at all - America would push through it.

Sticking with the example of the pots - I'd rather just buy 1 set of high quality pots and pans that come with a lifetime warranty that I can have for life. My mom would rather just keep buying cheapo's over and over and over. And again, that nonstick surface doesn't last in the cheap pans (assuming you take care of your pans to begin with), which gets into your food, consequently getting into YOU, and if you do that long enough and collect enough of that crap in your body, who knows what you're bound to end up with - tying back to what I said earlier about making safer products in the States.
edit on 30-6-2011 by MidnightATL because: (no reason given)

edit on 30-6-2011 by MidnightATL because: Corrections



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 12:47 PM
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Originally posted by User8911
Well at least Canada could do it, we have everything we need.


You can't survive on beer and maple syrup!!!

Although it's good beer and syrup.



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 12:48 PM
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We import 1/3 to 1/2 of our oil that we don't need to because we don't recycle our trash.(biomass)
If all the organics in trash in the US went to plants to be converted to oil fuel prices would be lower and we would not need to convert corn to fuel.
And this is not by some super new process. the process to convert trash to oil has been around since the 1920s. Germany used it during WW2 to make fuel from coal.
en.wikipedia.org...

The only thing good these day is the rising cost of manufacturing in china is getting to the point where the cost of making something in the US is close to the cost of making it in china and shipping it to the US.

They are saying by 2014 the cost if something made in china will be the same or higher then something made in the US and companies will start to move back to the US because US workers are 3X more productive then Chinese workers.
Plus US companies can keep there trade secrets and manufacturing tricks from the Chinese



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 01:20 PM
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reply to post by CodexSinaiticus
 


I wish this would happen. We need to move away from the Progressive idea of "Nation Building" and mind our own business. We used to be the World's Bread Basket, but that was until the federal government started blowing up levees and flooding farmland on purpose in order to buy it later on for pennies on the dollar.



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 01:58 PM
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U.S. labor is more expensive, but with the way things are made these days, that labor cost increases comes down to maybe, maybe, a dime per unit in a lot of things.

I bought a broom in a grocery store the other day. Most of them were 10 bucks and were made in China. The one I bought was less than five and was made in Italy and the U.S.



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 02:09 PM
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Title is a lie and hype.

No star. No flag. Doesnt deserve a look. Try "what if" next time instead of spinning a lie back by nothing to promote your opinions.



posted on Jun, 30 2011 @ 02:19 PM
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if you close "600 bases" what will end up happening is spending 4 trillion on entitlements.

we will still have debt
we will still have trade gaps
we will still have ship in oil and oil is what the makes the world go round and your going to end up paying $1000 or more for a tank of gas.


careful what you wish for.



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