Life and Death

For all the people out there that don't believe in any sort of a "God", "soul" or "afterlife", I have a question for you:

Where do we come from before we are born?

Do you think it possibly be the same place we go when we die, or do you think it's something completely different - 2 entirely different processes?

My doctors are trying to tell me I have brain cancer so I've been thinking a lot about this sort of thing again lately.... there's really no way around it.. and I'm interested in what views others out there have these days. By the way, I'm not really afraid of dying anymore - I know it's not my time to go yet, for whatever that's worth. I just feel like if there's a chance for me to make something of myself and help others out there I'd like to do so.

Thank you.

reply to post by Time2Think


Well I am a GOD believer no matter the name you know him as. Since I read your post I first want to share my most compassionate energies of love and hope your way and a wish that things are not going to be too hard on you. And that your SOUL ETERNAL SOUL your HIGHER SELF balances you as best as it can from its location or energy plane to the 3d plane your 3dvessel its within now OUR 3d vessels are in now. So that your higherself can reinforce your/its 3d body with as much energy that you need to be comforted and strong in these days in which you may experience suffering. I dont personally know you but we are on the same planet, So I will pray for your health to heal as best as I can and for your illness to slo if possible to its slowest pace of progression. Our souls are powerful parts of our entir higher sself as is our 3d body. So please keep a positive outlook on life as best you can to help your Eternal soul guid your 3d body as best as it can.

My best wishes and hopes are with you..

Be well my friend

reply to post by Time2Think

Its is both the same place and it is not.. we never left the place we were born from, just how we see it changed, when you move into a new place you will again have a chance to reflect and change who you are and what you want to become.

reply to post by Time2Think


I don't believe in death. I believe all is one. At the point of focusing the river of life into a self-aware being, we experience a relative death. At the end of that when in this world it appears that we die, we actually become alive beyond any quality we experienced in this physical body experience. There is no such thing as death. It is an illusion formed by being self-aware.

Great video,

I also tend to agree with you Justin... honestly I was sort of hoping people who don't believe in a "soul" would put up some of their ideas here. I am interested in what they think.

When a baby is born, it is not a "blank slate" - generally, it has a variety of behaviours, instincts, abilities, as well as its own mannerisms, expressions, and character. Such traits evolved over millions of years, and to assume that these behaviours are coded like some kind of robot, to say that we are automatons, and that there is no element of consciousness would be naieve. We would have all existed at some point as primitve animals, in a past life of a past life of a past life. Some believe that we were initially the same "common ancestor" and as the collective soul divided, various fragments became individualised into separate groups, thus defining separate species, tribes, and individuals. It is my understanding that a soul is in essence a self-reliant consciousness, that seeks to reproduce itself through a process of division, akin to the division of cells. In that respect, many of us can trace our past lives to a point where we were essentially a singluar being, however, once ensoulment is achieved, I believe that we move to the next level and become true individuals.

In terms of your fear of death, I highly recommend that you learn astral projection - you will be able to experience yourself as your astral body, and you will be at peace with the other side, and if anything, prepared.

Originally posted by Time2Think
Great video,

I also tend to agree with you Justin... honestly I was sort of hoping people who don't believe in a "soul" would put up some of their ideas here. I am interested in what they think.

You can sit here waiting for that person to come here and tell you nothing happens, and that when your eyes close they close forever. You can then contemplate to your heart's content. You can leave room for doubt and suffering if you so choose to.

You can wait for that.

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Still feel like waiting?

reply to post by Time2Think


when i was 22 i was stabbed in the neck and was declared dead on arrival... some how paramedics got my heart going and took me to the hospital... at the hospital i was declared dead another two times and each time they were going to bag me up my heart started again.... while this was going on i have memories of me watching myself and trying to fight off paramedics and doctors but i had no affect on them.... i specifically remember seeing myself in the ambulance and following myself straight to the operating table.... after the operating table my soul left to where i was going.... i was not living a good life by any means.... my soul was taken through... i didn't get a light because I had a journey to make....

i don't know what happens when you live a righteous life but I know what happens when you live a dark life.... and my journey was split into 3 different stages.... each stage was rooted in my own fears... what ever your worst fear is hell is 1000x magnified.... each scenerio started like everything was fine but quickly get out of control.... after I made it through each of my stages I made it to an abandoned house or maybe it was just really old.... it was like a house out in the sticks from the 30's or 40's... weathered and peeling white paint.... unkept yard and I was inside.... I walked to the front and opened the screen door and it was so bright outside... to my right sitting on the steps was a man with his back to me... i don't remember what he was wearing but he was smoking a cigerette and he told me that i really stress him out.... he passed me the cigerette and told me that this was my last chance to get it right.... I opened my eyes and a month had passed and i was in intensive care....

i know for a fact that there is an after life.... the visions i had were not just dreams... in dreams there are key details missing but in my journey i can recount every detail until the house scene.... such as smells of body odor and the smell of sweat and the pain was so real and horrific.... I dont want to scare you i just want to tell you what happend to me and how i know the validety of the afterlife and i'm sure your life was not as evil as mine so you'll be fine...

there is a tibetan book of the dead.... it was the most accurate account of what i went through....

when i died i was not scared at all and that was probably the most peaceful moment before i got wisked away.... i just knew that it was happening and there was no fear or anything.... i just told my homeboy that i was dying and just died...

i also know that when it's your time it is your time period.... you are still here because you have things to accomplish... I wish you luck on your journey and that you find peace for your soul

reply to post by Time2Think


My best wishes to you. I know a guy (we call him Flaco), and he's had brain cancer for over 20 years now, and he's not all that slowed down by it at all, so it's not necessarily a death sentence. Here's a youtube link to a story about him Flaco and the Snake and he's in the video clip. I shot this in 2009, and he'd had it diagnosed by the VA since 1989 at that point. Just letting you know that there's someone out there who's been managing it pretty well, since most of us like to know that the odds can be beat.

On the subject of life and death, I have a somewhat unique take on it, and the truth is that I can prove (via extrapolating what we can know from the wealth of stuff that we already know) that what I believe to be true is probably very close to being true, if not completely true. I have a new book out on the subject of human existence, and will link you to it if you feel like it. That said, this is what I've found to be the truth about life and death.

When your mom and dad launched your corporeal development, you existed for 9 months within the placenta that your mom's body provided. During that time, your corporeal system developed and achieved viability, and when that was done, you were forced from that confine into the big cold bright-harsh world. The eviction process wasn't fun, and it's a good thing we don't remember it. That said, it was time to leave, and as you've grown and become more and more independent, you can see the reason why you had to leave that snug little space. Besides, its a lot more interesting out here - even if it's a bit more dramatic than some would prefer.

Over the average human life span, the corporeal brain does a lot of thinking, emoting, reacting, responding; and as it does, this information (all the Intellect being configured and launched into active existence by the brain) gathers in intimate association with its "kind". I prefer to think of each unit as a burst of Intellect, and these bursts gather with all the other bursts from the same human brain (or author) to form an intelligent and consciously aware informational being. This being is the true human being, and this development process (the gathering of these bursts - kind of like how your cells gathered while the human is a fetus) is the 2nd gestational stage of the overall development of a human being.

When this 2nd phase of gestational development ends, the corporeal placenta (the body and its brain) is discarded by the human being that has been under development for however many years, and it is finally born. The truth is that the human being is a dynamic, contemplative informational being, and being that information is eternal (once it has come into physical existence as a result of either occurrence of authored generation) the human being is eternal.

Oh, and as for what to expect - all the busy-bodies that lived here on Earth (and on other planets) are still being busy-bodies as informational beings. People don't change. So, when you are finally born as a fully viable human being, there will likely be someone or someones to show you the ropes. They've been there a long time, and by now they have it all organized and properly labeled.

You've never lived before, and as soon as you are born, you'll feel as if you just discovered what it is to be alive for the first time. I understand that it's pretty wonderful. Personally, I can't wait.

hi mate
good thread
i know there is a god
so dont worry
bye

Dear friend,

Let me start by sending you lots of positive, loving energies. It must be very hard for you to be in the situation you're in. But I think the single most important thing to do is to stay strong, positive and loving in every situation. To anwser your question. I am personally 100% convinced that there is a god or creator doesn't matter how you name it, and that everything that exists is a part of it. We are all truely one. I would suggest reading "The Law of One" series as these are the best books i've ever read about life and evolution. They are available for free here: www.llresearch.org... . You should also check out some of the next subjects as they confirm that there is more than we are told so about life: OBE's ( Out-of-body experiences ) , Past-life regression ( Hypnosis ), Meditation ( Strongly recommeded, i do it every day and it is extremely satisfying )..

Peace & Love

I think you guys are taking this the wrong way... I am not afraid of death, and I believe in a "god" and that everyone has a "soul", however, there is no one single true god or one single true evil - it's more a system of balance; everything is energy, and all of the energy added up = existence.

That's why I was asking the question, I'm wondering what all of the non-believers think, what sort of thoughts are running through their minds.... People are always talking about how stupid the idea of a God or an afterlife is, and I'm trying to ask them why it's so stupid - but apparently all I'm getting here is people thinking that I'm the one who doesn't believe... strange.

I hope I can shed some light on your question regarding how non-believers think. At least my personal interpretation.

You are basically asking why non-believers do not believe in an afterlife or God and it's actually very simple.

Fact-based non-believers (which I'll also refer as "Atheists") typically have established beliefs systems based on pure facts and not faith. It's not that God or an afterlife is based on stupidity - it's more about those concepts not having factual empirical evidence of existing. It's the acceptance of established factual data, void of emotional reasoning - even when involving something as emotionally sensitive, to many, as the continuation of life. Hope and the many other human emotions do not play a significant role in an Atheist belief structure unlike faith-based believers.

Most atheists require unequivocal and logical proof that life after death exists. If somehow life after death was scientifically proven to exist (speculative only) without a reasonable doubt, then most fact-based non-believers will then accept the theory that life does exist after death. In simple terms, It's all about "proof".

So, Atheism is simply the ABSENCE of the belief that any God or afterlife exist, not the belief that they don't exist. (I hope that makes sense).

Unlike faith-based believers, atheists do not acknowledge the use of the term "faith", yet instead follow a process of skeptical inquiry. Currently a true Atheist believes when a person dies, it's like a light switch, basically the life is switched off and that person ceases to exist. This concept is complicated to grasp by most faith driven believers.

This fact-based perspective can be very difficult to fully understand by faith-based believers. The "faith-based" and "fact-based" can argue relentlessly and indefinitely, yet never "convert" the other party to their side - since these two systems of thought processing are so far different from each other. This results in severe clashes between the two groups (as you see here on ATS quite often). That is why most people avoid the topic.

Each person is unique, there is no one ideology to which all non-believers or believers adhere. You also have theism, agnosticism and other variances of fact/faith-based belief systems and many in-between.

Regards...

Thank you.

Currently a true Atheist believes when a person dies, it's like a light switch, basically the life is switched off and that person ceases to exist. This concept is complicated to grasp by most faith driven believers.

What exactly is the source of energy for the "light switch" and who or what turns the switch on and off?

reply to post by Time2Think


Time2Think:

A typical non-believer (fact-based or atheist) doesn't believe there is any such source of energy or "soul" in the first place. That there is no preexistence or afterlife because there is no "proof" of those concepts - so the possibility is dismissed outright without any additional consideration. Most non-believers will not even reflect on an idea that is not first founded in some form of verified scientific information. Non-believers base these views on widely accepted and published scientific theories.

A believer is prone to follow the "divine", while a non-believer tends to only follow the "science". This is not really so cut and dry - as many believers also follow or are a part of the scientific community. I may use the term "atheist" loosely ("Atheist" only defines someone who does not believe in deities - and does not include beliefs about afterlife or the soul.) There are many variations on how people perceive reality and life. Some may not believe in a God, yet believe in an afterlife, etc.

Basically human beings are considered to be the same as any other earthly biological organism and not divine in original. A non-believer interprets just about all knowledge with the same fact-based thought process (beliefs based on evidence/proof). This is why non-believers also accept and are adamant supporters of natural evolution as the reason we exist (Darwin's theory of evolution).

The light is switch on or off based on physical biological processes. The concept of a soul or life energy is not supported by fact-based non-believers.

The soul (or consciousness as others see it) is merely the emotional illusion. Humans have a highly developed brain and higher-level and complex thought processes, capable of abstract reasoning, introspection, problem solving, self-awareness and rationality. These human traits, emotions, memories, and choices are all operated within the brain and brain functions. Once the brain is shut off (dies), it all stops and there is no continuation of consciousness. It can be a very foreign concept to those who have been raised with faith-based belief systems.

Wow you just made me realize what a weirdo I really am... but I'm starting to think that's a "good" thing. I've experienced so many strange unexplainable things over the course of my life that I have no idea how anyone could base everything on science alone; but I guess, in a way, it explains why there really hasn't been any MAJOR changes in the world in a very long time. I've always just assumed it was a natural thing to "think outside of the box" but apparently, it isn't.

Death does not and cannot envelope life, it's just a part of life, and a very small part at that (look around). Therefore it doesn't have the final word and thus can't enclose a human being in eternal nothingness, that makes no sense since we were never a "thing" to begin with, but an intrinsic part of the whole process that is life.

The atheists and materialist monists are foolish to asume otherwise, don't listen to them.

reply to post by Time2Think

I don't know if this will be of any help. I can only tell you of my experiences and how I am now fully convinced there is life after death.

Throughout history, dreams have been considered one way in which another reality can communicate with this reality. Although 99.9% percent of my dreams are what I consider normal, I’ve had a handful of dreams that I consider special. By special, I mean dreams I believe were given to me as a form of communication from an unseen reality. Three dreams I’ve had in particular have convinced me that reincarnation is real.

The first dream I had several years ago. I dreamt I was a bombardier in WWII. I had a different name and I was stationed in England. I dreamt my plane was shot down on a mission over occupied Europe and I died in the crash.

The second dream I had was about four months ago. I dreamt I was in a room with four or five other people. I felt the presence of my deceased father in the room with me but I didn’t see him. I and the other four or five people were told that we were about to be given a “gift.” Shortly thereafter I felt myself flying through blackness. I didn’t know where I was going but I knew I was being guided. I looked off to my right-hand side as I was flying and all I could see were two flashes of light. It didn’t take too long, but eventually we reached a place that I can only describe as an enormous place of light and pure energy. We then turned around and started to fly back through the darkness. After a short time the blackness turned to grey and then the grey parted. I could see the curvature of the Earth down below me. Soon, I woke back up in the room where we were originally and I understood what was meant when we were told were being given a gift. I knew then that there was life after death.

The third dream I had about a month ago. I dreamt I was a young man in my early twenties and I had enlisted in the air force. I was being trained along with a young woman about my age on some kind of simulator. We were going to be stationed at a “Space City.” I was kind of amused by the term Space City because I knew that term was really more for public relations than an accurate description. I knew where I was going was to be difficult and the living conditions sparse, but I was looking forward to the experience.

I know this doesn’t amount to proof for any doubters. However for me these dreams are real experiences and I believe I have been given a communication of what my past life was, what will happen when I pass from this life, and a glimpse into what my next life might be. I hope this is of some comfort.

reply to post by Time2Think


Death is a part of life my friend, its nothing that should be feared. Personally i believe it should be celebrated, but fear of death is ingrained into our society.

Its the next step, not the end...

I wonder if you've seen this?

I warn you though, it might make you cry... but i promise... you'll feel the truth in this in your heart

Be love!

reply to post by Time2Think


Time2Think: Yes, it's difficult to understand that some people can "base everything on science alone", yet that is the case with many (with belief structures based on scientific evidence). This may seem "spiritually" closed minded and out of touch compared to how believers perceive the world with faith-based explanations and ideologies. At the same time, it's very difficult for some fact-based supporters to comprehend why someone would accept and believe an idea without question, when it is scientifically unproven. This is probably why there is so much conflict between the two very distinct groups (usually at the extreme ends).

And yes, many people assumed it's a natural thing to "think outside of the box" in regards to spirituality and the unknown, yet, it isn't. Many scientists do think out of the box, yet more in terms of new scientific possibilities that have the potential of being eventually proven factual with documented evidence. Fact-followers review and accept new "beliefs" as the result of published scientific research, study or findings and not so much on personal spiritual experiences or perceptions.

I understood what you were asking and thought I could help answer your question. Just like you, many find it very stange how someone can have a "set-in-stone" understanding of such profound concepts like life after death, solely on the premise of factual data. Others here seem to think you are doubting or questioning your "faith" which I think is completely ridiculous. Faith-based believers rarely, if ever, become fact-based believers (atheists). So there is no attempt on my part to convert or influence you or anyone else here in this op.

BTW: I hope the best for you relating to your possible diagnosis of brain cancer. If you are found to have it, I hope that it will be treatable. An optimistic mindset will do wonders.

Regards...