Iran building rocket bases in Venezuela

Originally posted by brewing

Because the US had been meddling in Iranian relations since the 50s and put Iran under a fascist dictatorship so the oil could keep flowing to American interests and not Soviet or British. Perhaps you should do some homework on modern Iranian history and the Shah before you start making such claims about "aggression".

Come on Dude...I know all about US meddling in Iran so don't be condescending. Admittedly...it didn't work out to well for us. However, the results of the Iranian revolution hasn't worked out too well for Iran citizens either.

And if you don't know what happened during the attempted hostage rescue than you haven't done your homework. It's not a big secret what happened.

1) How hasn't it worked out for Iranian citizens? Because your media claims it is horrible there? Compared to what?

If the conditions are so bad there, then the people would revolt. That's just how it works, in any organized country. The only people "revolting" there are CIA-backed mercinaries and Mossad assassins. Of course there's always going to be a group of people with genuine anti-government beliefs and activites, but they exist in any country.

2) I attended a lecture by an Iranian professor who is very knowledgable on the 1979 revolution (we were studying it). He moved out of Iran during the Iran-Iraq war; he was even taking his final economics exam when an Iraqi missile struck down the road.

He specifically stated that nobody knows what happened with the special forces helicopters. Their wreckage was found smoking in the middle of uninhabited desert. He didn't want to make any unstantiated claims, but he seemed to be hinting that it was probably the Soviets who did it because Iran flipped from US to Soviet relations after 1979.

Jocko Flocko-
You haven't the slightest clue about America's current delivery systems that can be re-tasked even after takeoff during flight do you? Ballistic missile mobile launchers from Iran... you are kidding me right? The only nation in the world that has perfected mobile launch systems is Russia. Such systems are way beyond the technological means of Iran who can hardly get a delivery system off the ground 50% of the time without it blowing up.

Seriously fella, go do some reading.

Israel has developed its own mobile launchers known as the Jericho series, domestically I believe.

And there are different types of mobile platforms too. The Soviets had train versions for decades, but while they moved, they were on a predictable path. Subs are also mobile, hence why they are used by all countries subscribing themselves to MAD (Israel included). If Iran ever acquired a sub with several nuke-tipped SLBMs, they would probably never be seriously harassed by anyone.

Iran has about as much chance of developing an SLBM platform as the Toronto Maple Leafs do of winning the Stanley Cup.

For years not even the USSR had perfected the technology of SLBM launch and for a long period of time during the Cold War relied on erecting the missiles on the deck of the submarine. This gave them a great disadvantage because of the time it took to fire each missile. It also exposed the submarine to enemy fire as it had to surface to release it's missiles. For a very long time U.S. nuclear submarines were the only ones in the world capable of launching missile salvo's from beneath the surface of the water at a very fast rate. SLBM technology is extremely hard to perfect and make reliable, even for modern technologically advanced nations.

Countries like Iran and North Korea probably do, or will in the future, have some kind of low yield nuclear devices, but it's the engineering of a RELIABLE delivery platform that is the key ingredient in making a country an actual threat with any type of deterent.

reply to post by Jocko Flocko


Dunno what you're talking about because the Soviets had the first SLBM platforms that could fire missiles off from under water.

And its not like Iran is some primitive country coming out of the stone age; like every other country on Earth, they have access to modern generation technology and development to suit modern needs. In other words, they wouldn't be building u-boats or V2s in order to progress their own programs, no matter what some critics like to believe.

PS you think the Maple Leafs suck? It's a miracle that the Canucks are still in the playoffs.

reply to post by SpeachM1litant


I have seen enough, time to balance the discussion! I have seen far more of you of Venezuela than probably any one here. I lived there for fifteen years. I have met five Presidents of Venezuela. I was the only foreigner present
(British) when the New 5th Republic by Chavez was signed. I have met and talked to him on five occassions. I know Venezuela better than most Venezuelans.

Chavez is protecting his country and his people, which he has every right to do. Venezuela is no threat to the U.S or any other country. In fact Venezuela sells most of its petroleum to the U.S. even though other countries have offered higher prices. He wants to independise Venezuela and not rely on foreign imports. It is other pwers in the world that object to this and bring his downfall, because they are/will lose money because of this.

Many presidents have taken money from the people for their own good in the past. Chavez gives back to the people, he does not take it away from them. He knows the problems of the country and said to put it right would take at least 20 years to do so. I am sure he is right. There has been corruption there, like many countries, and he is doing all he can to change this. Change takes time. For him education and health are of the utmost importance. Also like all countries to have the ability to defend itself. He wants to have good relations with all countries. However he does deal with countries that some would consider undesirable to others, why? Simply because he can purchase medicine, cheap construction and even military equipment cheaper than anywhere else. He does not want to keep importing, he seeks to manufacture all of these things in venezuela so as not to be dependent on others. That is why most of his international agreements are for the transfer of technology. Example Venezuela does not want to import medical equipment or cars all the time but seeks to manufacturer their own. He does not want Venezuela to be controlled by foreign powers.

Yes there are power cuts (low water affected the Guri dam) and it did affect electricity. Yes there is still a problem with safety and security in Venezuela but it cannot be resolved over night. It takes time and education and dedication. This he is doing.

I was ther during the Vargas Trajedy in 1999, over 50,000 people died due to the floods and landslides. I slept only a few hours a day not knowing whether my family or I would die at any moment. The radio was our only link to the outside world. Chavez was there on the radio for all the hours I was awake, giving hope and inspiration to his people. He slept less than I, no more than 2 or 3 hours for several days. He is committed to his people and his country. I have to admire him for that.

Some of you will say he has got rid of many private companies, but only those that seek to over profit and create more suffering for the poorer families. That is why they support him. He is not perfect like any man, but neither are any of us, but his heart is in the right place. Missiles would never be a danger, maybe the threat of not selling us his petroleum would be very harmful, but this is not his intention.

[He specifically stated that nobody knows what happened with the special forces helicopters. Their wreckage was found smoking in the middle of uninhabited desert. He didn't want to make any unstantiated claims, but he seemed to be hinting that it was probably the Soviets who did it because Iran flipped from US to Soviet relations after 1979.

I won't get into specifics but I work in a military unit that was formed as a result of that whole fiasco. And no...I'm not Delta Force or anything like that. However, you're professor is professing something that is wrong. You want to believe him than by all means do so. I won't argue with you.

[How hasn't it worked out for Iranian citizens? Because your media claims it is horrible there? Compared to what?

If the conditions are so bad there, then the people would revolt.

Yes..they would revolt. And then they will die...as has been proven.

They're Iranian misslies right? They're going in Venezuela Right? Aren't there any "South American" countries that have a problem with the Islamic Jihad putting missile bases next they're soil? Oh, Did I say Islamic Jihad? Sorry, I meant to say Persia, err Iran. Yeah, that's right, Iran. Isn't the Lord Obama already hooking up with Brazil for they're oil since he's now made it impossible for the US to drill for it's own? Isn't Brazil in South America? If Brazil asks us, do you think we'd be able to help them out with those Jihadist missile bases? Doesn't Iran and North Korea build nuke warheads with/for each other? China would give Iran nukes for free if they could get the Persians to start stirring up trouble in South America, yeah China would just LOVE that!

Originally posted by brewing

[He specifically stated that nobody knows what happened with the special forces helicopters. Their wreckage was found smoking in the middle of uninhabited desert. He didn't want to make any unstantiated claims, but he seemed to be hinting that it was probably the Soviets who did it because Iran flipped from US to Soviet relations after 1979.

I won't get into specifics but I work in a military unit that was formed as a result of that whole fiasco. And no...I'm not Delta Force or anything like that. However, you're professor is professing something that is wrong. You want to believe him than by all means do so. I won't argue with you.

1) Wasn't my professor, he was a guest speaker who happened to have real life experience involving Iran and the '79 revolution, which is better training than reading some book on the subject.

2) Even if you do work in some secret echelon in the Pentagon's basement, it means nothing to me. We're just two sources of discussion on a message board.

3) Unless you have something relevant to say, your words really mean nothing to me. If you're willing to say it, then do. Claiming to know something but you can't say it doesn't make you seem all that legitimate, in my opinion.

4) If you do know something about it, then witholding the information is witholding the truth, and you just made it clear that you're willing to dangle information infront of us. Sounds like something a spook would do.

Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi

Originally posted by brewing

[He specifically stated that nobody knows what happened with the special forces helicopters. Their wreckage was found smoking in the middle of uninhabited desert. He didn't want to make any unstantiated claims, but he seemed to be hinting that it was probably the Soviets who did it because Iran flipped from US to Soviet relations after 1979.

I won't get into specifics but I work in a military unit that was formed as a result of that whole fiasco. And no...I'm not Delta Force or anything like that. However, you're professor is professing something that is wrong. You want to believe him than by all means do so. I won't argue with you.

1) Wasn't my professor, he was a guest speaker who happened to have real life experience involving Iran and the '79 revolution, which is better training than reading some book on the subject.

2) Even if you do work in some secret echelon in the Pentagon's basement, it means nothing to me. We're just two sources of discussion on a message board.

3) Unless you have something relevant to say, your words really mean nothing to me. If you're willing to say it, then do. Claiming to know something but you can't say it doesn't make you seem all that legitimate, in my opinion.

4) If you do know something about it, then witholding the information is witholding the truth, and you just made it clear that you're willing to dangle information infront of us. Sounds like something a spook would do.

Where or who I work with does not have any relevance to the actual story. I was only trying to add some credibility to the official verson of what happened in the Iranian desert that day. I know nothing more than you because the official IS what happened. I simplty choose to believe it and where I work has given me plenty of reasons why.

The Soviet Union was only a few months into their own little escapade into Afghanistan at the time of the attempted rescue. I don't think us going in to try and save 50 of our embassy personnel was a threat to their interests at all. Why would they waste time trying to stop it? We had already screwed up in Iran and it's not like we were invading and sending entire Army divisions across the border. The Soviets had no time for any of this.little rescue stuff. They had thier own big giant mess they were only beginning to create in Afghanistan.