The Quran and Brotherly Love is Clear to Me

reply to post by Reprobation

Love is an emotion of need, a need to please the beloved, a need to be accepted, and a being with needs is not the greatest conceivable being, but a being flawed by needs. Surely having no needs is greater than having needs.

I think you're not understanding the idea behind love... Its not a need, its acceptance...A love for all is an acceptance of everything...making no judgement to weither its good or evil...

When you show love to others it means you accept them for exactly what/who they are regardless of race, religion or creed.

When you show love by giving or by pleasing another person, if you expect something in return that is not love...

We all have our needs, we're all perfect yet flawed at the same time... to accept this is to love...

Loving all is greater then one with no needs...

reply to post by Akragon


Love, according to merriam-webster, is defined as:

a (1) : strong affection for another arising out of kinship or personal ties (2) : attraction based on sexual desire : affection and tenderness felt by lovers (3) : affection based on admiration, benevolence, or common interests
b : an assurance of affection
2
: warm attachment, enthusiasm, or devotion
3
a : the object of attachment, devotion, or admiration
b (1) : a beloved person : darling —often used as a term of endearment (2) British —used as an informal term of address
4
a : unselfish loyal and benevolent concern for the good of another: as (1) : the fatherly concern of God for humankind (2) : brotherly concern for others
b : a person's adoration of God
5
: a god or personification of love
6
: an amorous episode : love affair
7
: the sexual embrace : copulation
8
: a score of zero (as in tennis)
9
capitalized Christian Science : god
__________
I don't see "acceptance" or your definition.

reply to post by Reprobation


Perhaps you missed it...

A strong affection for another arising out of kinship or personal ties ....

affection based on admiration, benevolence, or common interests...

warm attachment, enthusiasm, or devotion

unselfish loyal and benevolent concern for the good of another

Acceptance...no?

By that definition, the computer screen is a graven image. We spend many more hours in front of these images. Is the intent to worship the screen? We go through the peanut butter aisle and show our allegiance to Jiff. Does that make it our idol because we enjoy the image on the front? Schools have a mascot. Is this a graven image that is worshiped? I would not be comfortable saying the Hebrews worship a star or that Christians worship a cross. Not so. We view these as reminders of our faith. The Muslims have the crescent moon. Does this mean they are worshiping the moon?

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by SuperiorEd

 

respect or not, doesn't one of the commandments say you will worship none but me(God)? So you're saying that they're not actually worshiping the cross or the star, just respecting God though that graven image...

Though it says no graven images either...

reply to post by SuperiorEd


Hahaha, true enough my friend

You are defining human love. Spiritual love is selfless devotion. Are you trying to deceive? Does the Quran tell you it's okay to mislead? If you are a Muslim, you know it to be Ishq that we are talking about. You know this well. It is divine love. Are you misinformed or are you misleading? How does this reflect to God? God is Al-Wadud, or "the Loving One, right?

Ishq means the Jesus style love for your neighbor. The word is derived from ‘ashiqah, a vine: the common belief is that when love takes its root in the heart of a lover, everything other than God is effaced. By your definitions of things, representing God as a 'vine' is idolatry, right?

RUMI - Islamic Sufi

Chase away evil with something good, and you
triumph over your enemy in two ways. One way
is this—your enemy is not another person’s flesh
and skin, it is the contagiousness of their hatred.
When that is cast out of you by an abundance of
thanks, it will inevitably be cast out of your
enemy as well, because everyone instinctively
responds to kindness, and you have left your
opponent with nothing to fight against.

Jesus said Love your enemies. Rumi says give thanks to God to dispel hatred in yourself when it is reflected at you from another.

Originally posted by Reprobation
reply to post by Akragon

 

Love, according to merriam-webster, is defined as:

a (1) : strong affection for another arising out of kinship or personal ties (2) : attraction based on sexual desire : affection and tenderness felt by lovers (3) : affection based on admiration, benevolence, or common interests
b : an assurance of affection
2
: warm attachment, enthusiasm, or devotion
3
a : the object of attachment, devotion, or admiration
b (1) : a beloved person : darling —often used as a term of endearment (2) British —used as an informal term of address
4
a : unselfish loyal and benevolent concern for the good of another: as (1) : the fatherly concern of God for humankind (2) : brotherly concern for others
b : a person's adoration of God
5
: a god or personification of love
6
: an amorous episode : love affair
7
: the sexual embrace : copulation
8
: a score of zero (as in tennis)
9
capitalized Christian Science : god
__________
I don't see "acceptance" or your definition.

reply to post by SuperiorEd


I like this...

Chase away evil with something good, and you
triumph over your enemy in two ways. One way
is this—your enemy is not another person’s flesh
and skin, it is the contagiousness of their hatred.
When that is cast out of you by an abundance of
thanks, it will inevitably be cast out of your
enemy as well, because everyone instinctively
responds to kindness, and you have left your
opponent with nothing to fight against.

wise words

My Christian walk with God has been greatly broadened by reading Rumi. The Discourses of Rumi are allot like the Dhammapada of Buddha. Both were enlightened to truth. Love for others is the overriding theme of Rumi in his poetry and writing. Buddha did not adhere to God as far as I know. His observations of reality, however, are worth examining.

Should we be reading Buddha and Rumi. Absolutely! The only way to gain a true perspective of your faith is to test it. The more you broaden your perspective, the more you understand the message of Jesus and others like Rumi. The truly enlightened souls of the world recognize that salvation comes form loving others as you do God. If you Love God, you cannot possibly hate another.

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by SuperiorEd

 

I like this...

Chase away evil with something good, and you
triumph over your enemy in two ways. One way
is this—your enemy is not another person’s flesh
and skin, it is the contagiousness of their hatred.
When that is cast out of you by an abundance of
thanks, it will inevitably be cast out of your
enemy as well, because everyone instinctively
responds to kindness, and you have left your
opponent with nothing to fight against.

wise words

Duplicity is filling need with reward or trying to avoid punishment. The only supreme good is seeking good as its own reward. We don't seek good for reward (Gardens in Heaven). This is duplicity. You say you seek good but you are really wanting the reward only. We don't seek good to avoid punishment. Again, this is duplicity rearing its ugly head. God does not need anything from you. You do not deserve anything from God. Isaiah 64:6 says that all your righteousness is as filthy rags to God. You can never rise to his demands of holiness. This would be approaching God by works of the flesh.

No, God demands love from you. You cannot demonstrate faith from your actions apart from showing love and dropping the duplicity. Duplicity is fake devotion. Love, on the other hand, is grace. It is unmerited favor. God favors the believer, not because of anything the believer can give God. What could he possibly want form you except to teach you to love. Love your brother. It's the only key to the tree of life. Hate is the flaming sword of bias that shuts you off from loving and from realizing your separation form a long-suffering God. He's patient and waiting on you to see the truth. You are here for a reason.

Wake up! I mean that in a loving way. We are for you, not against. We love you enough to be here shaking you from your slumber.

Originally posted by Reprobation
reply to post by SuperiorEd

 

Love is an emotion of need, a need to please the beloved, a need to be accepted, and a being with needs is not the greatest conceivable being, but a being flawed by needs. Surely having no needs is greater than having needs.

Muslims believe that God exists without a place, is not a body, does not have a shape, and is not in light or darkness.

Christians believe that God is a father. A father is by NECESSITY a body. A body needs space to exist. God doesn't need anything including space to exist, and, hence, isn't a body. This is without tackling the anthropomorphic verses.

Not to mention that some christians say that God transformed and was in the body of Jesus. God is Perfect and above changing. Transformation/change is either from an inferior state to superior or vice versa. Both don't apply to God because God is Perfect. It's contradictory to believe that God changes while holding the conviction that God is Perfect.

How can you walk with God? Does God actually walk with you? Yes. You may think you are here by your own choice, reading this ATS thread. I may think I am here writing this by my own choice. In reality, God loves us both enough to lead us. This is providence. God walks with us in this manner.

As I have said before. If you only look at the surface and the waves, you do not see the ocean for what it represents. By only looking at the fact that God was walking in the garden, you miss the entire point of what is being said. Did Adam and Eve eat the apple? No. The apple is the 'fruit' of their choice of pride.

God said not to eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge in the garden. The garden is the earth. The fruit is what the choice will bring to their walk with God. God made man to walk with him. Man had the choice and walked on his own for the education. This is pride. This says, "I am above God. I can do this myself." This is the same pride all individuals will make when walking through the paths of life with God. God told man that they would now toil on the earth for their education. This is what pride brings.

We each have this choice to make. Walk with God or walk alone. Either way, God is there walking with us. We still receive our education, but through toil if we have bias toward our neighbor or God. The flaming sword protects the tree of life. Bias is the flaming sword. We develop love for God to walk with him in the Garden.

Now do you see? I am trying to wake you up as an expression of love to you. Not just my love--God's love. I walk as one with God, which means I must walk as one with everyone I meet. I am the witness and not the judge.

Originally posted by Reprobation
reply to post by SuperiorEd

 

You said: "Although many places in scripture and Talmud speak of various parts of G-d's body (the Hand of G-d, G-d's wings, etc.) or speak of G-d in anthropomorphic terms (G-d walking in the garden of Eden, G-d laying tefillin, etc.), Judaism firmly maintains that G-d has no body. Any reference to G-d's body is simply a figure of speech, a means of making G-d's actions more comprehensible to beings living in a material world. Much of Rambam's Guide for the Perplexed is devoted to explaining each of these anthropomorphic references and proving that they should be understood figuratively."

How can "walking in the garden" be figuratively interpreted?!?! Or an alleged God's wings?!?! Look up the words in Merriam-Webster. Can't escape it.

reply to post by SuperiorEd


No. the koran is certainly ' not ' dead on.

(((( the koran denies Jesus as the Son of God and Christ. ))))

by this simple fact the koran is an evil entity. anyone who lives/abides by the words of the koran are tainted and blind.

muhammed is a liar. a son of the father of lies, satan.

if any man abides by the words of mohammed and disregards the words of the Son of God, you surely will answer for your disbelief.

believe in the Son of God while there is still time. don't be foolish and continue abiding in the words of the liar.

Read me closer. The Quran is the judgment of Islam in their unbelief. This is what I was saying. It is dead on in the fact that the Muslim who does not have love for their fellow man is condemned by their own book. I realize that it is a false book.

When the church was selling indulgences for forgiveness of sin, God used it for good. The printing press was developed by printing indulgences. The Bible was the first book printed. God never wastes an opportunity for good. When Luther printed his thesis and nailed it to the church doors, this pushed 70 million people out of Europe for freedom in a new land where the Bible and printing press then brought the English word of God to foster literacy in humanity. All we are today is representative of this thing God did to regain good for man.

The Quran will ultimately represent the same. The Quran says Jesus was one of the messengers. Jesus preached love for God and neighbors in Luke 10. If the Muslim hates his brother, the Quran becomes his judgment as an unbeliever.

The Bible is ultimately the true Word of God in written form. Christ was the true Word of God in human form.

Originally posted by steven704
reply to post by SuperiorEd

 

No. the koran is certainly ' not ' dead on.

(((( the koran denies Jesus as the Son of God and Christ. ))))

by this simple fact the koran is an evil entity. anyone who lives/abides by the words of the koran are tainted and blind.

muhammed is a liar. a son of the father of lies, satan.

if any man abides by the words of mohammed and disregards the words of the Son of God, you surely will answer for your disbelief.

believe in the Son of God while there is still time. don't be foolish and continue abiding in the words of the liar.

I might say one more thing here on this topic. Keep in mind that Love is the answer. It is far too easy to embrace the same bias against others that they use against you. Love requires that we see the good in everyone; that we see God in everyone. Our character as Christians must be above reproach. This is not easy to do. Ultimately, we must see ourselves in the mirror of others. None of us deserves what God gives. Grace is unmerited. God has bestowed this on everyone who draws the breath. We bestow the same back to others by our actions and words. If those actions or words are filled with condescension and anger, this bias throws rocks on good soil.

Originally posted by steven704
reply to post by SuperiorEd

 

No. the koran is certainly ' not ' dead on.

(((( the koran denies Jesus as the Son of God and Christ. ))))

by this simple fact the koran is an evil entity. anyone who lives/abides by the words of the koran are tainted and blind.

muhammed is a liar. a son of the father of lies, satan.

if any man abides by the words of mohammed and disregards the words of the Son of God, you surely will answer for your disbelief.

believe in the Son of God while there is still time. don't be foolish and continue abiding in the words of the liar.

reply to post by SuperiorEd


Christ Jesus is the Only Begotten Son of God.

There is Only agreeing or denying.

this isn't a message in ignorance. this is a message of Love. their are many decieved today. many easily distracted.

Christ was clear in his own words. Do this and you will live. The neighbor was loved by a Samaritan. The Samaritan's and the Jews were enemies. This is the parable of the good Samaritan who assisted his enemy, only for the good of helping a neighbor in need. Love God. Love your fellow man. Salvation.

Luke 10
25 On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”
26 “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?”

27 He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’[c]; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.”

28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.”

29 But he wanted to justify himself, so he asked Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”

30 In reply Jesus said: “A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, when he was attacked by robbers. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him and went away, leaving him half dead. 31 A priest happened to be going down the same road, and when he saw the man, he passed by on the other side. 32 So too, a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33 But a Samaritan, as he traveled, came where the man was; and when he saw him, he took pity on him. 34 He went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he put the man on his own donkey, brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35 The next day he took out two denarii[e] and gave them to the innkeeper. ‘Look after him,’ he said, ‘and when I return, I will reimburse you for any extra expense you may have.’

Originally posted by steven704
reply to post by SuperiorEd

 

Christ Jesus is the Only Begotten Son of God.

There is Only agreeing or denying.

this isn't a message in ignorance. this is a message of Love. their are many decieved today. many easily distracted.

Give me a chance to show you something. Quote me something that Jesus said about salvation. Give me your interpretation. Don't use anything that Paul wrote. Just Jesus.

Originally posted by steven704
reply to post by SuperiorEd

 

Christ Jesus is the Only Begotten Son of God.

There is Only agreeing or denying.

this isn't a message in ignorance. this is a message of Love. their are many decieved today. many easily distracted.