Koran-burning pastor Terry Jones jailed for refusing to pay a $1 'peace' bond

Originally posted by Cocasinpry
It's a #ing book...

Although I agree. You might want to edit the language. You could get slapped.

burning it will only make it more likely they'll crash more planes in your buildings.

So we should do as they want so they'll stop hurting us?
Like the bully in school who threatens to hurt you if you don't give him your lunch/lunch money? We should just give him our lunches so he's happy while we starve. Sorry, I'm not wired that way and neither are most REAL AMERICANS.

quote] Also, the book was bought at some point in time, burning it only means that another one will be purchased. Finally, the message that is left is not even remotely clear... people should read books, not burn them.
/rant.
Although I agree that burning any book is stupid, I support the nutbags right to burn the book. And unfortunately, I will defend him from those who will try to take his rights. If we don't stand up for our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS, we won't have them.
I'll post this again
"First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me."

reply to post by Watts


If you agree that burning the Koran is a hate crime, do you agree that burning the American flag is also a hate crime?

I personally do not care if he squat and defecated on it or the Bible. The book itself does not make me or break me. The biggest problem is our judicial system restricting his rights, not that I agree with him.

Originally posted by avatar22
OK, I really can't stand this man. I don't believe in anything he stands for.
BUT...
Really? This is just another example of what is happening to this "FREE" country we live in. When a man can be jailed, even if only for a short time, simply for not making peace with those he offended??? This story makes me sick on so many levels.

I can't stand this man or anything he stands for as well....

But you are either misinformed or lying, in regards to why he was arrested. He was NOT arrested because he did not make peace with those he offended. He was arrested because he violated a court order. He was ordered to pay one dollar and he did not. This is against the law. So he went to jail.

You can rest easy tonight with the knowledge that we are a free country. However, do not get confused because this free country does have laws that you must abide by. If you do not, then you pay the legal penalty just as Terry Jones did.

Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
reply to post by jfj123

 

Is it fear or respect?

fear.

Speak for yourself - I oppose burning the Qur'an on the grounds of it being extremely disrespectful. Why should people need to be so antagonistic? As a Christian I would be very insulted if the Bible was burned in place of the Qur'an, so I empathize with Muslims on the matter.
Of course, I fully disagree with the radicals who would kill over it, but the issue of burning the Qur'an is simply one of respect. We shouldn't be burning Qur'ans just to goad the radicals, because it is very insensitive to all Muslims.

If we allow the Westboro Baptist Church to hold up signs saying "God hates fags" outside of funerals, then we can allow this man to protest Islam.

No special treatment for any groups, regardless of their violent tendencies. He's not inciting hate against Muslims, the only resulting hatred and violence would come FROM the Muslims, not against them. I see no hate speech, or hate crime here if "God hates fags" isn't considered hate speech.

reply to post by jfj123


I'm not a REAL AMERICAN; I was born in Canada but consider myself a citizen of the WORLD who doesn't only care for the people inside of the imaginary lines that defines my country but the people all around the globe, even those that don't share the same values that I do.

And your bully example doesn't apply. If you spit on someone then you're asking to get punched in face. So the bully in your example is the guy burning the book and the people crashing the planes are the ones that are sick of being spit on.

I'm not condoning their actions in any way, I'm just saying that if you push, someone is bound to push back.

Dont get it, muslims burn the Amercian flag all the time.
This guy gets arrested for burning a stupid book ?

reply to post by R3KR


No, he was jailed because he refused to pay the $1 peace bond. The article clearly states this. A jury of his peers determined that his "protest" could lead to violence. And since the idiot shot off his gun accidentally in his car and was inexplicably given back the gun, I think the jury made the right decision.

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
reply to post by badw0lf

 

...to be entitled to Muslim state's protection from outside aggression, to be exempted from military service and the zakat taxes obligatory upon Muslim citizens

Sorry family but I see nothing there that states that Jizya was paid so muslims were "not offended".

It was me being facetious in the face of blinding hypocrisy, which I find easily with "jizya was a material proof of the non-Muslims' acceptance of subjection to the state and its laws". You do not see what what makes your beliefs real, because you do not look for it.

In other words, in these muslim holy lands you call America, if you offend islam by any means, you are to pay a fine or be incarcerated. In by words and voice if not by numbers. And as they say, the pen is mightier than the sword.

Making the kafirs acknowledge their inequality as a non-muslim. or force them to pay/be imprisoned - Step 1.

What else is it, it's not a deterrent by any means if just $1 - no, it's a moral and psychological statement that any method will be used against you should you stand in the way of islam - or until the time you have nothing left to give but complete and uncompromising subjugation.

Originally posted by sepermeru
reply to post by littlesheep2011

 

I was pretty sure this guy was some kind of agent, and then I saw that photograph and I was reeeally sure.

Look at his body language

Pseudo's stop please

He's an arrogant over the top tosser that expresses more hate than love and ironically (yet again) does it using a loving religion.

His momentary gait snap is nothing but perfect for his demeanor. He is not imitating the cop, he is above the cop. If you ask him, the cop is imitating him using ESP the devil gave him.

He's a lunatic. A fraud and a mad twat -

but he has not broken any laws I have heard of.

You'd think if he were a plant, he'd be going to jail for the murder of 36 family members attending some mosque or something... not standing guilty in a mug shot on the internet.

He is what he is. Or do the Muslims also have CIA/NWO/agents that can plant any old yank anywhere and get it down pat, yet still fail at blowing up a pentagon?

reply to post by jfj123


Kind of :

"There there petal, they will get theirs, police cannot beat you unlawfully - it's all ok, you have the constitution to keep you safe!"

"There there petal, no one's saying you can't protest, just not about that... or with those people.. Remember, the Constitution keeps you safe.."

"There there petal, now it's not like you can't go on the internet anymore, just stop using ATS, those dirty porn sites and that other thing you did - involving dead people.. You're ok now.. You have the constitution to keep you safe!"

"There there petal, freedom of speech never meant calling the president a small minded twit! Don't worry, in prison you still have the constitution to save you.."

"There there petal, Prison food is not that bad, and I know all you did was read a book... But you know, the constitution..."

"There there petal, it's only paper. it was meaningless, we're still American - Land of the free, home of the brave! Don't worry they've abolished everything in the constitution."

"There there petal, you know you need to be strip searched, cavity examinations and blood and urine tests when you leave the building... it's for your own good!"

"There there petal, the death penalty has been abandoned.. Since we abandoned the constitution however, we can use Instant punishment squads, that euthanize you effectively - nothing like the death penalty... If you had only acted sooner... Poor petal... it was only for your own good."

Originally posted by babybunnies
Yes, this is not about freedom of speech, what Pastor Jones is doing can be considered a hate crime under just about any definition.

Freedom of speech should only go so far, for anyone.

Did yours go too far, or mine not far enough?

You have the yard stick, tell us.

Originally posted by jfj123
reply to post by Rockpuck

 

I agree.
Freedom of speech is a great thing !
But sometimes it can be an ugly thing.

But who decides when it's great and when it's ugly?
If anyone get's to decide, then everyone loses their freedom of speech because the reality is, all speech will offend someone, somewhere.

That being said, we must protect all free speech whether or not we agree with it.

"Caveat audiens"

Let the Listener beware. I think I'll prefix all of my posts with this, and anyone who then reads further has acknowledged and agreed to my terms and conditions, and therefore has no right to assume argument win by fact of "You listened when I tolds ya not to less you wanted to, kay?"

I think it hold in court...

When someone insults something other people cherish - be at a Quran, Bible, Muhammad, Jesus or American flag, thats when free speech, a cornerstone of western society, is truly tested. Have we failed the test?

Originally posted by HardbeatAcolyte

Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
reply to post by jfj123

 

Is it fear or respect?

fear.

Speak for yourself - I oppose burning the Qur'an on the grounds of it being extremely disrespectful. Why should people need to be so antagonistic? As a Christian I would be very insulted if the Bible was burned in place of the Qur'an, so I empathize with Muslims on the matter.
Of course, I fully disagree with the radicals who would kill over it, but the issue of burning the Qur'an is simply one of respect. We shouldn't be burning Qur'ans just to goad the radicals, because it is very insensitive to all Muslims.

Meaningless.. "WE SHOULDNT" = YOU shouldn't - You do not speak for anyone else.

There is no law, no crime, no problem other than a belief set.

BELIEF SET?? That causes innocents to die.

I hope you live over east, WA is nice and all, but not with that attitude.... stay in tasmania.

Originally posted by gimme_some_truth

Originally posted by avatar22
OK, I really can't stand this man. I don't believe in anything he stands for.
BUT...
Really? This is just another example of what is happening to this "FREE" country we live in. When a man can be jailed, even if only for a short time, simply for not making peace with those he offended??? This story makes me sick on so many levels.

I can't stand this man or anything he stands for as well....

But you are either misinformed or lying, in regards to why he was arrested. He was NOT arrested because he did not make peace with those he offended. He was arrested because he violated a court order. He was ordered to pay one dollar and he did not. This is against the law. So he went to jail.

You can rest easy tonight with the knowledge that we are a free country. However, do not get confused because this free country does have laws that you must abide by. If you do not, then you pay the legal penalty just as Terry Jones did.

He was given a jury trial to keep him from protesting. How can anyone rest easy?
He was put through a sham trial to keep him from expressing his CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.

Again, keep in mind that the United States Supreme Court found that the westburo baptist church has the right to protest so why not this nut? What's different?

He was arrested on Friday following a jury trial that found he was likely to create a "breach of the peace" for plans to protest outside the Islamic Center of America in Dearborn.
www.detroitnews.com...

He was arrested because hi MIGHT breach the peace?
Westburo does it every time they protest and the United States Supreme Court says TOO BAD because they have their CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to protest.

You are right, this FREE country does have laws and even people in charge must abide by them but they did not! They blatantly violated his CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.

Jones' case is unique, said Richard Thompson, the center's president and chief counsel. "There are legal experts and commentators from all sides of the political spectrum who agree that what happened to Pastor Jones was a violation of the First Amendment."

From The Detroit News: detnews.com...’ll-sue-over-his-arrest#ixzz1KWs3IBLo

Constitutional law expert Robert Sedler said he is glad Jones is challenging the "bizarre" ruling by 19th District Judge Mark Somers requiring Jones to post a "peace bond," jailing him for refusing and ordering him to stay away from the mosque for three years — all before Jones held the demonstration.

"The Supreme Court says you cannot deny a permit because of the message," said Sedler, a Wayne State University Law School professor. "The U.S. Constitution supersedes everything, which is why this is so bizarre."

From The Detroit News: detnews.com...’ll-sue-over-his-arrest#ixzz1KWsJKNaC

At the trial, prosecutors cited an imam's remark that some see burning a Quran as worth 1,000 lives to explain why violence might erupt.

Imam Hassan Al-Qazwini, whom prosecutors were quoting about the Quran burning, said while safety concerns were legitimate, he was referring to reaction abroad. "I had no concerns at all that our community would react violently," he said.

Nobody has indicated in any way, on either side, that there would be violence. As a matter of fact, local muslims who go to the mosque had gone out of their way to say that he had a right to protest even though they didn't like it.

From The Detroit News: detnews.com...’ll-sue-over-his-arrest#ixzz1KWsWawbN

So thanks to 19th District Judge Mark Somers and his cronies, who blatantly violated CONSTITUTIONAL LAW, Jones will sue and win costing Michigan taxpayers millions of dollars.

What you don't understand is that this is NOT about this @ss hat, Jones....it's about the fact that those we have hired, are violating OUR rules and destroying our country one brick at a time.

This illegal ruling puts us in a bad spot. We now must align ourselves with pastor jones against our local officials. Most people don't like jones and wish he would go away however we cannot allow a major violation of OUR UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION. So we must now do everything we can to legally remove the judge, prosecutors, etc... who brought this sham trial.

What a shame that you are so dismissive of, the loss of everyone's CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.

Originally posted by HardbeatAcolyte

Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
reply to post by jfj123

 

Is it fear or respect?

fear.

Speak for yourself - I oppose burning the Qur'an on the grounds of it being extremely disrespectful. Why should people need to be so antagonistic? As a Christian I would be very insulted if the Bible was burned in place of the Qur'an, so I empathize with Muslims on the matter.
Of course, I fully disagree with the radicals who would kill over it, but the issue of burning the Qur'an is simply one of respect. We shouldn't be burning Qur'ans just to goad the radicals, because it is very insensitive to all Muslims.

With most INDIVIDUALS, it's a matter of respect.
With the government it's a matter of fear.
I don't fear muslims.
I don't fear radical muslims.
What I do fear is the loss of our CONSTITUTIONAL FREEDOMS.
As should you.

Your Warning:
First they'll come for those with unpopular opinions.
Then they'll come for those with inconvenient opinions.
Finally they'll come for those who have opinions.

Originally posted by Cocasinpry
reply to post by jfj123

 

And your bully example doesn't apply.

Actually it does quite well but thanks for playing.

If you spit on someone then you're asking to get punched in face. So the bully in your example is the guy burning the book and the people crashing the planes are the ones that are sick of being spit on.

WOW you have it backward.
Are you suggesting that those people who crashed into buildings killing many innocent people, ARE HERO'S? standing up for their rights? Those same people who torture and kill innocent men, women and children of their own people for having differing views? Those are your hero's?

I'm not condoning their actions in any way, I'm just saying that if you push, someone is bound to push back.

Burning a book, any book is NOT a reason to kill.
Having a different opinion and assembling peacefully is NOT a reason to kill.

If burning the koran is a legitimate reason for violence, we can go back 2000 years and start WW III.

It's just a book.
They can make more.

They burn the American Flag all the time and the bible all the time.
Do I care? NO ! Ya know why? Because they can burn some fabric or some paper but they can't burn the message.

Originally posted by InvisibleAlbatross
reply to post by R3KR

 

No, he was jailed because he refused to pay the $1 peace bond. The article clearly states this. A jury of his peers determined that his "protest" could lead to violence. And since the idiot shot off his gun accidentally in his car and was inexplicably given back the gun, I think the jury made the right decision.

The whole peace bond thing and jury trial was a way to keep him from protesting.
DUH !

jfj123 I completely agree. This has nothing to do with what the idiot has to say or what he wants to do, other than the fact that it is his CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT as an AMERICAN CITIZEN to do so. He may have been jailed for "refusing to pay a court ordered fine" but that "fine" was an UNCONSTITUTIONAL revocation of his right to freedom of speech.
Westboro and Mr. Jones, and many more people in this country feel strongly about things that I completely disagree with but that does not give me OR ANYONE ELSE the right to stop the expression of their beliefs.
Yes, the world is a volatile place ATM, but as AMERICANS we were given rights to stand up and say whatever we wish.
What's next??? Our money is being swindled, our voices tamped down, our children are being force fed their food and their drugs... This is not the America my ancestors flocked to. In fact MY ancestors fled Europe specifically because they were being persecuted for what they had to say, and what they believed in.
Where are we to go when even the good ol' US of A isn't a safe haven for our inherent freedoms?