This is how John McCarthy Roll died (Tuscon Shooting)

Originally posted by IamAbeliever
reply to post by filosophia

 

Wow. This has to be the most ridiculous debate I have ever been involved with. Thanks, btw, for adding me as a foe. Clearly those who don't bow down to you go on the foe list. That's awesome.

thanks for earning that foe list, as you did not respond to the fact that the liver temperature was not listed on the report and thus no way of knowing time of death.

Originally posted by IamAbeliever
Loughner had to kneel down to shoot him in the back.

That's odd, because the bullet traveled slightly downward. And where are you getting this? The media reenactment showed Loughner standing up, no mention of a table. And they haven't released the surveillance video, so where are you getting this information?

how so? I'm arguing that he bled to death, because no one knows who performed the triage. He may not have been dead. A paramedic could have passed over him

If that were the case, don't you think they would have possibly also passed over Giffords, who probably was unconscious from a bullet wound to the head.

This man was crouched behind a table, shielding one of Rep. Gifford's aides.

How do you crouch behind a table and shield a person? If you are crouched down you can't shield someone unless both are behind the table and kneeling. Where is the link that says a table was in the way?

Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by IamAbeliever
Loughner had to kneel down to shoot him in the back.

That's odd, because the bullet traveled slightly downward. And where are you getting this? The media reenactment showed Loughner standing up, no mention of a table. And they haven't released the surveillance video, so where are you getting this information?

New surveillance video reveal alleged shooter, Jared Lee Loughner’s movements minutes before the Tucson massacre. After shooting Gabrielle Giffords, the shooter hits her aide. Judge John Roll shielded wounded Congressional aide Ron Barber behind a table. Video shows Loughner bending down to shoot Roll in the back

mgx.com...

Originally posted by IamAbeliever

how so? I'm arguing that he bled to death, because no one knows who performed the triage. He may not have been dead. A paramedic could have passed over him

If that were the case, don't you think they would have possibly also passed over Giffords, who probably was unconscious from a bullet wound to the head.

Not if Giffords was set to be the star for the media's show. Remember that Roll was never mentioned by the media. The first person they took was Christine Taylor Greene, mostly because she was a child. The NPR I linked shows this, Google "NPR triage" to find it. Greene was not showing signs of coming back to life, so they took the next patient, Giffords. The article says that while they were crowded, other hospitals were monitoring the patients, but no mention of Roll. What doesn't add up is that they took someone with a gunshot wound to the head, but not someone with a gunshot wound to the back. Since Roll was dressed in plain clothes, they may have focused their attention on the congresswoman and not known Roll was a federal judge.

Look, the fact is that a lot of innocent people died because some stupidass with warped views decided to take things a little too far. There is nothing odd about Judge Roll's death. He was in the wrong place at the wrong time. It's a tragedy. Next you will argue that Loughner received firearms training from the FBI, CIA, and the Secret Service.

Yes, there are things about all of this that seem a little suspicious, this isn't, IMO, one of them.

Originally posted by IamAbeliever

New surveillance video reveal alleged shooter, Jared Lee Loughner’s movements minutes before the Tucson massacre. After shooting Gabrielle Giffords, the shooter hits her aide. Judge John Roll shielded wounded Congressional aide Ron Barber behind a table. Video shows Loughner bending down to shoot Roll in the back

mgx.com...

First, the actual video is not shown, it is only re-enactment, meaning it can not be completely trusted.

Second, it contradicts another re-enactment video: abcnews.go.com...

This video does not show a table. This is why re-enactments can not be trusted.

Third: if Roll's head was facing Loughner, as the video shows, the bullet would have traveled downward significantly, as opposed to slightly downward.

Originally posted by IamAbeliever


Yes, there are things about all of this that seem a little suspicious

Really, I'm going to press you on this. What is suspicious to you about the whole Tucson shooting incident? Name one specific thing you think is suspicious about it.

Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by IamAbeliever


Yes, there are things about all of this that seem a little suspicious

Really, I'm going to press you on this. What is suspicious to you about the whole Tucson shooting incident? Name one specific thing you think is suspicious about it.

And the conspiracy is brought forth, knew you had an alterior motive.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by IamAbeliever


Yes, there are things about all of this that seem a little suspicious

Really, I'm going to press you on this. What is suspicious to you about the whole Tucson shooting incident? Name one specific thing you think is suspicious about it.

And the conspiracy is brought forth, knew you had an alterior motive.

Just wanting you to reiterate what you yourself have said. I guessed you could not name one thing that was suspicious about this incident, and you proved it by not answering the question. So, I'll give you one more chance: you said "Yes, there are things about all of this that seem a little suspicious to me." and I said "really, like what?"

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1


And the conspiracy is brought forth, knew you had an alterior motive.

wow, how'd you guess that? Maybe because we're on a conspiracy website?

Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by IamAbeliever


Yes, there are things about all of this that seem a little suspicious

Really, I'm going to press you on this. What is suspicious to you about the whole Tucson shooting incident? Name one specific thing you think is suspicious about it.

And the conspiracy is brought forth, knew you had an alterior motive.

Just wanting you to reiterate what you yourself have said. I guessed you could not name one thing that was suspicious about this incident, and you proved it by not answering the question. So, I'll give you one more chance: you said "Yes, there are things about all of this that seem a little suspicious to me." and I said "really, like what?"

I get it now, The fact The FBI took over and not leaving up to Tucson PD to handle it, that's right, you are seeing this as a States rights issue, ahh I see it now.

Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1


And the conspiracy is brought forth, knew you had an alterior motive.

wow, how'd you guess that? Maybe because we're on a conspiracy website?

There are true conspiracies afoot but this is not one of them.

I'm getting you to confused with each other, I'm still waiting for Iambeliever to tell me what he thinks is suspicious about it.

Gee, it's almost like I'm talking to clones here

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1


And the conspiracy is brought forth, knew you had an alterior motive.

wow, how'd you guess that? Maybe because we're on a conspiracy website?

There are true conspiracies afoot but this is not one of them.

really? What is a true conspiracy then?

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1


I get it now, The fact The FBI took over and not leaving up to Tucson PD to handle it, that's right, you are seeing this as a States rights issue, ahh I see it now.

well yes, the state should be the one to do this, the FBI certainly should not have confiscated the gas station surveillance video.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1


There are true conspiracies afoot but this is not one of them.

Really, like what?

Originally posted by IamAbeliever


Yes, there are things about all of this that seem a little suspicious, this isn't, IMO, one of them.

Really, like what?

Not only are you guys saying the same talking points but you can't even name what the true conspiracies are.

Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1


I get it now, The fact The FBI took over and not leaving up to Tucson PD to handle it, that's right, you are seeing this as a States rights issue, ahh I see it now.

well yes, the state should be the one to do this, the FBI certainly should not have confiscated the gas station surveillance video.

The FBI took lead because a US House of Representatives member was amongst the shot automatically kicks it to the FBI.

Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1


There are true conspiracies afoot but this is not one of them.

Really, like what?

Originally posted by IamAbeliever


Yes, there are things about all of this that seem a little suspicious, this isn't, IMO, one of them.

Really, like what?

Not only are you guys saying the same talking points but you can't even name what the true conspiracies are.

Bilderberg Group, Federal Reserve, 9/11, Trilateral Commission, Council On Foriegn Relations, MKULTRA. Shall I go on?