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This is how John McCarthy Roll died (Tuscon Shooting)

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posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:23 PM
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Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by TheImmaculateD1
 


this is my hobby. Is your hobby to disprove claims you hear on the internet?


To me this is not a hobby but work as the people's work is my business.

I am an Anti Disinformation Agent and am able using my unique knowledge of how TPTB work, Government works more then qualifies me to speak of Governmental procedure.




posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:23 PM
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Originally posted by IamAbeliever


The liver will give you a core body temperature.


The only way this would be possible is if the liver temperature was taken and then they determined how many hours it must have been to reach that temperature. The liver temperature was not listed in the autopsy report so this procedure was not done.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:25 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by TheImmaculateD1
 


this is my hobby. Is your hobby to disprove claims you hear on the internet?


To me this is not a hobby but work as the people's work is my business.

I am an Anti Disinformation Agent and am able using my unique knowledge of how TPTB work, Government works more then qualifies me to speak of Governmental procedure.


Well, Mr. Anti-Disinformation Agent (in other words 'Information Agent', if you ever wanted to shorten that), I too am a information agent, so glad to meet you.
edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:25 PM
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Originally posted by IamAbeliever
reply to post by TheImmaculateD1
 


I was a Paramedic for many years, and now am a Registered Nurse. I have dealt with my fair share of death and homicide scenes. We have given the OP all the scientific, criminal investigation, and medical techniques necessary to disprove what they are saying.


If my memory serves right but isn't a pre-requisite to become an EMT that a course in basic human anatomy must be performed?



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:25 PM
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reply to post by filosophia
 


It involved a member of Congress, of course it's going to get attention, not to mention an innocent 9-year old was heinously murdered. When John Lennon was shot it was big news also because he was famous. And guess what. Lennon died from what? Newsflash...a pierced aorta.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:27 PM
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Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by TheImmaculateD1
 


this is my hobby. Is your hobby to disprove claims you hear on the internet?


To me this is not a hobby but work as the people's work is my business.

I am an Anti Disinformation Agent and am able using my unique knowledge of how TPTB work, Government works more then qualifies me to speak of Governmental procedure.


Well, Mr. Anti-Disinformation Agent (in other words 'Information Agent', if you ever wanted to shorten that), I too am a disinformation agent, so glad to meet you.


My knowledge database superceedes yours and goes above you and most here.

You however have been identified as a Misinformation Agent, the difference between the 2 is a disinfo works to disprove truth with lies while a misinfo works to perpetuate lies as truth.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:27 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

Originally posted by IamAbeliever
reply to post by TheImmaculateD1
 


I was a Paramedic for many years, and now am a Registered Nurse. I have dealt with my fair share of death and homicide scenes. We have given the OP all the scientific, criminal investigation, and medical techniques necessary to disprove what they are saying.


If my memory serves right but isn't a pre-requisite to become an EMT that a course in basic human anatomy must be performed?



Yes it is. And to become a Nurse I had to sit in on many, many autopsies. So yes, liver temperature is used to determine time of death. The OP doesn't want to hear any of it though.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:28 PM
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Originally posted by IamAbeliever
reply to post by filosophia
 


And guess what. Lennon died from what? Newsflash...a pierced aorta.


actually that could just mean they used that to prep the audience to believing that a pierced aorta could kill a man, maybe Lennon was also allowed to bleed to death.

also, do you want to respond to this: The liver temperature was not listed in the autopsy report so this procedure was not done.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:28 PM
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Originally posted by IamAbeliever
So yes, liver temperature is used to determine time of death. The OP doesn't want to hear any of it though.


I'm listening, are you?

The liver temperature was not listed in the autopsy report so this procedure was not done.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:29 PM
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Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by IamAbeliever
reply to post by filosophia
 


And guess what. Lennon died from what? Newsflash...a pierced aorta.


actually that could just mean they used that to prep the audience to believing that a pierced aorta could kill a man, maybe Lennon was also allowed to bleed to death.

also, do you want to respond to this: The liver temperature was not listed in the autopsy report so this procedure was not done.


Because I don't think anyone disputed the time of death. Pretty obvious he was dead at the scene.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:30 PM
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reply to post by IamAbeliever
 


with no proof and no indication of who performed the triage they all trusted he died at the scene! Thank you for proving my point. The "trust" was strong I suppose, no need to question it. Well I got news for you, I'm disputing it

edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:31 PM
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Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by IamAbeliever
 


with no proof and no indication of who performed the triage they all trusted he died at the scene! Thank you for proving my point. The "trust" was strong I suppose, no need to question it. Well I got news for you, I'm disputing it

edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)


IT DOES NOT MATTER WHO PERFORMED WHAT AS HIS AORTA WAS PIERCED MEANING HE BLED TO DEATH INTERNALLY WITHIN SECONDS!

Shall I report you for harrassment?
edit on 14-4-2011 by TheImmaculateD1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:32 PM
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Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by IamAbeliever
 


with no proof and no indication of who performed the triage they all trusted he died at the scene! Thank you for proving my point. The "trust" was strong I suppose, no need to question it. Well I got news for you, I'm disputing it

edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)


You're right, there is no indication who performed the triage or who pronounced this man dead. Which means that you don't even know who did it, which goes against the very point you are arguing for.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:32 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by IamAbeliever
 


with no proof and no indication of who performed the triage they all trusted he died at the scene! Thank you for proving my point. The "trust" was strong I suppose, no need to question it. Well I got news for you, I'm disputing it

edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)


IT DOES NOT MATTER WHO PERFORMED WHAT AS HIS AORTA WAS PIERCED MEANING HE BLED TO DEATH INTERNALLY WITHIN SECONDS!


speculation. Your own statistics says 25% survive



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:34 PM
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Originally posted by IamAbeliever

Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by IamAbeliever
 


with no proof and no indication of who performed the triage they all trusted he died at the scene! Thank you for proving my point. The "trust" was strong I suppose, no need to question it. Well I got news for you, I'm disputing it

edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)


You're right, there is no indication who performed the triage or who pronounced this man dead. Which means that you don't even know who did it, which goes against the very point you are arguing for.


how so? I'm arguing that he bled to death, because no one knows who performed the triage. He may not have been dead. A paramedic could have passed over him, maybe he was knocked out due to the impact to the head. For all we know, he could have bled to death at the scene. All you are relying on was arguments ad convention: hospitals left him, therefore he died at the scene. But we don't know this for sure, it's only speculation until the doctor or FBI agent performing the triage on the scene comes forward.
edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:35 PM
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A video showing an exposed and dissected aorta
www.youtube.com...



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:37 PM
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reply to post by filosophia
 


Wow. This has to be the most ridiculous debate I have ever been involved with. Thanks, btw, for adding me as a foe. Clearly those who don't bow down to you go on the foe list. That's awesome.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:38 PM
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Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by IamAbeliever

Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by IamAbeliever
 


with no proof and no indication of who performed the triage they all trusted he died at the scene! Thank you for proving my point. The "trust" was strong I suppose, no need to question it. Well I got news for you, I'm disputing it

edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)


You're right, there is no indication who performed the triage or who pronounced this man dead. Which means that you don't even know who did it, which goes against the very point you are arguing for.


how so? I'm arguing that he bled to death, because no one knows who performed the triage. He may not have been dead. A paramedic could have passed over him, maybe he was knocked out due to the impact to the head. For all we know, he could have bled to death at the scene. All you are relying on was arguments ad convention: hospitals left him, therefore he died at the scene. But we don't know this for sure, it's only speculation until the doctor or FBI agent performing the triage on the scene comes forward.
edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)


When someone is shot from the back and say entres in on the lower left hand side, guess what it must travel through? The ribcage (shards of which are sharp enough to pierce skin), the liver and the spleen.

3d pic of a deskinned human midsection
www.aquariushealth.webhealer.net...$file/InternalOrgans1.JPG



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:38 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
A video showing an exposed and dissected aorta
www.youtube.com...



yes, that is an awful lot of blood, it's a good thing no one was pulling at Roll's aorta with pliers, otherwise he might have died instantaneously.



posted on Apr, 14 2011 @ 12:39 PM
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Originally posted by filosophia

Originally posted by IamAbeliever

Originally posted by filosophia
reply to post by IamAbeliever
 


with no proof and no indication of who performed the triage they all trusted he died at the scene! Thank you for proving my point. The "trust" was strong I suppose, no need to question it. Well I got news for you, I'm disputing it

edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)


You're right, there is no indication who performed the triage or who pronounced this man dead. Which means that you don't even know who did it, which goes against the very point you are arguing for.


how so? I'm arguing that he bled to death, because no one knows who performed the triage. He may not have been dead. A paramedic could have passed over him, maybe he was knocked out due to the impact to the head. For all we know, he could have bled to death at the scene. All you are relying on was arguments ad convention: hospitals left him, therefore he died at the scene. But we don't know this for sure, it's only speculation until the doctor or FBI agent performing the triage on the scene comes forward.
edit on 14-4-2011 by filosophia because: (no reason given)


Knocked out from a blow to the head? Do your research and then get back to me. This man was crouched behind a table, shielding one of Rep. Gifford's aides. Loughner had to kneel down to shoot him in the back. It's highly unlikely he was knocked out from a fall.



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