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Topic started on 26-7-2004 @ 04:30 AM by goose
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I've always been fascinated by windmills and the fact that there are not more in use. I was wondering if anyone had any data on how much natural
resources could be saved if every family had a windmill in their backyard. Could this help make us less dependent on oil overall and how mcuh money in
the long run would this save the average family in electricity bills each year applying average speed of the windmill, I know in some areas it would
be much stronger winds and in others less. Anybody have one or know the cost of a windmill and the thing that turns the windpower into elctricity?
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reply posted on 26-7-2004 @ 04:56 AM by Valhall
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www.bergey.com...
The $40,000 ballpark price for the Bergey Windpower Co.'s 10-kilowatt generator, including a power inverter and installation, is a big enough
bite to discourage anyone, especially those who may not know how long they plan to live in the same place. [ Note: Mr. Sansome received a rebate of ~
$20,000 from the California Energy Commission. ]
Sansome has figured that his windmill will pay for itself in six to eight years. The life of the gadget is estimated to be 25 to 30 years, which
equals a lot of free energy over a long period of time.
Southern California Edison representative Laura Rudison estimated more conservatively the span of time before the average homeowner would break
even.
"When you really run the numbers, it may be 12 or 15 years," she said. [ if you ignore the CEC rebate ]
Rudison is the project manager for Edison's Net Metering Program, which does business with customers who generate their own electricity.
Because neither the wind nor the sun provide continuous sources of power, most of those who generate power from them also rely on Edison to provide
power at night or on a calm day.
By using an electric meter that runs both backward and forward, the Net Metering Program allows small, private generators to barter the power they use
for the power they generate on a one-to-one basis.
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reply posted on 26-7-2004 @ 05:08 AM by goose
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Thanks for the info. I know that back in the days when windmills were made and used to provide electricity they could not have cost that much, wonder
what it would take to make your own if you were handy? It sounds like this guy bought a really big advanced one.
[edit on 26-7-2004 by goose]
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reply posted on 26-7-2004 @ 05:12 AM by Valhall
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Well, actually, yeah they did. They have always been fairly cost-prohibitive. But what changed was that in the 1980's the windfall profit tax was
repealed and along with it went all tax credits for alternative energy use. As you can see in this article, the state of California apparently has a
state tax credit in place - good deal! These people ended up paying $20k instead of $40k.
The alternative energy tax credit needs to come back.
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reply posted on 26-7-2004 @ 05:35 AM by goose
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Yep you are right they need to bring that back, you know Jimmy Carter was trying to find alternative means of energy to help make us less dependent
on oil, as soon as Reagan got in, he shut it down just when they were starting to make headway. We have been way too dependent on foriegn oil too long
if Reagan had left that in place and funded it we might be thumbing our noses at the countries selling us oil at overinflated prices right .
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reply posted on 26-7-2004 @ 06:44 AM by slank
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My thought is not to rely on Wind or Solar as a direct electrical source, but to utilize them to extract hydrogen from water. That way even though
they are short term inconsistent, over the long run the averages are quite consistent.
Holland is doing a lot of work with windmills. They are putting them out in the shallow ocean where winds are quite consistent.
.
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reply posted on 26-7-2004 @ 07:34 AM by Ambient Sound
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For individual home use, it is better to use a combination of solar and small windmills to suppliment grid power to start with. Unlike the large farm
sized 10kw unit that you have to put on a large tower, here are some units that are more reasonable and can in some cases sit just a little higher
than the highest point on your building.
Apples and Oranges of Windpower
This information is from Home Power Magazine. It is an EXCELLENT resource for alternitive energy information
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reply posted on 26-7-2004 @ 07:49 AM by Ambient Sound
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You are quite welcome. In my opinion, there should be a solar array and a windmill on every building in the nation. Think how much power could be
generated if every Walmart in the country had it's roof covered with solar panels. There should be micro hydro generators up and down every river in
the country that doesn't freeze over in the winter.
Yeeesh. Don't get me started on how inefficent we are in generating power. It's pretty tragic once you realize that we could do it much better than
we do. The technology exists. We need to be using it.
The big culprit is the centralized power generation and transmission model.
[edit on 26-7-2004 by Ambient Sound]
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reply posted on 26-7-2004 @ 03:06 PM by FredT
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Originally posted by sardion2000
Well the way I see it going if energy prices continue to climb more and more people will consider this a very viable option, very quickly. Already, a
number of my neighbors are considering putting up solar panels, and there is a growing pressure on the Ontario Gov't to adopt more Alternative Energy
soon, cuz we don't want another blackout like we had last August. As the price of Oil climbs my hopes for Alternatives Climbs as well.
Its not that expensive. Please check out this site.
www.sierrasolar.com...
You can get a 4000 watt wind system for about 15,000 US. Not too bad. We looked at solar systems for our house during the energy crisis here in
CAlifornia. The problem is the city I live in (its not a big problem) runs its own utility and electricity is dirt cheap. Im not kidding we have a 3
br house and even in the summer running the AC all the time, we may get the electrical portion of the bill to about $19. We are looking at hot water
systems though.
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reply posted on 27-7-2004 @ 01:08 AM by Warpspeed
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People just think that the windmill (aero generator) is all there is. Not true.
If you need reliable power, you also need batteries that may have to supply energy for a quite long time if the wind does not blow all day every day
throughout the year. These batteries need maintenance and looking after, and only last a few years. The battery in your car might be 40 Amp hours
capacity and 12 volts. (480 watt hours)
An average household might use 10Kwh per day. seven days stored power ? would be 70Kwh, or maybe about 145 car batteries might do it.
How much did your car battery cost you, and how would you like to buy 145 of them ? And keep buying new ones every few years ? Not cheap at all.
The windmill and tower might cost you a fair bit, but it too will require constant maintenance. A decent storm might totally destroy it, or a direct
lightning strike would do the same.
It's a great idea, but it is NOT FREE POWER. Solar panels are a lot better because there are no moving parts and almost zero maintenance. But hail
can do some real damage, and cloudy days are a problem.
Wind farms are economic on a large scale because there are no batteries, and the machines are constantly maintained by permanent staff. A remote area
power supply for your home is a completely different thing.
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reply posted on 27-7-2004 @ 05:55 AM by Valhall
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Warpspeed is absolutely correct. You have to have a battery bank; and DC to AC conversion.
I firmly believe that wind + PV is the way to go and that if you did it this way, you could be grid-free.
But it also all depends on your location. If you live on top of a mountain where the wind never stops blowing...guess what you're best bet is? If
you live in the middle of the desert - maybe a different story.
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reply posted on 27-7-2004 @ 09:04 AM by sanctum
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We have quite a few wind farms in Oz. This has some cost info,
Hydro Tasmania today announced a major partnership agreement with the world's leading wind turbine manufacturer, Vestas.
www.auswea.com.au...
www.abc.net.au/landline/ stories/s379331.htm
This is a good article,
www.cnn.com...
Sanc'.
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reply posted on 17-5-2008 @ 03:31 AM by mdiinican
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Windmills are pretty cool. They're kind of a big investment, and are more prone to damage and maintainance intensive than solar panels, but they're
generally cheaper initial cost wise for a given power level. A nice thing about windmills, though, is that since they're very simple technology, if
you have the skill, you should be able to repair them yourself. Unlike solar panels which must be replaced, not repaired.
You need the batteries and inverter for solar too, so it's not an exclusive downside to windmills. It's quite the investment, though, and the
batteries have a finite lifespan before they need to be replaced.
You generally can't have tall windmills in cities because of zoning laws. And the windmill should be pretty tall, if you hope to get your money's
worth.
And yes, windmills have always been pretty expensive gadgetry. It was just a price people were willing to pay when it was the only way to have
electricity at their remote location.
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reply posted on 19-5-2008 @ 01:23 AM by Anonymous ATS
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The day solar panels and/or windmills come down in price will change the world. We need a technology breakthrough. Once that happens you will see
every house with solar panels and each independent of the grid. Think how great that would be also, when a storm like a hurricane knocks out a grid,
today there are 200,000 people without power. If everyone had independent power sources then it would erase all those problems where it knocks
everyone out.
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reply posted on 27-6-2008 @ 02:34 PM by Anonymous ATS
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reply to post by Anonymous ATS
Those prices you guys are quoting are ridiculous. You can buy a small windmill enough to power your own house for around $800 USD. and it's more than
enough in conjunction with a $2500 USD solar set up, to power a 3-4 bedroom home with nearly all amenities. Plus the windmill should be good for
around 30 years.
If you are a DIY kind of person you can build your own windmill for around $200 USD.
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