Japan's organised and peaceful reaction compared to the USA and hurricane katrina

Just watching sky news and they made a valid point about how organised the Japanese people have been compared to the rampant scenes of crime and looting which were shown in the aftermath of HK.

Obviously the circumstances in Japan are more severe, but don't you think it shows a clear divide between the far east and the west? This applies for the Chirstchurch earthquake too, were many building were destroyed and people killed yet noone whipped out a shotgun and started smashing windows.

In my own opinion, i feel it shows a clear divide between the west and east and how the respond in times of need. The American way was "oh my god i can go and loot myself a new TV" and the Japanese/New Zealander way was too come together and help everybody they can. Greed, role models, whatever it is, i found it interesting and thought i would share for some debate.

Cheers!

to be fair, that was new orleans

Japanese culture is completely different to Western and possibly other cultures as well. They are disciplined and have been taught to respect others etc from a very young age.

I'll give you that New Zealand is in the East. However, it predominantly has Western people and is hardly rooted in what would be commonly considered Eastern culture. I'm going to say that such things depend upon the culture of each country. Actually, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the hysteria with Hurricane Katrina was caused by the culture here in the U.S. and heavily exacerbated by another thing:

In Japan, people may be low on rations in the shelters, they may be rationing things severely, but people can clearly see that at least the government and community at large is trying. From everything I've seen, the government here in the U.S. reacted to Katrina with a finesse that was surpassed by Haiti, for God's sake.

I'd attribute the difference more to the location of the US where this happened, than the US as a whole.

That, and who knows if any looting is taking place over there.

There was also looting in Chile, so I don't think it's a problem of the west. I think it's a problem of humans, and for some reason the Japanese are above this to a greater extent than most in the world.

reply to post by ironsjack


The reason is fairly simple as far as I can tell. In the majority of the countries the people are for the most part self-reliant. The people in America are government-reliant. In America there are, what I feel, is the majority of Americans do not know how to do anything without the aid of our government. We created this ourselves by being lazy and complacent. Nobody wants to do anything for themselves, especially once they learn that if they slack off the government will cover their back. Once the American people learn that they can actually do things for themselves again, we could see similar outcomes. We are just too selfish and self-absorbed. In this case, we can see the pride that the Japanese people have for their country and fellow countrymen. In America, those bonds are almost non-existent.

Basically, the American government needs to start pushing back on us when we start complaining. When this happens and for all intents and purposes, the government needs to say to us, "no, this is not a government problem and we will not pass a law. This is a people/social problem, you all need to work it out between yourselves." If the government would quit taking the responsibility for every little issue that arises, then we may see some attitude changing in this country.

reply to post by James1982


You are right, the lack of effort put forth in the US at this time was a sad thing to behold...

Originally posted by 5StarOracle
reply to post by James1982

 

You are right, the lack of effort put forth in the US at this time was a sad thing to behold...

In my opinion that's why things got so bad during Katrina. When you are left with nothing for literally DAYS what are you going to do? Die, or steal to survive? I'll choose the second choice.

Where as in Japan, aid was coming in and dispensed and relief efforts were in effect, and being reported about half a world away in less time than anything started happening after Katrina.

I'm not completely discounting the idea that the Japanese are more civil in cases like these, but leave them with no help at all for several days and see what happens. Would probably be a different story than it currently is.

Interesting feedback!

The reply i was most interested in was the reliance on the government by the western countries. This is a common sight throughout the west, especially in the US and here in the UK. We complain and complain and complain about that government but we do nothing about it, and when we do (eg the student protests) it gets slammed by the media. God forbid there is ever a natural disaster here cos we would be expecting the government to sort us out, instead of inventing ways to help our fellow countrymen, even though i feel in england the classic "british grit" will come through.

A good example of this in Japan is a survivor camp which was set up in obliterated coastal town (forget the name). A resident of the town listed over a thousand names of the residents of the town by finding survivors and taking their names down and asking them of the names of people who they know who reside in the town, and haven't been seen. It all added up and hundreds of people appeared and ticked their names off, allowing friends and family refer to the list if they wish to seek someone. I'm pretty sure we would all expect the government/military to do this for us!

reply to post by ironsjack


You cannot compare it to Katrina, Katrina was major disaster this was major disaster X3 eq-tsunami-nuclear

Originally posted by ironsjack
Interesting feedback!



A good example of this in Japan is a survivor camp which was set up in obliterated coastal town (forget the name). A resident of the town listed over a thousand names of the residents of the town by finding survivors and taking their names down and asking them of the names of people who they know who reside in the town, and haven't been seen. It all added up and hundreds of people appeared and ticked their names off, allowing friends and family refer to the list if they wish to seek someone. I'm pretty sure we would all expect the government/military to do this for us!

Got to love stories like this, just shows how awesome people can really be! I only hope in any disaster, regardless of country, that there are more people like that.

If someone tried that in America the people would accuse the person of being an illuminati plant who was sent to collect the names of the survivors in order to figure out how successful their depopulation plans were.

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13


I stated that this is an obviously much worse disaster in the OP.

There are large numbers of people like that here in the U.S. as well. I look at the pointing out of this as a difference as little more than a subversive attempt to shame us into acting more like sheep - as if we don't enough already.

Yes it's a matter of culture. I'm attempting to find the article that I read last night that talked about how the people respect the police force in their koban stations( over 50% of residents know the officers names in their areas). That a rite of passage for children in Japan is turning in money they find on the street to their local koban station. Also any items that are found and turned into a koban that are not claimed within 6 months are given to the finder of the item.

I even read the Yakuza is helping the local police force in keeping the peace.

ETA- ARTICLE

Honesty, with incentives. Japanese people may well be more honest than most. But the Japanese legal structure rewards honesty more than most. In a 2003 study on Japan's famous policy for recovering lost property, West argues that the high rates of recovery have less to do with altruism than with the system of carrots and sticks that incentivizes people to return property they find rather than keep it. For example, if you find an umbrella and turn it in to the cops, you get a finder's fee of 5 to 20 percent of its value if the owner picks it up. If they don't pick it up within six months, the finder gets to keep the umbrella. Japanese learn about this system from a young age, and a child's first trip to the nearest police station after finding a small coin, say, is a rite of passage that both children and police officers take seriously. At the same time, police enforce small crimes like petty theft, which contributes to an overall sense of security and order, along the lines of the "broken windows" policy implemented in New York City in the 1990s. Failure to return a found wallet can result in hours of interrogation at best, and up to 10 years in prison at worst.

I posted this in another thread, but it's probably more relevant to this one.


I find it fascinating some of the comments in these threads on how proud, stoic, etc. the Japanese people are, and how if anyone can get through it, then they will.

It's all a load of rubbish.

Yes, IN GENERAL the Japanese are proud nation, just as practically every other nation on earth, but they are a nation of many millions of people, each with their own personalities - not some kind of borg with a hive mentality. If anything, economic prosperity has turned younger Japanese into lazy, self-centred navel gazers, just like the youth of every other rich nation.

Pre/post war Japan was a very different country. Apathy is just as strong there now as it is in every western country.

If anything the relatively homogeneous nature of Japanese society (something like 99.9 percent indigenous Japanese) combined with cultural legacies has created a very insular, closed political system that can't cope with anything outside the status-quo.

During the earthquake in Niigata about 5 or 6 years ago, the government was unable to cope with relief to a relatively small area - there were people dying of deep vein thrombosis weeks after the earthquake because they were cramped up sleeping in their cars! The government couldn't even provide temporary accommodation for about 10,000 people in a timely manner. Having said that, I think any government would struggle with such a task.

I think some people are in for a very rude shock when the realisation finally hits that there is no "mystical" quality about the Japanese - their government and citizens are just as fallible as the rest of us, and they are not coping at all with this disaster on all fronts.

My family in Sendai have told me they are already considering making improvised weapons to protect what resources they have. People are starting to kick into survival mode, and it will potentially get ugly quickly. At the end of the day Japanese people are only human beings - not some magical race of ninjas and samurai.

This whole sequence of events should be a wakeup call to anyone that is not directly affected by these events - governments cannot and will not look after you in during such a calamity - you need to prepare yourself during the good times for the bad times.

*Update - I spoke to my family last night and it seems there is some food getting through. My mother in law was able to buy some fish yesterday. Haven't spoken to my brother in law since 2 days ago, but I know the power and water is still off at their place.

I have lived in tornado alley all my life, sixty years, lived through a few tornadoes, the Midwest gets bombarded every spring, seldom is there looting,it is neighbor helping neighbor.

I'm torn. We're bombarded with images on the nightly news about how the Japanese people have pulled together. There are long lines, no shoving, no reported cases of looting; and we compare that to the greedy Western-every-man-for-himself-mentality you find prevalent here.
But these are all images coming to us from Western MSM sources. YouTube's been restricted in Japan, and what few images they have gotten out are vastly different from those we are shown stateside.

I want to believe the good stuff, that people ARE banding together, that they ARE putting others before themselves...but is that what's really happening? Or were those isolated incidents??

reply to post by starsyren


Think about this - how many reports have you seen from the actual worst hit areas? Have you seen any media in Sendai, a large city of over 1 million people right next to the quake zone?

The Japanese media has a long history of toeing the government line - they are not renowned for earth shattering journalism.

Now, I am not suggesting there is rioting in the streets or any such thing, but I have family in Sendai and they are telling me that people are definitely not sitting around singing kum-ba-yah while the benevolent authorities make it all better. On top of that, they have had no warnings at all about the risks of nuclear contamination from the Fukushima power plants which are 100km's due south.

Any government would struggle with this, but the Japanese government will be particularly challenged.

Originally posted by James1982

Originally posted by 5StarOracle
reply to post by James1982

 

You are right, the lack of effort put forth in the US at this time was a sad thing to behold...

In my opinion that's why things got so bad during Katrina. When you are left with nothing for literally DAYS what are you going to do? Die, or steal to survive? I'll choose the second choice.

Where as in Japan, aid was coming in and dispensed and relief efforts were in effect, and being reported about half a world away in less time than anything started happening after Katrina.

I'm not completely discounting the idea that the Japanese are more civil in cases like these, but leave them with no help at all for several days and see what happens. Would probably be a different story than it currently is.

This. I think it's a socio-economic thing as well. When you have people who are already living on the brink of a state of emergency due to dire poverty, then when what little resources they do have get wiped out by a natural disaster, those people are bound to get desperate.