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Japan declares 'nuclear emergency' after quake

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posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:21 PM
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Originally posted by liejunkie01
Here is what I think that the fuel rods look like in number three.



I EDITED THIS TO SAVE SPACE


Thank you Zorgon. I borrowed your Chernobyl pic.



I am officially wondering how many of the reactors look like this now. I originally thought it was only number three, but now. Hmm. This could be what the spent fuel rod containment pools look like.

Is anybody else sick of the flip flop reports coming out of this place(Japan). Lets play a game. Any body up for guessing the reactors integrity on this episode? Because the information coming from "them" is jacked up. Fn liers. This is getting old.

I appreciate the info guys. Keep up the good work.




posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:22 PM
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reply to post by zorgon
 





I would have After all 'let them eat cake" is classic...


I could not help but smile at that as well Zorgon...

And being a native Ansteorran .I too feel that we could put out quite a feast



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:23 PM
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is it not possible for someone to mathematiclly describe where we are at?

(time)(expexted heat levels)(substance)=

i mean seriously, can someone quantify this for us? instead of specualating?

how hot should the reactor be at this point in the process of meltdown? how hot does it half to be to melt through the substance of the containment? how long does it take to melt through containment at such and such levels of heat?

it seems to me like its been long enough for something more serious then we expect to alrdy be happening.



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:23 PM
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reply to post by maria81
 


THe problem with this info is that the IAEA report they claim to be quoting is nowhere to be found.
The German site has had the info on the website since yesterday, although at one point they removed it, probably due to missing source
edit on 25-3-2011 by monica86 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:24 PM
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reply to post by TheRedneck
 



but it does indicate a reactor vessel breach, simply because this is more evidence that the water in the turbine room originally came from within the RPV itself. Otherwise, it would still be there!

Yeah, Duh on me.

I was doing too much linear thinkin' about molybdenum.


It is something that they use the heck out of in the core itself, not a lot of it, but there seems to be a little of it in just about everything.



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:25 PM
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Originally posted by TheRedneck
reply to post by jadedANDcynical

Actually, I'm thinking the radiation (neutrons from heavy water) are strong enough to be deteriorating (eating, if you will) and destabilizing the components in the affected areas outside the core.

TheRedneck


So the neutron emissions are at such a level, that things nearby are melting?






posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:25 PM
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reply to post by poet1b
 





The reactors are small compared to Chernobyl, but the storage pools are another story. I don't enough to know how much of a threat those spent rods are, but clearly they are a considerable threat.


take a peek at a thread I started about the Spent Fuel rods

www.abovetopsecret.com



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:26 PM
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reply to post by Fractured.Facade

The only thing that can be done at this point is what they should have been doing all along... evacuation!

Again, there is no way to stop a nuclear meltdown once the fuel pools... no way. Not possible. They couldn't do it at Chernobyl, and they certainly cannot do it here with more fuel. Essentially, it is a tiny sun sitting on the coast of Japan (fission vs. fusion, I know, but the ability to stop it is similar). The seawater cooling, the water injection, the associated venting, the attempts to run damaged equipment... all these things are doing is spreading the radiation farther and delaying any evacuation attempts.

And keeping this thread alive.

TheRedneck



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:27 PM
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Originally posted by EnhancedInterrogator

Originally posted by monica86
well well....
from the NY times


Some more quotes from that same NYT article ...

Note: This part is specifically discussing the reactor in unit #3 ...

"There is a definite, definite crack in the vessel — it’s up and down and it’s large," he said. "The problem with cracks is they do not get smaller."


Based on that article (which to me is sort of "final confirmation"), I reached out to some relatives - who are in contact with a family we know in Japan (who formerly lived near us in Los Angeles), and told them to GTFO if they are anywhere North of Tokyo - irrespective of what the media, TEPCO or government are saying. I believe they live somewhere South of there, but how far/which town I'm not remembering now.

Worst case, they still own a home in Los Angeles (from when the husband used to work for JAL and was based out of LAX). They come to visit as often as their Visa's will allow. So, they could bug-out and fly over to California if needed - assuming they won't have a Visa problem getting into the US.

I wonder if the US is going to be a little more "liberal" with people trying to at least visit, if not emigrate from there. Our friends have been trying for over a decade to emigrate and retire in California - using the "lottery" system. I wonder if they (or others) could somehow be classified as "refugees" now, or in the near future?

Of course, Japan doesn't have such a great reputation to helping-out with "refugees". So, I suppose that could come back and burn them.



edit on 2011-3-25 by EnhancedInterrogator because: Formatting, spelling, grammar, broken links, etc.



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:32 PM
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reply to post by onequestion

No, it's not possible. We are at a stage where we do not fully understand all the potential problems that we are facing. It's not like Underwriter's Labs have been sitting around melting reactors down to quantify the results.

That's why we have 300+pages and counting of examinations of different decay chains and chemical reactions. This is an experiment.

We know this: extreme heat and radiation will continue to be produced until the fuel is exhausted, which could be a very very very long time. We know the area around the plant will continue to spew more and more radiation, far exceeding what any human can be exposed to and live. We know the extreme heat will oxidize (burn) anything that can burn in the area. And we know that groundwater and air currents will spread the radiation.

That's it. Some things are still beyond our abilities, as much as some scientists would like for people to believe otherwise.

TheRedneck



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:34 PM
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Originally posted by okiecowboy
I could not help but smile at that as well Zorgon...
And being a native Ansteorran .I too feel that we could put out quite a feast


Well let us hope it doesn't come to that here. One problem though would be communication. I think I need to recheck supplies and equipment and a network list just in case that Pacific plate decides to send trouble our way. I have been slacking a bit lately



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:35 PM
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Originally posted by TheRedneck
all these things are doing is spreading the radiation farther and delaying any evacuation attempts.

And keeping this thread alive.

TheRedneck


I was sticking to this thread following updates every 5 min. when this broke out...

Now it has been every other day...

The BS being slung around is more BULL than I can take.. (not from you guys the *sources*)
edit on 25-3-2011 by hillynilly because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:35 PM
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reply to post by butcherguy

Yeah, it has become pretty widespread in trace amounts, and apparently did so in the nuclear industry before it spread into everything else. I knew it had been used widely in electric motors for a very long time, and in alloys for a good while, but didn't know about the nuclear power uses. When you mentioned the washers between the pellets, I knew I was under-informed. It's hard to get much closer to the fuel.

Thanks for the info!

TheRedneck



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:36 PM
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Does anyone remember the stabilized videos that were posted?

I recall that in one of them, there were what appeared to be a scattering of burnt elliptical shapes all over the place. Could those have been scorch marks from te spent fuel rods which may have been scattered in anybod the explosions that were known to have happened?
edit on 25-3-2011 by jadedANDcynical because: Typos



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:37 PM
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reply to post by jadedANDcynical

Disintegrating would be a better word than melting. There doesn't have to be heat involved (although it probably produces some as well).

But yeah... the basic idea is the same. As someone mentioned a while back, neutrons do weird things to whatever is around them.

TheRedneck



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:43 PM
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Originally posted by TheRedneck
reply to post by onequestion

We know this: extreme heat and radiation will continue to be produced until the fuel is exhausted, which could be a very very very long time.


How much does the MOX fuel in reactor three change the values in this "experiment"?

I was reading about how these BWR have to be modified to use MOX fuel, because even with smallest percentage of plutonium it would cause the reactors to run hotter, and without these modifications would be more difficult to control.

#3 contains MOX fuel... vessel is cracked, possibly?

90 tons of this stuff in there.



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:44 PM
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posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:46 PM
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reply to post by TheRedneck
 


I just can't believe that they are still trying to downplay this situation. Just today they are now saying that there is a crack in the containment vessel this is leaking radioactive gas and fluid. Ya think? We knew this about 100 pages ago on this thread. They knew it too but wanted to hide this information. 1 and 2 also have containment issues. They knew this for several days now.

They need to face reality and get people out of there and begin plans to entomb the reactors already to stop contaminating the environment. The longer they wait the worse this will get.

All I keep hearing about is how they have made progress by turning on the lights in the control room. Ridiculous.....



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 03:47 PM
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Originally posted by mrbillshow
In a previous post I mentioned the act of "climatizing" the public to disaster levels through small but incremental increases in factual disclosures. It appears obvious to me through statements of the last 2 days the next level they wish to acclimate the public to is the extent of the core damage in #3.

Expect the next disclosure within 48 hours to read something like... "While we have no proof of reactor core damage in (meaning no visual proof) recent events and radioactivity readings indicate the possibility of a core breach in #3 to be likely."

Then 24 hours later..."Core breach in #3 confirmed".

Then the same dog and pony show for the other 3 damaged reactor buildings including the spent pools over the next week. This is all leading up to a potential evacuation of Tokyo...IMO.


Yeah I think your 100% right, and its working .. Maybe its not such a bad thing to do in steps. .. evacuating a city like tokyo is going to be hard.



posted on Mar, 25 2011 @ 04:00 PM
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reply to post by mrbillshow
 

MrBillShow, I have to agree with your assessment. While this pattern of breaking things to the public in stages has been followed by many cultures and regimes to some degree over the years, in the case of Japan it's almost impossible for them to do it any other way. You have laid out the likely sequence of events pretty near perfectly.

And you know, for some reason what is happening now in Japan brings this quote from Tennessee Williams to my mind:

"There is a time for departure even when there's no certain place to go."

Mike




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