Worried for Jehovah's Witnesses

reply to post by PApro

Yeah, I've seen them skip houses, too. I can't claim to know how they choose which houses to go to.
All I can attest to is they only stop here once every few months as opposed to every other day like they used to, even with the huge flag across my windows.

It looks like they're doing pretty well, though, as they recently did a major addition/remodel on their building down the street, and you know that ain't cheap.

reply to post by timeoftheend


I personally worry for every religious person who looks outside instead of inside for Divinity and Higher Spirit. That being said, to me the "mark of the Beast" is surely the "Beast Computer" and the Digital Angel RFID chip, imagine having to pass your hand, and the chip will contain all of your info, from medical info to bank account info and it will act as a medium of exchange.

reply to post by timeoftheend

Let us suppose that the mark is literal, and we come to a time individually where we must either take the mark, or die.

If a Christian man is willing to take the mark to ensure the survival of his family, and stand beside them through what is to come, will God condemn that man for thinking of others besides himself?

Isn't that the real crux of the issue? Is God understanding to the situations we face, or is he black and white?

Our fates do not lie in one moment in time where we make one wrong/right decision. It lies in our daily deed, and if God cannot see that then he is not the "man" i want to be beside for eternity.

Originally posted by g146541
reply to post by timeoftheend

 

I am more worried for christians, they have a guilt system in place, at least the Jehovas Witnesses haven't bought into corporate Americas Xmas and other thought up holidays for profit.

Not all Christians have either, not by a long shot.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


It depends whether you believe the Bible as being the word of God. If you do, then you will agree that God never lies. And let's just say a family man chose to believe that the mark was ok and took it... here's what the Bible says will happen:

“If anyone worships the wild beast and its image, and receives a mark on his forehead or upon his hand, 10 he will also drink of the wine of the anger of God that is poured out undiluted into the cup of his wrath, and he shall be tormented with fire and sulphur in the sight of the holy angels and in the sight of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever, and day and night they have no rest, those who worship the wild beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name. 12 Here is where it means endurance for the holy ones, those who observe the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.”

So it's a life or death situation here, that's why its so important and hence my concern.

reply to post by timeoftheend

The Bible just simply cannot be the word of god. Period! They ARE WORDS of god inspired people.
Words that came from the source within, not without. Words that have passed through the prism of the speaker's ego.

reply to post by timeoftheend


For those that don't read the article here is the briefest of answers.

Thus, the mark, whether on the right hand or on the forehead, figuratively speaking, is a symbol that identifies its bearer as one who gives worshipful support to the beastlike political systems of the world. Those having the mark give to "Caesar" that which rightly belongs to God. (Luke 20:25; Revelation 13:4, 8; 14:1) How? By giving worshipful honor to the political state, its symbols, and its military might, to which they look for hope and salvation. Any worship that they render the true God is merely lip service.

By that definition most Americans have unknowingly taken the mark of the beast with their virulent patriotism.
This is going be a disliked comment, but it's a sad fact those that join the military automatically void there Christianity.

Don't believe me then maybe you should listen to this American General that learned the hard way.

My mental faculties remained in suspended animation while I obeyed the orders of the higher-ups. This is typical with everyone in the military... I wouldn't go to war again as I have done to protect some lousy investment of the bankers.... War is just a racket. A racket is best described, I believe, as something that is not what it seems to the majority of people. Only a small inside group knows what it is about. It is conducted for the benefit of the very few at the expense of the masses...Then the flag follows the dollar and the soldiers follow the flag.

Major General Smedley Darlington Butler

reply to post by Blue_Jay33


Their explanation gives absolutely no regard for the fact that it needs to be something which is used to give the individual the ability to buy or sell. That is why I don't 'buy' it

reply to post by Blue_Jay33


As if Christianity was about what you do or don't do. Sorry, it's all about what Jesus has done. Kinda why He exclaimed "It is finished!". There is nothing left for you to do, simply trust in Him and what He already did.

Joining the military doesn't remove Jesus from the cross 2,000 years ago.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Im not sure the Bible supports this idea. Although it sounds rather nice to me.

Dear friends, if we deliberately continue sinning after we have received knowledge of the truth, there is no longer any sacrifice that will cover these sins, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? - Hebrews 10:26

It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen [c] away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace. Land that drinks in the rain often falling on it and that produces a crop useful to those for whom it is farmed receives the blessing of God. But land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless and is in danger of being cursed. In the end it will be burned. - Hebrews 6:4-8.

reply to post by Malcram


That chapter is not about Salvation, but about growth. It's very important when trying to form doctrine to view the context of the entire chapter, not pulling verses here or there. We won't be free from the presence of sin in our mortal bodies until the resurrection. Paul even says he is the "chief" among sinners, and he said this after conversion to Christianity.

If salvation is not given as a merit upon our works then it cannot be taken away on account of our works. How many of our sins were yet future when Christ hung on the cross? All my sins were, your's were too.


For help:

Here

Here

and,

Especially Here

reply to post by NOTurTypical


I'm loathe to criticize what you say because I happen to think that your interpretation is infinitely more healthy than the guilt and fear ridden Christianity that so many espouse. However, the Bible, and that chapter, does clearly say that deliberate sin is not forgiven and it does say that your actions determine if Christs 'ransom' applies to you.

That the Bible also says otherwise in other places is true, which should alert one to the very human and fallible nature of the Bible.

Its a pity that you have to attribute something which is admirable in yourself to a book which only appears to say what you think it does because you interpret it through a more loving and forgiving attitude, which is a credit to YOU, not to a contradictory book.

That this is the case is shown by the fact that other Christians with a cruel and unforgiving attitude will interpret the Bible totally differently to you, and yet swear it explicitly supports their unchristlike, condemnatory attitude, which of course it does, in places, being a contradictory book.

reply to post by Malcram


Two things:

1. Christ instructed to beware of the "wolves in sheep's clothing". Not the wolves in wolf's clothing. Meaning, there will be many who claim Christianity, yet are not Christians, but deceivers, and Christ's warning seems to imply that they will be so convincing that the elect even need to beware.

2. Most matters of "contradictions" are a result of not taking into account the context of the verses, chapters, or books. Especially Hebrews, this book was NOT written to the church. So it's implications do not pertain to the church. Romans is Paul's definitive epistle to the church. Secondly, Jesus claimed that all sins except blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is forgivable.

1John 2:1 "My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:"

reply to post by timeoftheend


Just posted these on an old thread a min ago and I think it's related to your thread (expanded on it a bit more):

Here it is:

""reply to post by Malcram


The latest:

UNITED NATIONS – Libyan strongman Col. Moammar Gadhafi, facing an insurrection at home, now faces the prospect of being declared an international criminal by the United Nations.

Such action, if taken by the U.N., could leave the billions of dollars in cash and property now controlled by the oil-rich nation suddenly frozen.

Looking to stem a public relations embarrassment, the United Nations also moved against a member of the Gadhafi family this week.

Diplomats in New York see the U.N. as the most likely venue the White House will use to increase pressure on the Libyan government...

Read more: U.N. moves against Gadhafi www.wnd.com...

As the world situation worsens - the UN will become more relevant. The more it becomes relevant the more power it accumulates. Very soon nations will be fully convinced that the only way to settle the problems of the world is to make the UN security council body become more powerfull, able to embargo or stop any nation's ability to "buy and sell" any goods.

In fact within it's body - is a growing movement tired of all the conflicts caused by differing religious ideologies (year in year out). Tired of the corruptions and atrocities commited by powerful religious leaders. Soon this body - will wield its power to impose its own will in the name of preserving and protecting the very fragile "peace and security" of the world.

So in their mind it's a worthwhile cause. What more worthwhile goal than to preserve "international peace and security"? That is the "thought" of these nations. That's always been their "thought" and stated goal. And they see religion as a big stumbling block in achieving this goal (but at the moment - the political leaders needs the religious group to control the people - soon though this alliance will break and there will no need of her influence).

Already - the writing on the wall is clear: nations are now abandoning religion and are getting feed up with it. Soon the world will be swept by a "feeling" of rejection/dejection towards any religious group. Thus there will be a cry to impower the UN to fulfill its mandated goal. Once realized, there will be no stoping it.

Thus it will come - if not already here: (the rise of a more powerful world body - slowly but surely/or in a blink of an eye - meaning fast)

Here at the UN, however, Western diplomats were flush with the triumph of finally getting the Council to address at least one of the revolts in the Middle East. One called it the "strongest statement in years".

'Protecting peace'

That difference reflects the enormous gap in perception between the public and the diplomats over how the UN works and what it can do.

The Security Council was set up in 1945 to "protect international peace and security," which at the time essentially meant preventing another world war...

www.bbc.co.uk...

The above is just a foretaste of what seem to be coming. But no matter which direction it will take to fulfill this prophetic event - the admonition is clear! "Keep of the watch" of world events and "keep (spiritualy) awake" of the times we are living in.

We are warned that these events will happen unexpectedly like a "thief in the night" - and all who are asleep will be caught by surprised - so "keep awake".

Note:

Here is where the wisdom is at - the phrase "buy and sell" mentioned in the scriptures has nothing to do with a literal "marking" on the "hands" or the "foreheads" - (as in "mark of the beast"). It simply means that nations who do not abide by the rules of the "international body", the UN will be sanctioned - unable to "buy" any goods or "sell" any of it's goods.

In addition a mark in the "hands" or "foreheads" simply means that you're owned or a servant of someone - in this case all member nations of the United Nations world body. Any nation who does not have the "mark" will not be able to do business if that nation does not abide by the rules of this organization.

UN Preamble:

Accordingly, our respective Governments, through representatives assembled in the city of San Francisco, who have exhibited their full powers found to be in good and due form, have agreed to the present Charter of the United Nations and do hereby establish an international organization to be known as the United Nations.

www.un.org...



ciao,
edmc2

reply to post by timeoftheend


Revelation 13:16

"16 And it puts under compulsion all persons, the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free and the slaves, that they should give these a mark in their right hand or upon their forehead, 17 and that nobody might be able to buy or sell except a person having the mark, the name of the wild beast or the number of its name."

Further proof that the scriptural statements "might be able to buy or sell except a person having the mark" has something to do with this world's organization - the United Nations - notice the following rules and guidelines imposed on a nation/s, a group or an Individual, that is "all persons".

SECURITY COUNCIL SANCTIONS COMMITTEES: AN OVERVIEWUnder Chapter VII of the Charter, the Security Council can take enforcement measures to maintain or restore international peace and security. Such measures range from economic and/or other sanctions not involving the use of armed force to international military action.

The use of mandatory sanctions is intended to apply pressure on a State or entity to comply with the objectives set by the Security Council without resorting to the use of force. Sanctions thus offer the Security Council an important instrument to enforce its decisions. The universal character of the United Nations makes it an especially appropriate body to establish and monitor such measures.

The Council has resorted to mandatory sanctions as an enforcement tool when peace has been threatened and diplomatic efforts have failed. The range of sanctions has included comprehensive economic and trade sanctions and/or more targeted measures such as arms embargoes, travel bans, financial or diplomatic restrictions.

At the same time, a great number of States and humanitarian organizations have expressed concerns at the possible adverse impact of sanctions on the most vulnerable segments of the population. Concerns have also been expressed at the negative impact sanctions can have on the economy of third countries.

In response to these concerns, relevant Security Council decisions have reflected a more refined approach to the design, application and implementation of mandatory sanctions. These refinements have included measures targeted at specific actors, as well as humanitarian exceptions embodied in Security Council resolutions. Targeted sanctions, for instance, can involve the freezing of assets and blocking the financial transactions of political elites or entities whose behaviour triggered sanctions in the first place. Recently, smart sanctions have been applied to conflict diamonds in African countries, where wars have been funded in part by the trade of illicit diamonds for arms and related materiel.

As part of its commitment to ensure that fair and clear procedures exist for placing individuals and entities on sanctions lists and for removing them, as well as for granting humanitarian exemptions, the Security Council, on 19 December 2006, adopted resolution 1730 (2006) by which the Council requested the Secretary-General to establish within the Secretariat (Security Council Subsidiary Organs Branch), a focal point to receive de-listing requests and perform the tasks described in the annex to that resolution. The Security Council took another significant step in this regard by establishing, by its resolution 1904 (2009) the Office of the Ombudsperson.

On 17 April 2000, the members of the Security Council established, on a temporary basis, the Informal Working Group on General Issues of Sanctions to develop general recommendations on how to improve the effectiveness of United Nations sanctions. In 2006 the Working Group submitted its report to the Security Council (S/2006/997), which contained recommendations and best practices on how to improve sanctions.

www.un.org...

So the "marking" is NOT a literal marking - rather than a "mark" or a sign that a Nation or an Individual is subservient to someone or in this case "The Beast" - the Political Government of Man. Being that Man is imperfect - thus in the sight of the Living God Jehovah - it does not measure up to perfection. Thus given a "name" or "number" for its name - being 666 > 6 short of 7 (perfection) and mentioned 3 times stresses its imperfection to the third degree.

Read here again per OP:

So if you are still waiting for a literal "beast" that will come up in the world scene and will start marking people in the "right hand and on the foreheads" - wake up - it's no gonna happen - as it's already happening (and you're not even aware of it).

Any question?

ciao,
edmc^2

reply to post by timeoftheend


Jehovahs Name is being made more and more known even here on ATS!!!!! I love it. I will take this Opportunity and say....
JEHOVAH...JEHOVAH, GOD THE ALMIGHTY, THE ONE WHO IS AND WHO WAS AND WHO IS COMING!!!!

Update:

U.N. now becoming powerful:

Will soon fulfill it's madated goal - still think it's a conspiracy


www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by xavi1000

BREAKING : UN Security Council authorizes no-fly zone over Libya

www.theglobeandmai l.com

The UN Security Council has approved a resolution to impose a no-fly zone over Libya and authorize “all necessary measures” to protect civilians from attacks by Moammar Gadhafi's forces. The vote on Thursday was 10-0 with five abstentions, including Russia and China.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Reply to post by timeoftheend

I've always figured something was wrong with those people. They were very nice but they got some f-ed up philosphies that are very false. What bothers me is that they go around random homes in the united states and act all nice and end up converting people. Even though they believe in false theories. The only way to salvation is to believe Jesus is the son of God and that he died on the cross for your sins. Its really not that hard to comprehend. These people have very different beliefs than what the bible says. I hope people have the gift of spiritual discernment to understand that. Because some people can be taken in by another human's kindness even if they are spreading false gospels. I believe this is how muslims get their believers. I won't fall for it. I realized in life that many people are wolves in sheep's clothing. A lot of people you meet might seem to be nice but do not have your best interest in mind. I have to concur jehovah witnesses do just that.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by timeoftheend


They use a new version of the Bible, their own personal translation mind you So with that in mind, they could teach whatever they wanted, all you have to do is change what their bible says in the next edition. SOP.