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Originally posted by KSigMason
Who is going to waste over 2-hours watching this video?
Originally posted by KSigMason
Who is going to waste over 2-hours watching this video? Can you maybe post some main points and references?
Originally posted by The GUT
Originally posted by KSigMason
Who is going to waste over 2-hours watching this video?
Someone who wants to know a lot about what Masons believe in their own words, in context, and from respected Freemason historians
At least that's what it promises. I've skipped around for about 20 minutes and it looks pretty spot on so far. I don't have time to watch it all tonight, but it looks worth a watch.
One thing it illuminates--heheh, I said illuminate--is the meaning of the Hiram Abiff ritual. The presenter also has made a good case so far--again from respected Masonic literature--that the mystic mason buys into the Luciferian "ye shall be as gods" mantra.
In summation, the presenter seems to go to great lengths to be fair, concise, and in context by literally showing the passages and citing references from either official Mason materials or from their own respected historians.
Further, the presenter seems aware of the various denial techniques some Masons use to obfuscate and takes pains to carefully prove his point.
Thank You . Could not have said it better myself.
The simpler form of the cross is known as the "Crusaders' Cross", because it was on the papal banner given to the Crusaders by Pope Urban II for the First Crusade, and became a symbol of the Latin Kingdom of Jerusalem. It was first worn by Godfrey of Bouillon, the first leader of the Kingdom. The four smaller crosses are said to symbolize either the four books of the Gospel or the four directions in which the Word of Christ spread from Jerusalem. Alternatively, all five crosses can symbolize the five wounds of Christ during the Passion, the Pentateuch and, presumably, the first five Christian Churches.
Originally posted by KSigMason
...I wonder if the narrator and other people realize that Manly P. Hall wrote this book decades before even joining. Lately, in the last year to be specific, I have been reading the works of Timothy Hogan...
...Albert Pike is one authority, but I'd like to point out that I enjoy his other works (such as Esoterika)...
Originally posted by The GUT
I don't think Manly Hall--or Pike--for that matter are necessarily the be-all-end-all on mystic masonry, but you're not saying your brothers conferred his degree because he didn't have a clue are you?
And I've read enough of Morals and Dogma to know that Pike isn't taken out of context and that he did have an affinity for Lucifer. Again, that's okay if that's your bag, but why be disingenuous about it?
Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by seeknoevil
If you chose to believe a man who is not a member of masonry over the word of men who are in fact masons, then you deserve all the knowledge you get.
Balphomet. Bwahahahahahahahahahah!
Really? Where do you get that? He mentions Lucifer by name in all of 4 places in Morals and Dogma. You can find them all easily enough by copying and pasting the following string into Google…
Originally posted by The GUT
And I've read enough of Morals and Dogma to know that Pike isn't taken out of context and that he did have an affinity for Lucifer.
Hypocrisy is the homage that vice and wrong pay to virtue and justice. It is .Satan attempting to clothe himself in the angelic vesture of light. It is equally detestable in morals, politics, and religion; in the man and in the nation. To do injustice under the pretence of equity and fairness; to reprove vice in public and commit it in private; to pretend to charitable opinion and censoriously condemn; to profess the principles of Masonic beneficence, and close the ear to the wail of distress and the cry of suffering; to eulogize the intelligence of the people, and plot to deceive and be-tray them by means of their ignorance and simplicity; to prate of purity, and peculate; of honor, and basely abandon a sinking cause; of disinterestedness, and sell one's vote for place and power, are hypocrisies as common as they are infamous and disgraceful. To steal the livery of the Court of God to serve the Devil withal; to pretend to believe in a God of mercy and a Redeemer of love, and persecute those of a different faith; to devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayers; to preach continence, and wallow in lust; to inculcate humility, and in pride surpass Lucifer; to pay tithe, and omit the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy and faith; to strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel; to make clean the outside of the cup and platter, keeping them full within of extortion and excess; to appear outwardly righteous unto men, but within be full of hypocrisy and iniquity, is indeed to be like unto whited sepulchres, which appear beautiful outward, but are within full of bones of the dead and of all uncleanness.
Here he's saying he doesn't believe in Lucifer or Satan. There's only God or no belief in God. This is something that he gets to again and again in M&D, best summed up in the last chapter when he talks about equilibrium.
The true name of Satan, the Kabalists say, is that of Yahveh reversed; for Satan is not a black god, but the negation of God. The Devil is the personification of Atheism or Idolatry.
For the Initiates, this is not a Person, but a Force, created for good, but which may serve for evil. It is the instrument of Liberty or Free Will. They represent this Force, which presides over the physical generation, under the mythologic and horned form of the God PAN; thence came the he-goat of the Sabbat, brother of the Ancient Serpent, and the Light-bearer or Phosphor, of which the poets have made the false Lucifer of the legend.
He's mocking people who believe in Lucifer. No affinity here either.
The Apocalypse is, to those who receive the nineteenth Degree, the Apotheosis of that Sublime Faith which aspires to God alone, and despises all the pomps and works of Lucifer. LUCIFER, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble, sensual, or selfish Souls? Doubt it not! for traditions are full of Divine Revelations and Inspirations: and Inspiration is not of one Age nor of one Creed. Plato and Philo, also, were inspired.
Again, saying that man created the belief in a devil as a false explanation, when in fact, all the bad in the world is God's will, along with all the good.
It is by His uttered Word that God reveals Himself to us; not alone in the visible and invisible but intellectual creation, but also in our convictions, consciousness, and instincts. Hence it is that certain beliefs are universal. The conviction of all men that God is good led to a belief in a Devil, the fallen Lucifer or Light-bearer, Shaitan the Adversary, Ahriman and Tupho_n, as an attempt to explain the existence of Evil, and make it consistent with the Infinite Power, Wisdom, and Benevolence of God.
The true name of Satan, the Kabalists say, is that of Yahveh reversed; for Satan is not a black god, but the negation of God. The Devil is the personification of Atheism or Idolatry.
For the Initiates, this is not a Person, but a Force, created for good, but which may serve for evil. It is the instrument of Liberty or Free Will. They represent this Force, which presides over the physical generation, under the mythologic and horned form of the God PAN; thence came the he-goat of the Sabbat, brother of the Ancient Serpent, and the Light-bearer or Phosphor, of which the poets have made the false Lucifer of the legend.
And that's an important distinction to make. Again, Pike scoffed at the idea of a devil, thinking it a primitive man's way of explaining evil in the world. But if he professed Gnostic philosophies, that doesn't make him a fan of the character Lucifer.
Originally posted by The GUT
I should have said an affinity for the philosophies associated with Luciferianism.
Right, which is why I was alluding to this passage from Pike…
It further illustrates what we might call the yin-yang belief that "God" is an impersonal force comprising both good and evil, which we find over and over in various mystery philosophies.
~p 859
The ROYAL SECRET, of which you are Prince, if you are a true Adept, if knowledge seems to you advisable, and Philosophy is, for you, radiant with a divine beauty, is that which the Sohar terms The Mystery of the BALANCE. It is the Secret of the UNIVERSAL EQUILIBRIUM:--
--Of that Equilibrium in the Deity, between the Infinite Divine WISDOM and the Infinite Divine POWER, from which result the Stability of the Universe, the unchangeableness of the Divine Law, and the Principles of Truth, Justice, and Right which are a part of it; and the Supreme Obligation of the Divine Law upon all men, as superior to all other law, and forming a part of all the laws of men and nations.
--Of that Equilibrium also, between the Infinite Divine JUSTICE and the Infinite Divine MERCY, the result of which is the Infinite Divine EQUITY, and the Moral Harmony or Beauty of the Universe. By it the endurance of created and imperfect natures in the presence of a Perfect Deity is made possible; and for Him, also, as for us, to love is better than to hate, and Forgiveness is wiser than Revenge or Punishment.
--Of that Equilibrium between NECESSITY and LIBERTY, between the action of the DIVINE Omnipotence and the Free-will of man, by which vices and base actions, and ungenerous thoughts and words are crimes and wrongs, justly punished by the law of cause and consequence, though nothing in the Universe can happen or be done contrary to the will of God; and without which co-existence of Liberty and Necessity, of Free-will in the creature and Omnipotence in the Creator, there could be no religion, nor any law of right and wrong, or merit and demerit, nor any justice in human punishments or penal laws.
--Of that Equilibrium between Good and Evil, and Light and Darkness in the world, which assures us that all is the work of the Infinite Wisdom and of an Infinite Love; and that there is no rebellious demon of Evil, or Principle of Darkness co-existent and in eternal controversy with God, or the Principle of Light and of Good: by attaining to the knowledge of which equilibrium we can, through Faith, see that the existence of Evil, Sin, Suffering, and Sorrow in the world, is consistent with the Infinite Goodness as well as with the Infinite Wisdom of the Almighty.
Sympathy and Antipathy, Attraction and Repulsion, each a Force of nature, are contraries, in the souls of men and in the Universe of spheres and worlds; and from the action and opposition of each against the other, result Harmony, and that movement which is the Life of the Universe and the Soul alike. They are not antagonists of each other. The force that repels a Planet from the Sun is no more an evil force, than that which attracts the Planet toward the central Luminary; for each is created and exerted by the Deity, and the result is the harmonious movement of the obedient Planets in their elliptic orbits, and the mathematical accuracy and unvarying regularity of their movements.
Originally posted by The GUT
For the Initiates, this is not a Person, but a Force... They represent this Force, which presides over the physical generation, under the mythologic and horned form of the God PAN...
The key here is that the initiate, whether he believes in a literal being or not, recognizes the light-bearer as a force created for good, liberty, and freewill. Which is as Luciferian, at least philosophy-wise, as you can get.
It further illustrates what we might call the yin-yang belief that "God" is an impersonal force comprising both good and evil, which we find over and over in various mystery philosophies.
Originally posted by seeknoevil
Research is great , isn't it Gut?